Sensible Discussion on Labour Leadership hopefuls MK 2

Yes, but Blair was seen as somewhat left of centre when he was first elected but as the years progressed he transformed the Parliamentary Labour party into a Tory Party mark two.

Those years will not be returning.

Grandad do you understand that in order to get elected you need the voters who supported Blair and even shock horror tory voters.
Now Blair was left wing to suit the arguement.

growstuff We may all need to update our views about the Right or Left Wing press. The Metro is now the largest circulation newspaper in the UK and doesn't support any party despite being part of the group that produces the 'Daily Mail'.

Since the circulation of most of the old newspaper brands, Left and Right, is declining, possibly to extinction, we should include other forms of media which might provide a different perception. It is very much a story still in spin, no pun intended ?

How sad, the hope of winning three consecutive general
elections will not be returning for the Labour Party

Cunco you’ve made an interesting point. I know the circulation of the printed press is declining but I’m interested in the role they still fulfil of agenda setting in terms of the stories they chose to publish and then secondly, how they choose to present those stories. Newspaper stories headline on the radio, TV and are linked to via FB and Twitter and other social media platforms.

I think the press thing is interesting, they certainly dont have they influence they did. Social media is complex as everyone is in their little grouping and are astounded when they realise people dont think in the way they do.

Social media is a real worry as far as 'informing the public is concerned. The print media is available for anyone to read (if they care to) and respond to. The use of targeted adverts on platforms such as facebook means that only a relative few people get 'information' which is designed to feed their biases and prejudices. No-one else is aware of the messages they are getting. This means that misinformation can be spread very fast and cannot be countered. I think that this is extremely anti-democratic.

I've been banging on about this for the last three years, but rarely is there any discussion about it.

I read yesterday that Rebecca Long Bailey has said she would be prepared to offer Jeremy Corbyn a place in her shadow cabinet and he has said he's be willing to serve in any capacity.

If this isn't pandering to the Corbynites I don't know what is!

I wonder if she's also willing to keep the 3 Ms (Milne, Murphy and McCluskey) close as well.

if Long Baily wins the leadership it will more of the same,
Corbyn, McDonald, McCluskey running the party.

Well said Galaxy. I sometimes wonder if Grandad wants an elected Labour government or a socialist talking shop.

I agree growstuff.
I am in Labour International (two and a half thousand members) and it was interesting to see how the voting for nominations went. In the first result Starmer was only ahead of Long Bailey by about 1% but when Nandy was eliminated and second preferences counted, he ended up 9% ahead.
If he picks up votes from Thornberry and Nandy supporters it should help.

Totally agree Anniebach.

Corbyn couldn't even land a glove on Theresa May, that's the problem, nobody is buying what this momentum backed mob is selling!

This leadership election will either free Labour from these goons or consign the party to the dustbin of history.

MaizieD I agree. I share your concern about the possible death of newspapers. We need to have reliable sources of information from genuine reporters. Inevitably, the opinion makers put their own spin on things but we need to see all the news in as greater accuaracy as possible.

Growstuff I don't think I would see Blair as a super forecaster, whatever that is. I suspect his opposition to an EU Referendum before 2015 was because he didn't want a question asked which might receive, for him, the wrong answer. Such a position would only have taken a reading of opinion polls rather than great foresight. I suspect that was also a significant reason why he did did not have a Referendum on the EU Constitution which he promised in 2004/5. As well as Gordon Brown's opposition, it would also have been a deterrent to Blair calling an earlier Referendum on the Single Currency. In the end, they settled for the compromise that the Labour Party agreed in principle with joining the Single Currency but only when the time is right. It never was.

My heart sank a little though yesterday when I read that Corbyn wasn’t ruling out accepting (was subtly positioning himself to secure) a shadow cabinet role after the new leader was appointed.

What Labour Most resolutely does not need is The Ghost of Elections past stalking the front bench as it moves on from the disaster of the Corbyn years!

Mind you ‘Minister for Allotments’ perhaps?

Urmstongran unless the Labour Party accepts they need votes from across the country and reaches out to ‘middle England ‘ they will not win an election .

And free the party from Corbyn & Co , but Corbyn has waited a lifetime to have a far left party, ignoring the failures
in the past when the far left tried to run the party , he isn’t
going to give up.

Cunco I was being sarcastic. That bloke Cummings appointed (who resigned pronto) was allegedly a "super forecaster".

All that happened was that a journalist asked Jeremy Corbyn if he would be willing to serve on the front bench under the new leader, he replied that he was willing to serve in any capacity.
This has been, as usual, blown up out of all proportion.

Can I please ask Urnstongran and Anniebach what policies they would like to see put forward by any new leader?

PS. Thank you Cunco for the info about the Metro. To be honest, I hadn't even realised it had moved beyond London and the South East. It's one of the few printed newspapers I ever read because there are always loads of them hanging around in train carriages. It was a clever idea.

I agree with you Ilovecheese. No reason for the Corbyn haters to be worried. But it makes for a good headline - "Corbyn to stay in new shadow cabinet" (or whatever).

It seems to me that both Urm. and annie want RLB do they can carry on chuntering and criticising Labour. The last thing either want is an effective functioning Labour opposition under KS. Which is in fact what we will get.

Grandad

'Just to add to my post above POGS, I think that the rumours of Kier Starmer having Edd Miliband in his shadow cabinet should he be elected as leader may have been "put about" by the mischief-making supporters of those opposing him.'
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Well it has been a quite a clean contest but of course Lisa Nandy had the accusation made by Momentum over the her voting record concerning Maternity Leave but they weirdly omitted to say she didn' t vote in favour because she was on Maternity Leave. Hmm

Keir Starmer had The Labour Party formally reporting members of his leadership campaign team to the Information Commissioner, accusing them of hacking into the party's membership database. If I have a grasp of the situation Rebecca Long Bailey/Momentum Labour Party did very similar. Hmm

As Lisa Nandy said quietly at one of the televised debates when the candidates were talking about how unity and being nice to each other in public was important Lisa Nandy said "in private as well". She knew she had been targeted by Momentum who are firmly behind Rebecca Long Bailey. .

No, I’m for Keir Starmer sooziewoozie. He will have (I think) the most appeal to the wider electorate. Mind you, when he gets up on his hind legs he can bore for England.

Whether his ‘forensic’ intelligence can challenge Boris soundly at the dispatch box remains to be seen. Personally, I think not but he’s the best of a bad bunch in my opinion.

KS will buy and sell BJ in attention to detail and mastery of his brief.

Ilovecheese Fri 21-Feb-20 13:48:54

'All that happened was that a journalist asked Jeremy Corbyn if he would be willing to serve on the front bench under the new leader, he replied that he was willing to serve in any capacity.

This has been, as usual, blown up out of all proportion'
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growstuff Fri 21-Feb-20 13:57:56

'I agree with you Ilovecheese. No reason for the Corbyn haters to be worried. But it makes for a good headline - "Corbyn to stay in new shadow cabinet" (or whatever)'
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A). The request was for ' Sensible Discussion'.

Using terms such as ' CORBYN HATERS ' against posters who hold a different opinion only serves to try and belittle because to debate/discuss is too difficult for them to engage in so personal insults are their only weapon.

B) It is certainly the case that Corbyn has been put into the frame when it comes to certain Labour Leadership candidates naming him or saying they would be pleased to have them in their Cabinet should they be selected.

So no it is not a right wing rag ' blowing' anything up out of proportion, it comes from the Labour Candidates themselves.

They want to stay in...

...The wilderness.