George Floyd Protests in Hyde Park

With the actions of those involved in the Westminster violence having brought the whole demonstration into disrepute, we now witness diversionary posts by some who supported that rally in this thread.

It's no longer about George Floyd, it is about many other issues totally unrelated to the murder of that person.

Anyway, I have work to do, so will rejoin the thread again later if it is still live.

I agree with Grandad's comments regarding the defacing of Churchill's monument, whilst it is only a statue, it's what it represents. Churchill lead this country against one of the most evil regimes of the 20th century, The Nazis who certainly treated other races of the non Aryan variety as a sub species.

Whilst I understand the desire to remove the Colston statue in Bristol, I'm also agreeing with EllanVallan regarding child exploitation and slavery today. The past is gone, it should be remembered and children should be educated in what happened, but it can never be changed what is appalling that throughout the world, including our own country, there are still so many enslaved people who have no control over their lives, trafficked, used and abused. That isn't spoken about enough imo.

Although I'm not concerned over a bloomin' statue, it should have remained as a reminder that slavery is still alive !

I think time will tell that this had been a mainly pointless exercise. I doubt any black lives will be improved by it. Those businesses in America that were looted included black businesses.

By some accounts the lives of black people in America have been improving. Admissions to Harvard have been rising year on year. Black employment has been improving also.

“Foreign workers exploited in the farming industry ? Hours on end picking fruit and veg in all weathers, for what ?? “

EV
That is a ludicrous statement. Migrant workers come to the U.K. willingly to harvest your food, they work flexible hours to satisfy your demand for food on the shelf 24/7. The work is no harder than nurses or care workers would do and the wages are similar. They are paid for every hour they work and are free to return to their home country whenever they want.

I know it’s Monday morning but that is no excuse for posting rubbish

Yes some migrant workers come willingly, but others have been exploited by gang masters, have been forced to live in sub standard accommodation and then forfeit substantial amounts of their earnings to live in very poor living quarters.

Davidhs, it's the conditions that they're housed in. There was once a programme about the accommodation they'd been given-------for all their hard work, a caravan for about a dozen people all cramped inside it.
How can anyone be expected to work under such conditions day after day.?

By the time the programme ended I was both furious and also upset that they were being used in this way. I hate and detest exploitation and this country is probably the worst offender of this insidious practice.

But it's not " rubbish " Davidhs ! Open your eyes !

Aren’t the gangmasters using illegal immigrants though, a bit different to EU workers coming here to pick fruit and veg.

Many migrant workers come to the UK to harvest fruit and veg because they have no work in their own country and can earn enough to send money home to their families.

The latest 'Pick for Britain' advert annoys us because although field work is strenuous, it gives out the message that it's dirty and soul destroying and you'd be some kind of hero to do it.

It's also made to look even more grim by being in black and white.

Field workers have the same rights as in any other industry. Portable toilets, health and safety regulations and regular breaks and meal times.

Check your facts first, EV

It's true that there are some migrant workers and exploitative gangmasters.

But I don't think it's true to say that this practice is endorsed by the government in any way (not openly, at least).

There's nothing" different " in treating people like this, illegal or otherwise, Lemongrove, it's wrong !

Of course it’s wrong EV ( gangmasters) but I was pointing out just as Davidhs has done, that EU workers aren’t slaves, they come here to pick the fruit and veg and obviously think it’s worth doing.Since we have been in the EU ( or rather their countries have) they have the choice in doing that, or to settle here and work in other jobs.

It happens in South Wales a lot, particularly in the construction industry.

It involves Romanians a lot. A gang of cheap labour will always win a contract. It's dog eat dog.

And who fuels the demand? The consumer, that's who. That's us, ladies and gents.

No doubt it will have to be hauled out of the river now at great cost to the council/citizens of Bristol.

If Bristol council have any sense they'll leave Colston in his watery grave (unless he's a danger to shipping). What would be the rationale for hauling out a highly contentious and not particularly important statue?

I have just watched the Mayor of Bristol on BBC news, it is the councils intention to retrieve the statue and put it into a museum.

Slavery was/is wrong, we all know that, but it happened. Rather than obliterate anything from the past that does not meet the standards we have in the year 2020, they should serve as a reminder that these atrocities should never be repeated.

If you support the pulling down of the Colston Statue, the desecration of war memorials, Winston Churchills statue and the failed attempt to burn the Union Flag if those who are responsible are not charged, where does this lead? Will the next target be the libraries, the art galleries or museums? However ugly the worlds heritage maybe, it happened.

I started this thread as I was concerned that just as the "R" rate was coming down in the most of the UK (I do know that there are pockets in South West and North East), that these protests were going to be detrimental to all the sacrifices that each of us have made, the NHS and frontline workers, the shop keepers and their staff, the bin men, Police etc. That it would mean extending the time before we can hug our AC and GC, travel abroad to visit our overseas AC and GC.

These protesters have not given a thought that they are instrumental in spreading Covid-19, taking it home to their families, more deaths, more admissions to hospital, putting our NHS in a position whereby scheduled operations are cancelled, people are dying of cancer, heart attacks and other illnessess.

I strongly support free speech and peaceful protest, but this is not the time for mass gatherings, find another way.

Colston has joined the hundreds of thousands of African people dumped overboard at the time of their death on the hell ships..

Poetic justice

That will be up to the Bristol Council MaizieD but I will be surprised if they decided to leave it there.
If they did, I can imagine a future tv show where divers excitedly find it, and ponder on why it was there.?

The ugly face of racism

Posted before I read your comments GG13.....

If more black people here and in other countries die from Covid I wonder if their families will think all the jostling thousands on the protests were worth it.
In normal times the protests are valid, in these times, no they really are not.

Yikes! That image sets off my trypophobia!

I have spent 20 years working in safeguarding of children Ellan but I am not the one ordering who should protest about what.

gg13

I agree it is not the time for mass gatherings, but you are being naive to think that atrocities such as the one we saw in the USA and those experienced by black folk throughout the world including the U.K. would not cause a reaction.

Ben Okri talks today how I can’t breathe has echoed around the world causing a reaction in almost every country including those countries from where we tore families apart by forcing so many into slavery.

“*I can’t breathe* equates racism with the deprivation of air, which has always been the case, but this simply phase is a new language that describes with fundamental clarity what happens to a human being when they are demonised, excluded,deprived, oppressed and killed”

Perhaps this should be the new code to the deadly and subtle form of racism that we see on GN and in everyday life should be

I can’t breathe

EV
Again rubbish, the Gangmasters regulations make sure the housing is to a reasonable standard and they are subject to the same wage regulations as everyone else. They have to achieve the minimum wage per hour or they cannot work, deductions are made for housing, again that is regulated.

A typical U.K. worker would be much worse off because housing costs would be much higher.

It’s illegal migrants are treated badly and very few will be on farms, there is no regulation in any other industry. Employers value migrant workers because it’s the only way that crops are going to get harvested. A very good friend of mine employs 4 Rumanian workers, they have a large caravan and a bungalow rent free and use of a car for shopping etc. All they are interested in is working as many hours as possible at around £10 an hour which they send home. Many businesses employ migrants, treat them well because the businesses would not exist without them.

You allegations are very wide of reality.