A winter of very expensive heating and little food?

MaizieD

^Anybody got a decent recipe for nettle soup and stewed chicken bones which doesn't require any fuel to cook? Maybe somebody can remember how to rub two sticks together?^

Hay boxes, growstuff

www.woodland-ways.co.uk/blog/outdoor-cooking/making-and-using-a-hay-box-to-cook-in/

I remember them demonstrating hay boxes on TV back in the 70s when we had all the power cuts. I didn't try it but I can remember toasting bread by the fire when we had no power so I could have something warm.

Elvis58

Alegrias1.
So much anger and political venom towards people who do not agree with your views is tedious to say the least!

Yep, me getting annoyed with the people who are in the process of ruining this country is the worst thing on the thread. I should stick to insulting disadvantaged people who are going to suffer as a result of this incompetent government.

At least I won't be tedious.

PippaZ

This is not aimed at you Saetana but to all those who think they can tell people how to manage on a budget lower than they have to live on.

Unless you are walking in those shoes it is insulting.

Very true. I always feel insulted by the turn the heating off and wear a cardi brigade. My DH is disabled, he feels the cold as he can't move around and the cold makes his pain worse so no I'm not turning the heating off.

Maudi

20:35PippaZ

Maudi

I'm pleased there is no one to kill the turkey, veggie Christmas for me and my family. I'm sure no one will starve, it might do some people good to lose a few pounds and think twice about what they are eating.

You are really being very insulting to many people. Don't you realise that?

Faux outrage on your part me thinks. ?

Egregious lack of empathy. Or misguided attempt to be provocative. Not sure which.

Saetana

Okay firstly the energy/carbon dioxide issue is NOT directly related to either the EU or Brexit. Worldwide gas prices have gone sky high as a result of the massive lull due to covid and countries all firing up again together all at once. We need this gas to produce carbon dioxide - which is used for so many things from operations, to slaughterhouses, to producing any kind of carbonated drink...I could go on.

Us personally in the UK have both the sky high price issue and a reduced capacity for storing gas - not to mention over reliance on other countries for a large part of our gas supply. We need to sort out this issue for the future - nobody really fancies fracking but we need to become more energy secure in our own right rather than relying on dubious allies to help us out.

As I understand it, the government is going to let the small energy companies go bankrupt if necessary (whilst protecting the supply of their customers and moving them to another provider) and will likely provide government backed loans for the largest companies in order to get them to take on the customers from the bankrupt firms. We do not need 70 different gas/electricity providers - apparently by the end of the current issues we will likely be down to low double figures.

Finally, our wind turbines in the UK have not been producing much wind this year - one of the quietest summers for wind in a long time, apparently. This just proves the idiocy of relying too much on wind power.

I am no climate change denier but we need to accept the fact that it is now too late to stop it happening - we should have taken action long ago. In my opinion we should now be looking towards mitigation of each country's individual risks (for example increased flood defences in the UK). This does not mean we shouldn't carry on with sensible measures such as recycling and reducing pollution - particularly air and plastic pollution - however anyone who thinks we can solve this problem by becoming "carbon neutral" is kidding themselves.

Good post ????

Thanks for your reply worriedwell ?
The shortages seem to be regional in nature, and obviously where you live is at the far end of the scale.
M&S chocolate is wonderful ( I can’t have it unfortunately.)
My DD ( with a size 10 figure is a chocaholic and would be in a murderous mood if she couldn't buy any.?

Must say, that if I couldn't buy a turkey for Christmas dinner I would be secretly relieved.

MaizieD

^Anybody got a decent recipe for nettle soup and stewed chicken bones which doesn't require any fuel to cook? Maybe somebody can remember how to rub two sticks together?^

Hay boxes, growstuff

www.woodland-ways.co.uk/blog/outdoor-cooking/making-and-using-a-hay-box-to-cook-in/

Excellent! Thank you! I'll just have to scavenge a few bins and get friendly with a local farmer.

lemongrove

Thanks for your reply worriedwell ?
The shortages seem to be regional in nature, and obviously where you live is at the far end of the scale.
M&S chocolate is wonderful ( I can’t have it unfortunately.)
My DD ( with a size 10 figure is a chocaholic and would be in a murderous mood if she couldn't buy any.?

Maybe it will be our turn for a big delivery this week. I know locally the shortage of HGV drivers is causing problems with deliveries and bin collections.

One positive is we are within walking distance of several farms, I don't normally go to the farm shops as I find them expensive, rip of the tourists again I suppose, but if needs must.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Yes, we found farm shops were useful during the first lockdown when certain things were hard to find in the shops, but you pay premium prices for them.

Saetana

Okay firstly the energy/carbon dioxide issue is NOT directly related to either the EU or Brexit. Worldwide gas prices have gone sky high as a result of the massive lull due to covid and countries all firing up again together all at once. We need this gas to produce carbon dioxide - which is used for so many things from operations, to slaughterhouses, to producing any kind of carbonated drink...I could go on.

Us personally in the UK have both the sky high price issue and a reduced capacity for storing gas - not to mention over reliance on other countries for a large part of our gas supply. We need to sort out this issue for the future - nobody really fancies fracking but we need to become more energy secure in our own right rather than relying on dubious allies to help us out.

As I understand it, the government is going to let the small energy companies go bankrupt if necessary (whilst protecting the supply of their customers and moving them to another provider) and will likely provide government backed loans for the largest companies in order to get them to take on the customers from the bankrupt firms. We do not need 70 different gas/electricity providers - apparently by the end of the current issues we will likely be down to low double figures.

Finally, our wind turbines in the UK have not been producing much wind this year - one of the quietest summers for wind in a long time, apparently. This just proves the idiocy of relying too much on wind power.

I am no climate change denier but we need to accept the fact that it is now too late to stop it happening - we should have taken action long ago. In my opinion we should now be looking towards mitigation of each country's individual risks (for example increased flood defences in the UK). This does not mean we shouldn't carry on with sensible measures such as recycling and reducing pollution - particularly air and plastic pollution - however anyone who thinks we can solve this problem by becoming "carbon neutral" is kidding themselves.

None of that Saetana stops the fact that this government allowed small, possibly undercapitalised companies to be set up while maintaining a price cap. Unless these companies could have found a way to insure against price rises - and would you bet on that horse - this was bound to happen - if the government didn't prepare for it.

Equally, on the food front, they appear to have done little or nothing about the food crisis that was bound to happen when we left the EU - if the government did not prepare for it.

Equally, on the worker front, the crisis was bound to happen when we left the EU - if the government did not prepare for it.

Equally, the lack of pickers and the consequential rotting of food in the fields or ploughing it in was bound to happen - if the government did not prepare for it.

This is the picture we have seen so many times with this "Never Ready" administration. That is what they are supposed to do - run the country. But they have spent all the time they have running towards the next election campaign led by their "Never Ready" Prime Minister.

frankly if some of the people on benefits actually made the effort to get up in the morning in order to go to work there would be no shortage of pickers.

It's so dispiriting that people still think this way

JenniferEccles

Oh goody! I’ve found today’s ‘we’re all doomed’ thread.

Keep your eyes peeled folks. There’ll be another one tomorrow!

Are you volunteering to pay the increase in my gas bill?

You seem to be implying it's not real - unfortunately, it would appear that it is.

Jillybird I can't see why your arthritis should stop you. You'd just be paid less for your work.

This site will work out what benefits/grants someone may be entitled to, the amounts and how to claim them. No names need to be entered, just the figures around income etc.

www.turn2us.org.uk/

Thank you DiamondLily, that site looks excellent

The recommended temperature for the elderly is no lower than 21c.

If you have to lower/turn off your heating because of your inability to pay then you are in fuel poverty.

Clearly there are quite a few on GN that are in this position.

That is wrong.

Labour shortages are obviously to do with Brexit so to deny that is another head in the sand tactic, saying people on benefits, who may live in Wales, NI etc can go and pick tomatoes in Kent is unlikely to be a successful policy. Did Brexit lovers really object to seasonal workers coming from Europe? Was that such a threat?
The energy market in the U.K. is privatised and companies compete with each other to make profits for their shareholders , this is directly a result of government policies. So don’t pretend it’s the same everywhere else. Johnson promised a reduction of gas prices when not in the EU as he would remove VAT - has this been mentioned ? Or another lie? That would reduce energy prices or at least keep them stable in a period of price rises. Despite the sovereignty we claim to have gained due to Brexit we are reliant on other countries for our energy supply. We are not self sufficient - we can’t be little England and go back to the 1950s despite what Brexit cult followers want.

Another question - why is there a CO2 shortage in the U.K. and not in the EU?

Why did Johnson claim he would scrap VAT on fuel prices and he hasn’t done so? Another promise he has made no effort to fulfil.

growstuff have you tried using a wholesaler? It does mean forking out a bit more up front though, but tends to be cheaper overall. I use these www.harvestfinefoods.co.uk/
Its being mooted that CO2 may be unavailable to stun animals prior to slaughter, so they may be culled and buried. Excuse my ignorance but ‘slaughtered’ or ‘culled’, it’s meat, so I don’t understand why, either way the animals are killed, they can’t enter the food chain?

What are our energy prices the highest in Europe? Privatisation has given the green light to companies to rip us off.

vegansrock

Another question - why is there a CO2 shortage in the U.K. and not in the EU?

Did I hear correctly yesterday that production of CO2 in the UK is in the hands of only two companies and because of the high cost of gas it wasn't viable for them to continue?

Seems extraordinary - unless I'm imagining that!

Far too much gloom and doom about food shortages, it only pre packed food that is going to be affected by CO2 shortages.
Ironically because less can be pre packed prices of fresh and. frozen food are likely to fall, crops and animals are growing and will be processed mostly as usual.
As for turkeys farmers have reduced the numbers they are keeping already because of labour shortage for processing, I’m planning to have pork, so no worries there.