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Remainers might find these blogs interesting

(27 Posts)
MaizieD Sat 01-Feb-20 11:49:00

First, an analysis of the history of the relationships between the UK and 'Europe' (EEC to EU)

From the introduction:

Membership provided an answer to three fundamental questions about Britain’s role in the world, which reached a crisis in the years after 1945. First, how could Britain maintain its prosperity, as a declining industrial power that had lost its colonial markets? Second, how could it project power in the world, once it had lost its empire and its global military reach? Third, how could Britain preserve its sovereignty, in an increasingly globalised world? Put differently, how could Britain ‘take back control’, at a time when it seemed to be leaking sovereignty to the currency markets, to the International Monetary Fund, and to big trading blocs that were setting the rules of world trade?

To the conclusion:

...the big strategic questions have not gone away. What is Britain’s economic future, as a medium-sized economy in a world dominated by China and the United States? What is Britain’s diplomatic role, in a world without an empire? How can Britain maximise its sovereignty over its internal decision-making – which is not an unworthy ambition – in a world in which trade rules are set internationally, in which companies like Google and Facebook have larger GDPs than many countries, and in which issues like climate change render national borders irrelevant?

gladstonediaries.blogspot.com/2020/01/brexit-in-historical-perspective-age-of.html

And, Prof. Chris Grey's blog. I've been reading his blog on and off over the past 3 years.

An analysis of the referendum and the last few years but, just for once, with his personal feelings mentioned. I can't say I feel quite a strongly as he does, but this does touch a chord;

There has not been a single night since the Referendum that I have not woken mid-way through with a feeling of despair, nor a morning I have not woken without the dull, heavy ache of doing so to a world gone wrong. It is the only time in my life I have experienced political events as personal trauma, the worse for there being no prospect of their resolution.

chrisgreybrexitblog.blogspot.com/

( Professor of Organization Studies at Royal Holloway, University of London,)

M0nica Sat 01-Feb-20 12:02:31

I am brexited out. I bought the papers today but skipped all the brexit bits, I am only listening to Radio 3 and Classic FM. I am gardening and walking. It is such a lovely spring day - on 1 February.

Generally, where brexit is concerned my hands are over my ears (ad eyes) and I am singing lalalalalala.

Recovery from this state depends on how long it is headline news, but like H&M, I expect it will have disappeared off everyone's radar in a week or two.

MaizieD Sat 01-Feb-20 12:20:41

Well, thanks for coming on to tell me that, MOnica... hmm (I did realise that some people might not be bothered )

But I found the historical analysis, and its conclusion, particularly interesting.

M0nica Sat 01-Feb-20 12:24:39

It is not not being bothered it is currently a complete aversion to any mention of the word that refers to what has just happened . Give it a month and I will probably recover and be back to join the fray.

Alexa Sat 01-Feb-20 12:27:42

Thanks Maizie. My rather vague desire to belong to something bigger in order to be safe is here expressed succinctly and accurately.

I feel less safe now our dear old country is in the hands of idiots and multinationals. Thank goodness the young are getting bigger every day!

Greymar Sat 01-Feb-20 12:32:02

Yes Monica, I agree. I wonder if social media does anybody any good at all? The radio can be so nice.

Oldwoman70 Sat 01-Feb-20 12:32:32

I think it depends on the personal feelings of the person writing the blog. There was an interview on radio yesterday with a local university professor who specialises in the politics and trade of the EU. His feelings were that whilst there will be some difficult times ahead it is more than likely that UK will benefit from leaving the EU.

My feelings are that it is true things may be difficult for a time but that the final outcome will be somewhere between those who think everything will the wonderful and those who believe we are all doomed.

NotSpaghetti Sat 01-Feb-20 12:37:56

Thanks for the links MaizieD
Don't want a fight with anyone here but I am exhausted with the pain of it. Will read it later. Thank you though.

Summerlove Sat 01-Feb-20 12:39:28

My feelings are that it is true things may be difficult for a time but that the final outcome will be somewhere between those who think everything will the wonderful and those who believe we are all doomed.

So, basically, hard times just to get back to where the country was a few years ago? A middle ground?

All this fuss, to hope for the same

lemongrove Sat 01-Feb-20 12:42:00

Nobody ever wishes to ‘wait and see’ do they? They want instant answers/ benefits or whatever right this minute or else!😆
Yes, it’s social media, the worst culprit.
Having now left the EU am content to get on with life and see what happens.Concentrating on domestic items of news and policies.

quizqueen Sat 01-Feb-20 13:30:16

Alexa, you said you feel safer belonging to something bigger....don't make me laugh. Do you really think the EU would ever come to the aid of this country? During the Falkands War, they stood back and offered no help at all and the French sold exocet missiles to Argentina!

GillT57 Sat 01-Feb-20 13:34:56

It is interesting how so many who voted leave, and assured the rest of us that everything would be wonderful, that there would be countries queueing up to do trade deals/they need us more than we need them/Germany still want us to buy their BMW/Italy will still want to see us Prosecco....etc., etc., ad nauseum, are now telling us that we need to calm down, stop demanding to know what the advantages of leaving are, just trust that our lords and masters have our best interests at heart....just wait and see. Yeah right. I will never forgive those people who voted for this mess, and shall now spend my time checking that my ERG MP is able to tell me what the advantages will be, when I can expect a new hospital, 3 more GPs at my local surgery, more nurses.....

Dinahmo Sat 01-Feb-20 14:08:46

M0nica Didn't know that Hennes (aka H & M) had gone bankrupt!

Nezumi65 Sat 01-Feb-20 14:14:49

I found this quite touching this morning Maizie - went on his timeline looking for a laugh but I thought it rather poignant twitter.com/mrmichaelspicer/status/1223178591942242304?s=21

Alexa Sat 01-Feb-20 14:51:09

Quizqueen, besides being in a powerful trading bloc for dealing with the multinationals, I feel safer with European safeguards for the environment and animal welfare. I fear for our old high standards.

Labaik Sat 01-Feb-20 16:51:14

'Alexa, you said you feel safer belonging to something bigger....don't make me laugh. Do you really think the EU would ever come to the aid of this country? During the Falkands War, they stood back and offered no help at all and the French sold exocet missiles to Argentina!'
...did the EU have an army back then with which to help us? I had no idea.

M0nica Sat 01-Feb-20 17:45:22

They haven't. I was referring to those two people called Harry and Meg something grin

Barmeyoldbat Sat 01-Feb-20 18:17:30

No papers or news in this house today or probably for a few days. I am Brexit out.

hondagirl Sun 02-Feb-20 12:33:55

Well, the UK is now no longer a member of Europol and so won't automatically get Intel on criminals and terrorists, so yes maybe it's right to feel a little less safe.

MaizieD Sun 02-Feb-20 13:46:17

The EU didn't even exist at the time of the Falklands war. What has happened subsequently is that the now EU has consistently supported the UK's claim to sovereignty over the Falkland Islands. They will no longer do this.

Nor, it seems, do they intend to support the UK's claims over the 'ownership' of Gibraltar. They will now support Spain in any dispute the UK may have with them.

did the EU have an army back then with which to help us?

As we well know, the EU (which was then the EC) hadn't an 'army' then, and doesn't have one now. quizqueen's statement is completely spurious...

The UK could well feel very lonely in the future.

Greendress Sun 02-Feb-20 14:51:14

Not sure this is allowed - so please delete if not. Any interested remainers may want to check out the FB page : Grannies For Europe

Labaik Sun 02-Feb-20 15:14:12

Will do; thanks Greendress

Fennel Sun 02-Feb-20 16:04:04

I'm on the side of those who say "wait and see". We've never been in such a situation before now, and things worldwide are changing constantly. And so fast.
My main worry is that in this country we're in the hands of a 'leader' who I could never trust.
Maybe it would be better to have a coalition at this crucial stage, but that won't happen

growstuff Sun 02-Feb-20 16:33:36

Thanks greendress.

M0nica Sun 02-Feb-20 17:00:43

As someone said on R4 this lunchtime the UK is in danger of being stranded mid-Atlantic, a small country of 60 million people, trying to insist that two large power blocks with populations of 100s of million and economies many times the size of ours, do everything on our terms.

Who do they think they are kidding?