They don’t help themselves do they?

Elegran

Damned if they do, damned if they don't. What a useful thread - it could have been used to criticise the decision whichever way it went, and whether it was made by Harry or Andrew, by the RF, or by the military establishment. A gift to everyone wishing to stir it!

No one has to contribute to any thread they don’t want and certainly not just to be do disparaging. In terms of the uselessness of threads there many contenders. There’s no need to be so witheringly personal

It has been reported that Prince William and Prince Harry will walk "shoulder to shoulder" behind the coffin. There is a bit of irony here because that is in itself a military term. So if the one is in uniform, and the other in a suit, the juxtaposition is going to be even more pronounced.

Just to say, that although there’s a lot of moaning/criticism of the stuffiness and tedium of protocol, it exists so that there is no need for decisions that are then open to controversy or accusations of personal pettiness.

Peasblossom

Just to say, that although there’s a lot of moaning/criticism of the stuffiness and tedium of protocol, it exists so that there is no need for decisions that are then open to controversy or accusations of personal pettiness.

But that’s not true is it? There are examples of protocol driven decisions that have been subject to controversy and criticism. There were some around Diana’s death such as lowering a flag. It’s healthy in a democracy (?) to be free to criticise anything and a sign of maturity when the shortcomings of some protocols are challenged and even changed.

If it is true that PH won’t be wearing a uniform because of protocol then I find it a touch sad that someone who fought for his country and did so much for injured soldiers has been denied that choice.

eazybee

*What is bugging me is Bloody Boris claiming that he was invited but stood down to make space for a family member. I'm sure that is yet another of his barefaced lies. I would think that the RF must be deeply relieved that covid regs made it impossible to invite him*...

You have evidence for this?

He tweeted it.

As Johnson considers no-one except himself I can't see him making any sort of generous gesture. If the funeral is 'private' the family is under no obligation to invite him. It would be different if it were a State funeral.

I think Johnson is just making it up.

I am sure many war veterans will be appalled at the “protocol”

Johnson is an idiot, everything he says is largely garbage.

Damned if they do, damned if they don't. What a useful thread - it could have been used to criticise the decision whichever way it went, and whether it was made by Harry or Andrew, by the RF, or by the military establishment. A gift to everyone wishing to stir it!

This x 1000. Well said Elegran.

Do you know many war veterans, Whitwwavemark? Or is just that you assume they must agree with you?

Peasblossom

Do you know many war veterans, Whitwwavemark? Or is just that you assume they must agree with you?

Are you asking that question because you agree with my statement?

EllanVannin

Does it matter what they wear so long as they're there ? It wouldn't matter to me if I was their mother.

Exactly. What business is it of ours?

As someone pointed out, both Harry and Andrew have been stripped of their military appointments, so they are no longer entitled to wear a military uniform. They are entitled to wear their medals. I should think that, on the day, nothing will be further from their minds than that.

The funeral's not private. Its ceremonial.

Its only small because of COVID. If it wasn't for Covid Johnson, Starmer... all of them would be there.

Where I come from, people don't get "invited" to funerals, you go to show your respect. Although I guess it is different in this circumstance.

Chewbacca

^Damned if they do, damned if they don't. What a useful thread - it could have been used to^ criticise the decision whichever way it went, and whether it was made by Harry or Andrew, by the RF, or by the military establishment. A gift to everyone wishing to stir it!

This x 1000. Well said Elegran.

Goodness me - when I think of the number of useless threads about the RF I do have to admire your chutzpah ?

And you suziewoozie post on every one

Anniebach

And you suziewoozie post on every one

And? I post on lots of useless threads - of course that does depend on ones definition of useless - inconsequential might be a more pertinent term. What’s wrong with that?

when I think of the number of useless threads about the RF I do have to admire your chutzpah

I wouldn't know soozy; I don't post on the usual RF threads but this particular thread caught my eye because it's so extremely ill informed, ill timed and very crass.

suziewoozie

Elegran

Damned if they do, damned if they don't. What a useful thread - it could have been used to criticise the decision whichever way it went, and whether it was made by Harry or Andrew, by the RF, or by the military establishment. A gift to everyone wishing to stir it!

No one has to contribute to any thread they don’t want and certainly not just to be do disparaging. In terms of the uselessness of threads there many contenders. There’s no need to be so witheringly personal

Not useless at all, very useful, It is a catch-all concept. a chance to criticise someone whichever line you take, whether because the RF is humiliating them by refusing to allow them to wear uniform (without anyone knowing or asking whether they wanted to) or that they shouldn't be wearing wanting to wear uniform, or that the protocol should be waived for a couple of princes (but not for anyone else or it ceases to be the protocol) or that there shouldn't be that protocol anyway.

Why criticise at all? A family funeral, ceremonial or not, is a chance for everyone not directly involved to just shut up and let them bury their dead in peace. If you could ask the principal character at this event (Prince Philip, the staight-talking ex-naval officer, who said what he thought) he would have a pungent reply.

I hate to see people in military uniform, so I hope they don’t wear it.

"Crass" is bringing one's undisguised aversion to certain minor aristocrats into EVERY thread that mentions the word "Royal".

I swear, if we had one about Royal icing.....

Whitewavemark2

Peasblossom

Do you know many war veterans, Whitwwavemark? Or is just that you assume they must agree with you?

Are you asking that question because you agree with my statement?

I only know a few.

It’s just I’m always faintly amused when anybody says things like “most people” ‘It’s widely accepted’ or ‘I am sure many” when what they actually mean is “This is my opinion.”

So do you know many war veterans?

At the risk of repeating myself I think much royal protocol ( and some other protocol) is utter bunkum and elitist rubbish.

It could be looked at as symbolic of how siblings can discard their differences in common family mourning when two brothers walk shoulder to shoulder at their grandfather's funeral, one in uniform, one in civvies, bringing back memories of walking side by side at their mother's funeral. Their paths have diverged, but they still have a lot in common.

Peasblossom

Whitewavemark2

Peasblossom

Do you know many war veterans, Whitwwavemark? Or is just that you assume they must agree with you?

Are you asking that question because you agree with my statement?

I only know a few.

It’s just I’m always faintly amused when anybody says things like “most people” ‘It’s widely accepted’ or ‘I am sure many” when what they actually mean is “This is my opinion.”

So do you know many war veterans?

Oh I see. ? I would have thought it was obvious that it was my opinion. But if you wish to be pedantic -

In my opinion many war veterans especially those who either served with PH or have been helped by him through various charities, will be saddened by the fact that it appears to be protocol prevents him from wearing his uniform. Of course we don’t actually know the truth, so it is all speculation, he may have chosen not to wear a uniform, but given his apparent support of his charities before he was prevented from doing so I would be surprised if a suit was his first choice

Is that OK?

Do you think that anyone who has once been in the armed forces should be entitled to wear the uniform and insignia of rank for ever, then? Even after failing the introductory basic traing and leaving completely to have no connection whatsoever to any unit or service to the rest of their days?

That could lead to some confusion and/or deception from scam artists.