The Conservatives have claimed Good Friday

I had a friend, a priest, ran the youth club my daughters were members of, some years after he moved to another parish he was arrested for abuse of young boys, I was shocked..

A girl i was in school with, she was so disliked, angry, spiteful, really bad tempered. After we had left school, the news broke,
the priest in our village was out for a walk , heard the girl shouting and swearing, he went into the house, she was being sexually abused by her father, had been so from a small child, she was too ashamed to tell anyone, her father threw himself under a train when on the run.

I was so distressed , all that spiteful behaviour ,she was so disliked, how she was suffering all those years.

That's terribly sad Annie, poor girl. I wonder what happened to her.

Child abuse leaves a lasting impression on the survivors wherever it happens, home or institution. It does seem it is worse in organisations that are supposedly “caring” but I guess the lifelong damage is the same. It is a problem in society.

It's a life sentence. The memory never goes away and regardless of how well you do and how happy your life is, it's a cloud on the horizon that never totally goes away.

The victim is surely damaged but I do think being abused by a
parent must leave different scars, everyone you know has a father, you see friends with their fathers, you have brothers , sisters who were not harmed , what did I do wrong .

So I will disagree with all on this, and I do know someone who was abused in the North Wales abuse scandal.

I totally agree Annie as it would be if the abuser were any family member but yes, your own father would be worse.

Being abused by a trusted adult seems to mean in most cases an inability or real difficulty in forming relationships afterwards as trust has been destroyed. I don’t know enough to ‘rank’ abuse in terms of which is worse and I guess there are many other factors that play a part. I don’t think it’s possible to know which is worse or appropriate to try and discuss that. What matters is that society and the various institutions within it do their very best to safeguard children and put their welfare before the reputation of the institution or the the abusers. There’s a long way to go in protecting our children imo

This is part of the interim report of the Child Sex Inquiry which desks with long term effects of child sex abuse.

www.iicsa.org.uk/publications/inquiry/interim/nature-effects-child-sexual-abuse/effects-child-sexual-abuse

Again, I am speaking of a father, I did love my father very much and perhaps this clouds the discussion for me, i am not playing down abuse by others, several boys abused in the North Wales child abuse scandal took their lives some years later. If you want to read of a cover up, read of that , it was horrific .

Abuse within families is a very big problem and often hidden. My daughter was a child protective worker for a while and she could tell you it cuts across all levels of society, rich and poor. I hate to think of some of these children during lockdown, unable to get any freedom from their abusers. A bit of a digression from the original post I know.

It does seem that many hypocrites - those that do the exact opposite of their proclaimed intentions - find a place for that hypocrisy within organised religions and organised sects. I wonder if the law is used properly and whether we should be looking at something like an "costed" for these groups. It certainly appears that they cannot police themselves.

"Ofsted" not costed

As said in the link from suziewoozie sadly some abused become abusers

They do Annie but we have the resources within support safeguarding - probably not enough but they are there. Why are we not using this to go into organisations such as Scouts/Guides, churches/sects and clubs such as sports clubs. These are all places were there have been issues in the past, and it looks as if it could do with strengthening in schools too.

Hiding in plain sight comes to mind. You see someone in a position of trust and responsibility and that's what you see; what you expect to see and not necessarily what's there.

I remember when our boys were young, having the conversation about not talking too or going with strangers, trying to press home the message without frightening them.

Our youngest piped up with 'you mean like the child catcher in Chitty Chitty Bang Bang' so I explained that yes, in a way only they don't look like the child catcher, they look like every one else.

They are also organisations where many people want to do what they see is a "good" thing. Generally we expect others to behave as we do. These people only have to fit in with our outward idea of "good people". We, especially those who have had fairly kind lives, are not programmed to be suspicious of others to the extent that would be needed. Just think how many times neighbours say "but they/he/she seemed so ordinary". That's why people coming in from outside, prepared to be suspicious, can help.

There are specially designated safeguarders in my church and also the other churches attached to our ministry.
It is also possible to do an on-line course through the church on everything covering abuse. I have done it myself and have done level 1 2 and three. It is something useful to have as experience. It is the same course that S.S. use.
All schools must by law have designated head of Pastoral
Care and they will have at least two trained people in Child Abuse and if you go on school websites you can see who they are. It may come under Welfare but there is more to it than that.

I try not to be suspicious of people but often I try to read a situation (for want of a better way of explaining things) and though I know many families are good and happy sometimes little clues give something away. I do not spend my time always thinking people are abusers it is just good to have some awareness.

Myself and Mr. S. had to obtain safe guarding certification when we became members of our PCC 3nanny. Never having been on a PCC before, we didn't know it was a requirement and we have also been made aware at how much work is going on 'behind the scenes' to do as much as possible to keep everyone safe.

I agree that awareness is the key. Knowing what to look out for, what the 'give away' signs can be, rather than being suspicious.

My safe guarding certificates are in a file on my computer although I can print them off if I want to. I am not on any committee or anything but just like to have the experience of having the course work.
I get a bit angry sometimes when people on certain threads bring up the subject of the historical abuse within the church (often they will point to the Catholic church) and to the priests. It happened so their is no argument there but for the last two years there has been much done behind the scenes
within the church to make amends and apologize for the behaviour of those involved and to try to somehow make sure as many victims of that abuse can talk to people within the church to know they will be believed and listened to as often in the past they were not.

For all those victims there is still a long way to go.

If not for our involvement we'd have been unaware of the procedures that are now in place and all the work that is being done behind the scenes 3nanny.

Too late of course for the victims of the past but hopefully enough to prevent any victims in the future.

I still think you need an outsider view on a regular basis. Don't you think abusers can take and pass the course too? It's good that churches, etc., have taken the past on board but a balance cannot do any harm.

PippaZ Yes an outsiders view on a regular basis would be a good thing. The courses run through my church were offered
online and run by two designated safe-guarding professionals,
and yes certainly an abuser could apply for the course as I did not have to give much detail.
The certificates could be used to show to possible new job
employers however to even be working in that area amongst
vulnerable children an employer would require references,
a full police clearance check which would detail a lot. It is very unlikely that an abuser would find their way in to a school or church setting etc;
Do you remember some years ago that man Ian Huntley?
he even managed to get a caretakers job in a school. I think he even had one conviction on his record.
These days I think they have tightened up full police checks to make sure these kind of people do not get jobs around children.

It's good of course that lessons are learned but tragic that a case like the one that involved Huntley have to happen, in order to bring to light that the procedures already in place are woefully inadequate.

PippaZ

Unfortunately, there is very little one can say these days without upsetting someone. If that were anyone's criteria for commenting on Gransnet then we wouldn't have many conversations would we.

As for having the last word - I would love for my comments to appear underneath those I am responding to. It is the Gransnet setup that makes them appear at the end.

As for having the last word - I would love for my comments to appear underneath those I am responding to. It is the Gransnet setup that makes them appear at the end.

As you can do nothing about the Gnet set up you have to do a workaround.
Which is either to use the 'quote' function, which reproduces the whole of the post you are replying to, as well as your answer, or, do what I've done here; copy the pertinent passage from the post you're replying to, paste it at the the top of your answer and format it to distinguish it from your actual answer. Then everyone knows what you're talking about.