Today's Commons debate

It will affect the good Friday agreement because the whole thing was based on there not being any form of border of any sort at all between the two Irelands.

You’d think that wouldn’t you? But talk to anybody living in Belfast and ask about the walls and separation that still exists together with the tension just below the surface.

Don’t forget the Good Friday Agreement is another international agreement and one in which as well as two of our previous prime ministers the USA had a huge amount if involvement in.

They are not taking it kindly, and it is a bi-partisan issue in America, so all representatives will be very cross at us breaking yet one more international agreement.

Quite honestly Hong Kong can now forget any help we may have given as a result if our previous reputation of upholders of the rule of law.

That reputation is now well and truly shot.

ug look at customs borders throughout the world.

Of course the EU will pay for their border, but we will pay for ours.

The U.K. will have just the same borders in Ireland as we will have at all our ports, and airports.

Customs officers lost their lives in Ireland as the posts were constantly under threat from being blown up etc, and don’t forget the atrocities that occurred on the mainland prior to the GFA.

I understand your point WW and I don’t have the intelligence to solve the conundrum of the Irish question. However I really think (for what it’s worth) my post above could still stand? Time will tell how this will play out. The Irish citizens need huge assurances that this is a (soft) border from the EU for trade reasons only. The lightest of touches really, using today’s technologies. Years have passed, people’s attitudes have softened and changed - they are enjoying their freedoms and technology got a whole lot more impressive in the meantime.

Reassurances would be needed but with goodwill on both sides, benefits are possible without a resurgence of religious terrorism. Most people want a quiet life, enjoying their families and lifestyle choices. If the activists and agitators can be silenced by the repeated good words and intentions of the many politicians, hopefully peace will prevail.

But don’t you understand that brexit was all about borders?!

How could you vote for something you couldn’t understand?

You haven’t addressed the issue if our breaking international law either. These things matter, and our future reputation is at stake.

It is no good hoping that peace will prevail, we all do, but you must be hard headed about these things and understand Irish history and current situation.

Realistically what on earth can we do about Hong Kong except issue threats which China will obviously ignore knowing that we are powerless, and making us look extremely foolish! I don't think sending a warship would have much effect these days!! I'm amazed the treaty with China has lasted for so long! A friend in the Amiralty gave it five years! 23 is astonishing for China!

Jaberwok

Realistically what on earth can we do about Hong Kong except issue threats which China will obviously ignore knowing that we are powerless, and making us look extremely foolish! I don't think sending a warship would have much effect these days!! I'm amazed the treaty with China has lasted for so long! A friend in the Amiralty gave it five years! 23 is astonishing for China!

Nothing - because we have forfeited Our reputation.

Realistically what on earth can we do about Hong Kong except issue threats which China will obviously ignore knowing that we are powerless, and making us look extremely foolish!

Had we still been in the EU we might, with its backing, just have been able to put a bit more weight behind whatever we had to say..

I'm glad you recognise that we are now powerless, because that's the way it's going to be, anywhere in the world, from now on.

How could you vote for something you couldn’t understand?

Wrong WW I voted to get out from under EU rule. Corrupt. Profligate. Brussels & Strasbourg - translators gravy train. Too big. Fiscal Rules bent (Greece) to allow membership.

Not immigrants. Not blue passports.

So yes, borders would become a necessity. But that wasn’t my problem to solve. That’s what the negotiations were for going forward.

I still think a deal will be struck. They’re all still talking - even though it’s gotten a bit febrile as we come up to the 11th hour.

MaizieD like some others, you’re not happy unless you’re annoyed or defeatist about the UK. Hopefully you’ll find your optimism next January.

For heaven's sake, what on earth could.or would the EU have been able to do over Hong Kong!!? Offer support?!. Wow that would certainly have terrified China into compliance!! send a stern note? (keep your nose out of China's business just might have been the reply!). Oh I know threaten military action with that EU army that doesn't exist!!!????. Get real!!

quizqueen

Even if the government was doing the best job in the world, the Lefties on here, who are in the majority, would find something to complain about but they never wanted Britain to be a sovereign independent country, who is capable of making its own decisions. They are happy to be vassal slaves of the EU and pay them a sh*tload of money every year to squander as they please.

I'm pleased to find that, as a Leftie, I'm in a majority because over the years people have said that as one gets older one becomes more conservative. Supposedly, because one reaches a certain stage in life - home owner, good pension (not me in this case, still working at 73), I should be thinking of myself first and protecting what I have.

I voted to leave for precisely the same reasons Urm! Isn't it a pity that all these clever(?!!) folk on here have to be so flipping patronising?! No wonder others don't join in any more, there's a limit to how much anyone can stand this sort of lofty sneery I know better than you attitude!

Trade, Jabberwok. It's trade that makes the world go round. That's where the real action is taken. Trade sanctions from one of the world's biggest markets have influence.

Gunboats are so 19th century..

But, we no longer have gunboats or trade muscle.

And you really think that the EU would have risked a trade war over Hong Kong!!?? They seem very quiet about the persecuted muslims, as does most of the world particularly muslim countries!! Not a murmur about land grabbing in the South China sea, and yet, if we we're still in the EU, they would be fiercely defending Hong Kong on our behalf?!!!! Forgive my cynicism, I don't think so!!!

You are only in the majority on the Conservative bashing pages of GN Dinahmo so don’t get too excited.?

Urmstongran

I understand your point WW and I don’t have the intelligence to solve the conundrum of the Irish question. However I really think (for what it’s worth) my post above could still stand? Time will tell how this will play out. The Irish citizens need huge assurances that this is a (soft) border from the EU for trade reasons only. The lightest of touches really, using today’s technologies. Years have passed, people’s attitudes have softened and changed - they are enjoying their freedoms and technology got a whole lot more impressive in the meantime.

Reassurances would be needed but with goodwill on both sides, benefits are possible without a resurgence of religious terrorism. Most people want a quiet life, enjoying their families and lifestyle choices. If the activists and agitators can be silenced by the repeated good words and intentions of the many politicians, hopefully peace will prevail.

Really excellent post Urmstongran ??

Yet another law officer has resigned because he can not reconcile what the government is doing to the rule of law.

Thanks lemongrove ?
Usually I’m shot down on these threads and exhorted to leave these discussions to the grown ups.

The Tories are gradually being hollowed out by every decent proper Tory who are resigning because of the governments behaviour.

I have absolutely no doubt that decent Tory supporters are doing exactly the same and turning their backs on this immoral, incompetent political party.

There doesnt seem to be many of these sort of decent supporters on GN

I’m decent.
?

Nothing decent about anyone who condones the breaking of the rule of law.

Whitewavemark2

Yet another law officer has resigned because he can not reconcile what the government is doing to the rule of law.

Is this Keen, Wwmk2?

Yes, there is. In this case, as an insurance policy because the EU have definitely not been negotiating in good faith. They will now and we won’t need the insurance.

Agree with your last post Urmstongran

How can anyone condemn the EU as corrupt and yet support Boris and his cronies? Or are only 'foreigners' corrupt?