The Irish Question revisited

It would tidy things up admirably if they could be persuaded to join up with the RoI. Sorted.

It wouldn’t for the Republic of Ireland either - they want neither the political hassle nor the expense.

So true Greyduster.

Alioop

theworriedwell you come over here anytime and I'll make you an Ulster Fry. I'll get ingredients for it at my local butcher's so there's no problems

That sounds tempting. I grew up in England, when any of the family went home they came back with a suitcase of ingredients for an Ulster Fry.

My gran had a B&B in Bangor, when she came to England she was bemused that her counterparts advertised they did a full English, she didn't think that was something to advertise. She had some very funny sayings and was a real character but I do fancy a proper Ulster fry.

Anniel

Well I voted to leave and am perfectly in charge of my faculties. It is obvious that this country divided over the issue of leaving. Most of the metropolitan elite and well educated and have good jobs or own homes in the EU voted to remain. They will never stop trying to get the UK back into the EU. The latest scramble by Andrew Mitchell et al over overseas aid was one example and the border issues now over NI see the EU caring more about their petty rules than the Good Friday agreement. Few of you seem to notice that EU members bend rules all the time.Some borders with countries outside the Union are quite porous and if you stroll around markets in France you will see the rules broken over cooked and raw meat all the time. If I was Boris I would show Macron we mean business by immediately stopping pâté de fois gras and other meats cruelly killed from coming to UK. The EU exports more goods to us than we do to them and imagine if we stopped importing French wines and German cars, they would suffer. I do agree that NI is a knotty problem but there are means and ways if the EU would not be so sclerotic. I hope Scotland takes note that if they leave the Union then their exports into England would suffer and once the Barnett formula finance stops, then they will be very poor. Sorry to go on but obviously some of you take every opportunity to criticise Conservative government but you should understand that Gransnet is a broad church. I am a proud member of the Conservative party!

If both sides in an agreement decide to change the rules then that is fair enough. If one side signs up to an agreement and then decides to ignore the rules it is something else.

In simple numbers they might export more to us than we do to them but as a percentage it is the other way round so will have more of an impact on us.

It does not matter who exports more to whom, it a matter of principle, 26 EU nations agreed on those principles they were never going to change them

The world's Press and TV, and cartoonists, are having a field day. I have not yet one single positive comment about Johnson, not one, anywhere.

And now all the posturing about the NI Protocol. It is cringe-worthingly embarrassing. Who does he think he is. And is doing Great Britain such a disservice - and the whole country is being tarred with the same brush. So so sad, and so dangerous for the future of the UK.

But keep waving the flag, 'believe' and be positive- that will do the trick, I am sure.

“Johnson keeps saying he will use Article 16 to suspend the Northern Ireland Protocol, but you can’t suspend it until it has failed, and it has not been put into operation as yet. In other words, he’s talking nonsense.”

S u r p r i s e

As Kali2 says "It is cringe-worthingly embarrassing. Who does he think he is? And is doing Great Britain such a disservice - and the whole country is being tarred with the same brush. So so sad, and so dangerous for the future of the UK."

I first became aware of Boris Johnson when he appeared at the closing ceremony of the 2008 Olympics in Beijing. My horrified reaction to the pathetic London bus followed by some clown (who I later discovered was mayor of London) was "cringe worthingly embarrassing"

OK the London Olympics were a success, thanks to many many people whose names we don't know, but one cringe worthingly embarrassing person cashed in on that success and went on through more and more bouts of lying, getting away with it, demonstrating contempt for the truth and getting away with it and demonstrating utter contempt for the British people and getting away with it thanks to the power of the foreign billionaires and tax dodgers who own the right wing press.

The dreadful, awful Julia Hartley Brewer says 'I hold my hands up- it was a price worth paying for'

about throwing NI under a bus to get their hard Brexit. What a delight she is !!!

Varian I certainly was not a stupid voter who knows nothing. I hold an MSc (Econ) from the London School Of Economics so I have got envious qualifications. Many of you are very pretentious and I am looking for a answer that tells me why the EU objects to us sending goods to another part of our country?

If anyone has suggested that you are " a stupid voter who knows nothing" Anneil ,it wasn't me.

Biden couldn't bring his own dog to heel, much less Johnson. I'd think you'd all be sick of US presidents butting in.

happycatholicwife1

Biden couldn't bring his own dog to heel, much less Johnson. I'd think you'd all be sick of US presidents butting in.

I think that you will find that whilst Biden will have expressed the Whitehouse’s opinion on the Irish issue, he will leave it at that. There will be no micro-management.

Johnson is free to row his own boat, dragging the rest of us down with him.

As you have got such envious qualifications Anniel I am sure you understand the intricacies of the treaty that was negotiated and signed by our own dear leader and it’s impact on NI. It’s linked to the fact that NI has a British border with an EU country. Both sides of this border have to be treated the same, especially since this border has been of historic dispute, this was agreed by the peace process. Hence NI remains in the single market, Goods transported to the single market from a region outside the single market have to reach a certain standards, which are subject to checks and declarations. As the U.K. does not wish to be bound by these standards ( they wish to see lower standards in food quality and animal welfare in order to trade with the US) - this was the choice and decision of the U.K , or rather it’s corrupt government, hence the problems, which everyone except this government and its negotiators could foresee. Hope you understand this very basic explanation.

Anniel

Varian I certainly was not a stupid voter who knows nothing. I hold an MSc (Econ) from the London School Of Economics so I have got envious qualifications. Many of you are very pretentious and I am looking for a answer that tells me why the EU objects to us sending goods to another part of our country?

Because we signed an agreement with them and they (perhaps foolishly) expected us to stick to the agreement.

If you think the agreement was foolish then maybe ask Johnson why he signed it.

and I see little chance of Keir Starmer winning the next election

I agree with you Anniel. In fact I’d go so far as to say the next Labour PM hasn’t been born yet.

Great posts btw!

Anniel: ” I am looking for a answer that tells me why the EU objects to us sending goods to another part of our country?”

Well, they didn't object when we were members of the EU. But we have left and other rules apply. We can't have our cake and eat it. Boris Johnson signed a deal that he must have known would damage the people in Northern Ireland. Now he wants to unsign it. Is it your honest opinion then that this is the fault of the EU?

”...some of you take every opportunity to criticise Conservative government ”

Shall we ban all opposition, shall we stop holding our Government to account, shall we just swallow their lies?

Well I think the EU forgot the small matter of best endeavours. If the EU does not apply that, it is responsible for preventing the agreement from working.

It is the right of any sovereign country to walk away from a treaty/agreement, at any time. That is not breaking international law. It is common sense

Things got a tad heated yesterday according to reports. Johnson is still trying to hold out against pressure from the rest of the G7 over Ireland.

The former well respected and knowledgable British ambassador to Washington and the EU said that “the lesson to be taken away from this week is that you cannot have a global Britain which is genuinely respected and influential and impactful around the world if people doubt your basic Bono fides”

“The world will doubt very much that there will be any point in signing treaties and Atlantic Charters etc, which depend on mutual trust, mutual confidence and the rule of law, when you are operating with a bunch of chancers”

Best endeavour is absolute nonsense, when you negotitate and sign knowing absolutely and totally full well that you have no intention of adhering to the contract. This is not a minor issue that has suddenly popped up out of the blue. The Deal was negotiated and signed with fingers crossed behind the back, with no intention whatsoever of respecting it.

Of course the UK can walk away now if they wish. And then what?

Can you imagine the consequences of fall-out- and the massive restrictions and tarifs put on goods and services both ways. With businesses leaving in droves as the UK can no longer access parts, and export freely. And perhaps even more importanty, the damage to our reputation, to our honour? The EU, and the world in general is watching this mess and most of them would not trust Johnson and team in a month fo blue moon Sundays.

Do you still believe 'we hold all the card' and that we just have to 'believe and be positive'.

If you do, that is truly staggering.

Do you still believe 'we hold all the card' and that we just have to 'believe and be positive'.

If you do, that is truly staggering.

You should be well past being staggered at anything that a Leaver believes these days, KAli2

Oh I know, I know - but I always hope, somehow.

So which is it

a) does not understand what a binding contract that you signed up to, means?

b) or knew all along exactly what would happen, and also knew they would not adhere the contract and blame the other side?

Other way, it leaves us all in a massive pile of mess, with massive and damning consequences for now and the future of this Great country.

When you think of it, - in the 10 years the Tories have been in office, we have gone from a respected country whose word was always it’s bond, to a pariah state who cannot be either trusted or respected.

One poor misjudgement by Johnson (amongst many) was that he assumed quite wrongly that he can have a good bi-lateral relationship with say Germany whilst mucking the EU around.

Can’t happen. Merle made that clear when she refused to bump elbows with Johnson.

Johnson has “haemorrhaged and squandered trust” Johnson signed up to a charter which amongst other things said that the U.K. will keep to the rule of law, sustain international law and norms of standards. Two days later Johnson was threatening to walk away from an international deal he enthusiastically supported only a year or so ago.