Brexit dividing my family.

No one is going to “work together” to diminish or impoverish their lives. I’ll “respect” the result of the GE, but I know that in a few years time there is a chance to change it, and I will “respect” The right of the opposition to challenge the government and hold it to account.

Frankly I doubt the country will ever 'work together' again. Too many factions. No amount of 'working together' can paper over the gaping cracks created by Tory attempts to deal with issues within their party by subjecting us all to this.

I would rather live in cloud cuckoo land then in this country at the present time just tell me where it is.

Where there is hope there is a way, I just hope we find peace before its too late

Labour are not offering a leave deal. They are offering remainjng in SM and CU so we can't trade with anyone who does not trade with EU or remain and they are doing double stitch up by offrjng immigrants the vote too. No other EU country does this, so effectivelh allowing immigrants to decide future of UK. I"m backing Boris to get us out of EU on Jan 31st. Then country can heal. If immigrants decide our fate the ciuntry will remain duvided and bitter.

So people living here and paying taxes shouldn't get the vote? Ok

I do not believe that the EU will offer Corbyn, or anyone for that matter- a 'cake and eat it with unicorns' kind of deal. They can't, as it would weaken Europe and encourage others to do the same. But it is good that they should try- and then put it back to the People. Truly democratic. They got my vote- but I so wish I was voting for Starmer, rather than Corbyn.

I've voted for a Second Vote- the rest is all secondary. I certainly wish that Starmer will take over and lead to a Lib Dem and others coalition- to keep Tories out for a VERY VERY long time (forever would be best).

If people living here and paying taxes, apply for British Citizenship and are accepted, have a British Passport then and only then should they be able to vote in parliamentary elections/referenda.

The trouble is, jura, it would go out to the membership to vote for a new leader if ever Corbyn acknowledges that he is not the right man and sensible Starmer won't stand a chance.

Lol oh well I don't have a passport, I can't vote then?

Anyone who is a part of the political community, pays taxes and is therfore a stakeholder in their local area and the country as a whole should be able to vote.

While I very much appreciate the view that, should we have another referendum, EU nationals living here should be able to vote, but I think that Labour has made a mistake in proposing it. If we have another referendum the electorate should be the on the same terms same as for the 2016 ref. To propose anything else muddies the waters far too much.

MaizieD, very fair point, agreed

People who live here, but choose not to become citizens of the UK should not have a vote, the idea is ridiculous in my opinion. However, people who have chosen to become citizens most certainly should have a vote. Where else in the world would a country allow citizens of other countries, who have chosen not to become naturalised, to vote in their elections?

Agreed Maizie, clearly if there ever is a second referendum, the criteria to vote must remain the same, anything different would leave itself open to criticism of vote rigging by Parliament.

If immigrants decide our fate the country will remain duvided and bitter.

Replace immigrants with “old people”/“women”/whatever

This thought process is so beyond what I would have expected in the U.K. even just 5 years ago. Makes me sad.

People who live here, but choose not to become citizens of the UK ..

Thank you for agreeing with me earlier, maddyone, but on this point you seem to forget that EU nationals didn't have to become UK citizens to live here as of right. Any more than did UK nationals living in any other EU country have to become citizens of that country in order to live there as of right. Don't blame them for having the rug pulled from under their feet.

No, you’re right Maizie, I did know that, and obviously it’s not EU citizens fault that all of this has happened. However, it’s just my opinion obviously, but I do feel that anyone living here full time should naturalise in order to gain full citizens rights. I do know people from Europe who have done this, and it is what I would advise anyone to do who intends to live here permanently.

Exactly, I chose to take British nationality- because I arrived in UK before the EU - and had to to remain and work, etc. We 'had to get married' too - not because I was pregnant ... but that was the only way we could stay together.

Had I arrived after the EU, I probably would not have done so, as there would have been no need or incentive to do so - as rights, etc, were protected.

BTW in Switzerland, UK citizens who live here either have a short permit, a B permit or after 5 years, a C permit. C permit holders can vote in local elections, but not in Federal/national elections. The Maire of my Commune (Council) is NOT a Swiss citizen. He was born and bred in Belgium, has lived here for over 20 years- and was elected a Maire, but has chosen not to take Swiss nationality. Doing a great job too.

Incidentally, I do feel sorry for EU citizens who are bound up in this mess, and it’s clear that we still need many of them to live and work here. But as I said earlier, my advice to anyone caught up in all of this would be to take out British citizenship. Likewise for British citizens living permanently in the EU to take out citizenship of wherever they are living.

That’s the situation here too jura, EU citizens (and probably others not from the EU) can vote in local elections but not national elections, as I understand it.

Starblaze
lol oh well I don't have a passport, I can't vote then
I'm assuming you have a birth certificate? I think you'll find that this document trumps a passport when proving your British/ English citizenship.

EU citizens living in the UK are allowed to vote in local elections and EU parliament elections, their names are on the electoral register, so of course they should be allowed to vote in UK parliamentary elections and referenda.

No taxation without representation is a fundamental pillar of democracy.

Well that’s an extremely valid point Varian.

Oh, and we all know what you will have voted for. The most appalling candidate in our history to be PM... It's not as if it's a secret...
Why should I keep it a secret? I am voting Tory, I can't imagine anything worse than Corbyn et al getting into Government, it would be a complete economic disaster.

Have you ever thought of signing up for an elementary course in economics, Opal?

No, growstuff, have you ever thought of signing up for a "how to talk to people without coming across as a condescending old bat" class?