Look at Me

I cant imagine what that family is going through, and I feel as if everyone is using the case for their own ends ( whitewave under no circumstances do I mean you) so it's used by those who want to highlight the issues facing women (and I am one of those who do that) it's used by those who want to address issues in the police force, its even being used by the anti covid groups. I just feel it almost adds to the burden of the family but then again I dont want it to happen to another family so we need to talk about it.

I cannot imagine what Sarah's family will have to live through for the rest of their lives - it is horrendous.

While I agree with you completely that women, well everyone really, should feel and be safe, I am not sure how we achieve that.

There will always be people with aberrant personalities who will do horrendous things given the opportunity.

I wish there was an answer.

One thing I can predict is that Couzens will have an horrendous time in prison.

Such a same a life taken away by someone whom we are supposed to trust.
I have been stalked twice, my first husband lay in wait for him and gave him a going over (yes it was some years ago) and the second time by a paedophile (it was well know in the market town) and my now husband dealt with him in the market place on a busy Saturday day time. Both have left their mark. I only go out at night if I am with my husband or I can drive to a place, park, walk in and I can see my car and the area around, reverse to go home. I won't walk the dogs in the dark, am checking my surroundings in daylight taking care to cross and re-cross roads, have been on self defence courses but a woman stands no chance against 1 or 2 men.
I am not a wallflower and can stand my ground but it can happen and it isn't nice.
That poor girl and her family.

I do not think we should under estimate the threat to young men on the streets, look at the horrendous rate of stabbngs in certain ethnic groups in places like London. So many of those killed are not gang members, they are innocent young men, victims of mistaken identity or just in the wrong place at the wrong time. I worried far more about my son than my daughter out after dark when they were teenagers.

I have never felt unsafe walking out at night, although, living in a village now, the opportunities for that are few, but I have lived in big towns and cities and yes, there were a couple of dodgy events. The precautions I took were those I would expect anyone to take regardless of gender. At night I avoided narrow unlit paths, wa;lking in very quiet place. Muggers after a watch, wallet, phone or keys to an expensive car are not gender selective.

Tragic cases like that of Sarah Everard's and Sabina Nessa's, murder/abduction by someone unknown to them is very rare, in the same way that it is rare for a child to be grabbed off the street by someone they do not know.

Where women and children are most at risk is within the their own domestic and social circle and it is violence there that should be the main focus of everyone's attention.

I do not dismiss the horror of these random rapes and murders. The very fact that they are not day to day events enhances their awfulness, when they do happen, but it is coming down hard on routine domestic and social circle violence and abuse that is the way to reduce male/female violence at every level.

The murderer of Sarah Everard had a history of minor sexually based offences. If this behaviour had been taken seriously and dealt with, would the tragedy that was her murder have occurred?

Just for once let’s concentrate on the issue under discussion half of the total population being threatened raped, suffer violence, killed by almost entirely by the other half if the population.

Men’s violence in men should be put aside.

Only just over 1% of rapes were prosecuted last year

Do you have the source for this shocking statistic, please?

Men’s violence should be put aside.

I agree with the sentiment but remember, we are closely related to some very violent apes. That's where, in evolutionary terms, male violence stems from. Well, not directly, but through human genetic make-up. Males needed to be violent in the past just to survive. That need is decreasing massively and hopefully will continue to do so. My sources, as usual, are ourworldindata.org and humanprogress.org

We certainly need to do more to keep dangerous men under control but it's not as smple as "putting aside".

I read it on the BBC site which “fact checked” Starmers speech.

98.4% of rapes charges are not prosecuted.

He should know.

Baggs

^Men’s violence should be put aside.^

I agree with the sentiment but remember, we are closely related to some very violent apes. That's where, in evolutionary terms, male violence stems from. Well, not directly, but through human genetic make-up. Males needed to be violent in the past just to survive. That need is decreasing massively and hopefully will continue to do so. My sources, as usual, are ourworldindata.org and humanprogress.org

We certainly need to do more to keep dangerous men under control but it's not as smple as "putting aside".

Hmmm! questionable theory

Sarah, Sabina, plenty of coverage, Julia James, nothing., why? All killed going about their daily lives. Cannot ever imagine what those families are going through, but I also grieve for those men, and boys also taken too soon. Through all my life I have never felt afraid going anywhere, nowadays men, and women, seem to think violence is acceptable, their anger uncontrollable, I feel for my young granddaughters and grandsons, what a world they have to deal with.

I do not see how you can address one without taking into consideration the other. Men who use violence or kill other men, are highly likely to be men who terrorise and abuse women.

Whitewavemark2

Just for once let’s concentrate on the issue under discussion half of the total population being threatened raped, suffer violence, killed by almost entirely by the other half if the population.

Men’s violence in men should be put aside.

I think it is highly emotive, and unfair, to suggest that half the population is in danger of being threatened, raped, suffer violence or be killed by the other half.

As I said above, some of the population act aberrantly but not all and women are equally capable of bad behaviour. Most people are decent.

I don't know what the answer is, maybe there isn't one, but I think it is wrong to damn 50% of the population for the awful behaviour of just some of them.

Your statement that women are equally capable of bad behaviour is not true in terms of any statistics with regard to violent sexual crime. I am not sure why people do this. Women are more likely to shoplift than men (by a small percentage but it's still true) I dont feel under attack as a woman if someone says that.

M0nica

I do not see how you can address one without taking into consideration the other. Men who use violence or kill other men, are highly likely to be men who terrorise and abuse women.

Do you have evidence for that?

The point is that the topic under discussion is the continued violence towards 50% of the population carried out almost exclusively by the other half and which in apparent cases of rape they are almost 100% likely to get away with it.

All men do not walk the streets or anywhere for that matter, office, nightclub, home in fear.

I would say that almost 100% of women have at some time in their lives done so and I would further say that very few of us would walk in a park at night or in an isolated area.

It is violence against women at issue.

kittylester

Whitewavemark2

Just for once let’s concentrate on the issue under discussion half of the total population being threatened raped, suffer violence, killed by almost entirely by the other half if the population.

Men’s violence in men should be put aside.

I think it is highly emotive, and unfair, to suggest that half the population is in danger of being threatened, raped, suffer violence or be killed by the other half.

As I said above, some of the population act aberrantly but not all and women are equally capable of bad behaviour. Most people are decent.

I don't know what the answer is, maybe there isn't one, but I think it is wrong to damn 50% of the population for the awful behaviour of just some of them.

No kitty women are not equably capable of such behaviour. There isn’t a single statistic that you can point to that upholds this suggestion.

We are not damning 50% of the population, but when are men going to take responsibility?

Monica : I agree with you and we should not underestimate
the threat to young men on the street the amount of stabbings and even shootings in London and surrounding areas is horrendous. The drugs business and huge money involved is
where the violence arises but you are correct too many young men are just in the wrong place at the wrong time and families lose their loved ones.

I now sadly admit I am more fearful and feel unsafe to walk the streets once it is dark, I make a point of walking the dogs before it becomes too dark and do not like the dark winter nights. I would still go out in a group or with my son but I would not put myself in a position of being alone.

I see more and more cases of abductions/murders happening now and it is by no means rare it is becoming more common place. It is not only women but children and most of them are grabbed off the street by people they do not know.

The horror of the Sarah Everard murder has recently been revealed and that man is not even human in my eyes what he subjected that young woman to was horrific and he did not even need to be tried in court they should have put him in an underground dungeon to rot which is no more than he deserves. Sometimes there are people who can do these horrific crimes the fact he was a serving police man makes it 100 times worse.

Whitewavemark2

We are not damning 50% of the population, but when are men going to take responsibility?

What do you suggest men do?

I have a husband and four sons, along with many male friends and relatives what responsibility do you want them to take Whitewavemark2 ?

I think it is totally wrong to hold all men to account for the actions of a few.

He's got a whole life sentence. Good.

I have been on the receiving end of violent crime that took place on a hospital ward.

I never really feel safe and am always aware of my surroundings, I take every possible precaution but it’s very hard to ever trust or totally relax after such an incident.

^ think it is highly emotive, and unfair, to suggest that half the population is in danger of being threatened, raped, suffer violence or be killed by the other half^

Me too kittylester.
Hyperbole at its worst.

I can’t stop thinking of how poor Sarah must have felt once Couzens had carried on driving, past the police station ... once she realised her fate, handcuffed in a car for a further 80 miles.

Whitewavemark2

Baggs

Men’s violence should be put aside.

I agree with the sentiment but remember, we are closely related to some very violent apes. That's where, in evolutionary terms, male violence stems from. Well, not directly, but through human genetic make-up. Males needed to be violent in the past just to survive. That need is decreasing massively and hopefully will continue to do so. My sources, as usual, are ourworldindata.org and humanprogress.org

We certainly need to do more to keep dangerous men under control but it's not as smple as "putting aside".

Hmmm! questionable theory

Not according to Animal Behaviour specialists.