Boris' 'oven ready' deal becomes 'No Deal'

It's not final of course. What Boris says on Friday has proved so often to be not what Boris says on Monday.

The thing is, it's not really up to the EU to make a compromise, because the EU can just shrug off the departure of Britain. It will make a dent in the EU economy, to be sure, but not a fraction of the dent it will make in Britain's economy. Boris is entirely driven by his deep-seated need to leave a heroic impression on history, and he doesn't want to be remembered for an economic disaster. A last-minute deal will be found and Boris will smirk all over our TV screens, claiming credit for victory.

LadyHonoriaDedlock

It's not final of course. What Boris says on Friday has proved so often to be not what Boris says on Monday.

The thing is, it's not really up to the EU to make a compromise, because the EU can just shrug off the departure of Britain. It will make a dent in the EU economy, to be sure, but not a fraction of the dent it will make in Britain's economy. Boris is entirely driven by his deep-seated need to leave a heroic impression on history, and he doesn't want to be remembered for an economic disaster. A last-minute deal will be found and Boris will smirk all over our TV screens, claiming credit for victory.

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Trisher. What makes you think there won’t be any foreign travel? I had lived in four different countries before 1973. I had travelled to many more. My grandparents owned a holiday home in Nice. Being members of the eu just meant we could wander freely around Europe, now we may need a visa, big deal.
Why would we have to accept cheap food from the USA? We ate well before and it would do us no harm to start to use locally farmed, grown, produced foods as we always did. Our living standards will not plummet although they may change.
The brightest and the best will not leave the country, many of them are in favour of an independent UK.
We are champions of human rights, there is no reason to suspect that that will change and as far as access to the justice system being expensive, have you ever tried to sue a builder who has ruined your house, without incurring enormous costs with no guarantee of getting your money back because his assets are protected by being a ltd company.

Freedom of movement involves so much more than easy holidaying. Do you realise that, LauraNorder?

MPs recently voted against maintaining our food standards. Are you aware of that?

Were you aware that the Johnson government wanted to 'revise' our Human Rights Act? Not to improve it...
And, of course, the Home Secretary is bent on removing rights from asylum seekers (presumably they're not human.. )

Nothing this government does, or apparently plans to do, backs up your assertions.

Thank you for your comments MaizieD I would expect nothing less.
I was answering Trisher who mentioned foreign holidays.
To revise does not mean to ‘downgrade‘, it means to alter or amend. Whether human rights or food standards they may be different, may or may not be better but not worse as you have assumed.
Please don’t imply that I am unaware. I hold differing opinions to yours.

I have worked in other countries before 1973, my grandfather imported and exported to and from many countries including those in Europe, my father worked abroad all of his working life. We don’t have to be joined at the hip to travel or to trade freely. We just need fair and open cooperation between countries.

Whether human rights or food standards they may be different, may or may not be better but not worse as you have assumed.

How do you know they will not be worse.

One of the favourite phrases used by the brexit brigade was “a bonfire of regulations” that doesn’t suggest to me a high standard, quite the reverse.

Maybe a ‘bonfire of regulations’ would be a good thing. At lunchtime I watched a cookery programme on BBC2. Think one of the Hairy Bikers, not sure.

Anyway, there was a segment in the programme about a gentleman who has continued the small familybusiness started by his grandfather, breeding and slaughtering Aylesbury ducks. He said that owing to EU rules these ducks cannot be sold (once killed) further than 20 miles from his farm. He said that this rule meant very few people got to taste a genuine Aylesbury duck. The local gastro pub was one such beneficiary however.

Rules such as these seem daft.

Whilst EU members there was nothing to stop us having higher welfare Or food standards in the U.K. what we couldn’t do was have lower standards. So passing the agriculture bill only meant one thing - freedom to allow lower standards.

Greta

^Whether human rights or food standards they may be different, may or may not be better but not worse as you have assumed. ^

How do you know they will not be worse.

Equally how do you know they won’t be better.

He said that owing to EU rules these ducks cannot be sold (once killed) further than 20 miles from his farm. He said that this rule meant very few people got to taste a genuine Aylesbury duck.

You know what, Ug? I don't believe that for one moment.
Did he say exactly what rule he was citing?

Equally how do you know they won’t be better.

We know they won't be better because the government is desperate for a trade deal with the USA and the USA have stated that they want us to accept their food standards. Which are far lower than ours. What is more, they want to prevent us from allowing food to be labelled with its country of origin. So that we can't know whether what we are eating is their rubbish or our food produced to higher standards.

That is what happens when you are the smaller and weaker partner in a trade deal. The other side gets to call the shots.

LauraNorder if only we could go back to the 1970s you might be right. Unfortunately we are in the 21st century. Air travel (before Covid) has multiplied, we are taking ourselves out of the EU air travel agreements. We currently have agreement with US, Albania, Georgia, Iceland, Israel, Kosovo, Montenegro, Morocco and Switzerland while the negotiations with Canada are at an advanced stage. so travel unless we negotiate quickly will be limited. You can read about the problems here www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/future-relationship-aviation
Many universities, hospitals and laboratories will lose their funding and the brightest will follow the money. The Arts will be underfunded watch the credits on TV and films you will see the EU sign at the end of most of the things that are not made in the US. People will leave.
As for cheap food we will need US cheap food because we cannot supply enough home grown and we won't be able to afford EU prices. We are on a downward spiral.
I really don't understand why you would consider it a reason to support less access to the justice system if you have already experienced problems, it isn't going to improve you know. It will only get worse. Although actually suing someone for money is one of the areas where you can actually take action your self without using legal representation. It can be done even aginst large companies www.gov.uk/make-court-claim-for-money

I don’t quite know why it’s assumed I know nothing.
I am handling my own court case, I was merely pointing out that costs are beyond the reach of most in spite of the EU.
I am also aware of the changes to aviation, research and pharma but am optimistic that these areas will be sorted in good time.
I know I’ll be slated for optimism but I prefer to live life with belief in the capability of my fellow Brits than with total negativity and putting my country down as useless and incapable.

Lauranorder but we could have had higher standards inside the EU - many of our environmental standards remain below the EU standards, so why are assuming that leaving the EU means higher standards.? we weren’t prevented from having higher standards in the EU - it’s well documented USA has lower standards and Johnson wants us to import products from there which are not allowed by EU - as it’s standards are lower - can you defend that?

LauraNorder

I don’t quite know why it’s assumed I know nothing.
I am handling my own court case, I was merely pointing out that costs are beyond the reach of most in spite of the EU.
I am also aware of the changes to aviation, research and pharma but am optimistic that these areas will be sorted in good time.
I know I’ll be slated for optimism but I prefer to live life with belief in the capability of my fellow Brits than with total negativity and putting my country down as useless and incapable.

I hope you are right.

I hope many of us are wrong.

I really do.

I just can’t see a way that that will be the case

You know what, Ug? I don't believe that for one moment.
Did he say exactly what rule he was citing?

I watched it as well. Because the ducks are slaughtered and prepared at the farm, thereby ensuring they do not have the stress of being transported to a slaughterhouse, EU legislation demands they can only be sold within a 20 mile radius.

Farmed white duck is often sold described as 'Aylesbury Duck' but the farm featured in the Hairy Bikers' programme is the only one in the UK that produces the original breed.

The only way anybody who lives further than 20 miles away can buy a pure bred Aylesbury duck is to drive there and buy it as a farm gate sale.

So the duck I buy from my farmer which is in Somerset and slaughtered there travels over 100 miles to me is illegal?

I simply don t understand What is being said?

WW Not unless it is being sold as a particular breed of duck that is only produced on that farm.

I see that the U.K. s economy has been down graded to Aa3. This is the third downgrade since the Tories took office.

They inherited an economy that was graded as high as possible from Labour

The rating was Aaa.

The Aylesbury duck farmer bought stock from various blood lines (also in Aylesbury) when other farmers were getting out of poultry production. This was to ensure there would be no inbreeding as he would be the only producer left.

The legislation is ridiculous.

Are you still in Spain Urmstongran, enjoying the benefits the EU gives you? Have you informed the authorities how long you have been there for fiscal reasons or are you still under the radar like so many Brits?

Of course we were told that the U.K. holds all the cards, that it will be the easiest deal in history and we will have our cake and eat it.

Are the Tories proud of the lies and incompetence?

merlotgran

The Aylesbury duck farmer bought stock from various blood lines (also in Aylesbury) when other farmers were getting out of poultry production. This was to ensure there would be no inbreeding as he would be the only producer left.

The legislation is ridiculous.

But why can I buy ducks from my farmer who lives over 100 miles away?