Stand off drowning migrants and report – or face prosecution, sailors warned

Alegrias1

Just a quick comment about Facebook.

This morning my Facebook page is filled with pictures of Maine Coon cats and information about from my local wool shop. And a post from a friend who has just had a nice life changing event.

If your Facebook is full of people ranting about foreigners, its because these are the sort of people you know. Or your Facebook friends associate with them. Or you have interacted with a posting that supported that kind of thing.

There are infinitely more radical and ranting people on GN than I have ever seen on Facebook, and here, you can't unfriend them.

My Facebook account was never about people ranting about asylum seekers, but I have found that some people are quite unkind on Facebook. My husband’s American cousin who admires Trump for example. People who unfriend you because you went on holiday, and other stupid things. I can’t be doing with it as I joined in order to remain in touch with ex colleagues and family who don’t live locally. Facebook is also full of adverts which I got fed up of seeing. And so I deleted my account, it is a nasty place.

I don’t feel that I should have to justify deleting my account because others think I was friends with a lot of people who hate asylum seekers. I wasn’t, and I didn’t.

My FB is a big mixture- friends and relatives from UK and all over the world, far and wide. Nature, wildlife and gardening groups.

And pro EU groups and lots of young people, friends, relatives and ex 6th Formers who have kept in touch - and who are disgusted by what is happening in the UK now, their future seriously put at risk, and the xenophobia and anti- immigrant (all of them ... irrespective of status or origin...) sick rhetoric.

As for easy solutions - what did some of you expect the French police to do- shoot the dinghies, shoot ...what?

''The people who think the solution is to make crossings harder and more dangerous are the same sort of people who thought we could solve the drug problem by denying addicts clean needles.'' (a great comment on FB today.)

maddyone

I don’t feel that I should have to justify deleting my account because others think I was friends with a lot of people who hate asylum seekers. I wasn’t, and I didn’t.

You don't need to justify anything maddyone, of course not. If you don't want to have FB, that is your choice and nobody should criticise you for it.

I was Facebook friends with a former work colleague in the US who turned out to be a rabid Trump supporter with anti vax views. So I unfriended him.

But there are often posts on here saying how terrible FB is from people who then to on to tell us they've never had an account. Or that FB is full of people ranting about asylum seekers or foreigners. The algorithm decides what you want to see based on friends and likes. I get Maine Coons and wool shops

As my young friend wrote yesterday, the UK desperately needs young people, to replace those who have died of Covid, tragically, and those who have left because of Brexit.

These people could be welcomed to fill vacancies- especially as it is now very clear that unemployed Brits who complained bitterly about their 'jobs being taken from them' - have no intention whatsoever of doing them!!!

Some of those Brexiters will now shout- ah but we didn't mind the Europeans, its them others we didn't want'- well it is a bit late for that, I'd say.

As for the NHS being totally overwhelmed - it has nothing to do with migration!

Lincslass

Believe extra drones , and other navigational aids to help catch these smugglers, have been offered by the UK, one ex Navy chief was saying. All help been turned down by the French.

Given the anti-French rhetoric emanating from this government, it's hardly surprising our offer has been turned down.

... and France is as precious about its sovereignty as we are.

Also, certain laws and regulations would have to be put in place to govern the behaviour of our military / police on foreign soil. We are now a third country, no longer a partner.

Put the boot on the other foot - how willing would Britain be to allow the French to patrol our borders do you think?

Dickens As far as I can discover you can use drones in France, but not to survey people or sensitive sites.

Exactly!

The fact is, Brexit was NEVER EVER going to stop those desperate people from war torn zone from coming- but it has stopped EU hard workers from doing the jobs the Brits don't want to do- and pretended were 'stolen' from them (we now know that was NOT the case).

Kali2

As my young friend wrote yesterday, the UK desperately needs young people, to replace those who have died of Covid, tragically, and those who have left because of Brexit.

These people could be welcomed to fill vacancies- especially as it is now very clear that unemployed Brits who complained bitterly about their 'jobs being taken from them' - have no intention whatsoever of doing them!!!

Some of those Brexiters will now shout- ah but we didn't mind the Europeans, its them others we didn't want'- well it is a bit late for that, I'd say.

As for the NHS being totally overwhelmed - it has nothing to do with migration!

I remarked yesterday that it is very distasteful to bring Covid deaths into this, though you said you were proud of what your friend had written. I asked if you were proud of that part. You chose not to reply. You now seem to be adopting the argument yourself.

I was out all day and babysitting till late last night.

My friend was looking at facts, and it is a fact, desperately so, that 1000s have died of Covid. Her comment was part of a direct factual answer re 'Britain is full', and made total sense. The other part was that 1000s of EU hardworking people have also left, leaving huge gaps in essential jobs for the UK care sector, agriculture and more.

She didn't 'drag' Covid deaths into the conversation for the sake ot it- but as part of the full and realistic situation we currently have. And yes, I am proud of her and her insight.

Your friend is scraping the bottom of the barrel with such a comment. I would be ashamed, not proud. However perhaps whilst she's scraping she might like to produce evidence of the number of people of economically active age who have died with covid and need to be replaced. I would hope she realises that a great many of those who have died were well over retirement age.

Not at all- her comment was factual- in direct response to the 'Britain is full' argument seen again and again.

It is a fact that we have lost 2 groups of people, in the last couple of years. She never said they were all economically active. The second group, EU workers, certainly were. And it is clear that the unemployed Brits have no wish to take on the jobs they left behind.

It seems to be my fault that anti migration posts are on my FB feed. Hmm. The thread in question was on a BBC news article about the recent deaths in the channel and certainly wasn't because I have friends who are raving anti immigration. Not that I need to explain to anyone.

I entirely agree that we need people to do the unskilled jobs Brits - even unemployed ones - seem to think are beneath them and also skilled workers. Plenty needed in agriculture round here for instance. But whilst we need to replace workers and potential workers lost for any reason, the Covid argument, apart from being diststeful, just doesn't hold water without data as to the number of economically active, or potentially active, people who have fallen victim to Covid.

Glad I'm not on FB Gill.

GSM- it is part of the picture in reply to 'Britain is full' - at the time of the Brexit vote, Britain was significantly fuller, in more ways than one. Certainly the elderly who have tragically died in last 2 years, are no longer 'putting a strain' on the NHS- this is not callous, it is a fact.

GillT57

It seems to be my fault that anti migration posts are on my FB feed. Hmm. The thread in question was on a BBC news article about the recent deaths in the channel and certainly wasn't because I have friends who are raving anti immigration. Not that I need to explain to anyone.

OK, so it's the BBC site and not FB that is responsible for the comments written by ranters, then.

Did you either like or follow the BBC site ....?

I'm not a FB apologist, but saying that its FB that is a nasty place isn't actually reflective of the real world.

The FB sites I go to are not nasty at all. You get what you sign up for I think. If they started any nastiness I would leave them immediately. I also never ,ever accept people as friends unless I know them personally.

There are some lovely groups on Facebook I recommend Silversurfers, a political free group ?.

^“But there can be better management of the crisis. The French can, perhaps, try harder to block the beaches”

Would the UK. block/ barbwire 90 kilometers of its coast line along the south coast?
A day out for the family, … to the beach and scramble under or over the blocks to play in the sea.

When people suggest things like this they should think if the tables were turned and what they would put up with.

All Boris does is blame the EU and accuse them for all the problems and tell them to solve them to keep his backbenchers and the population who voted for him quiet.
He throws these headlines out, UK soldiers and police in the EU to cover up and hide International Laws.
He is such an embarrassment.

He actively sought people’s vote to stop the UKs ability to return asylum seekers to Europe.

What a charlatan he is.

I do not have friends on FB that are unknown to me in real life, and like most, I use it to keep in touch especially on our local page with warnings about traffic jams, roadworks, pleas for help finding lost cats etc.

Dickens

Lincslass

Believe extra drones , and other navigational aids to help catch these smugglers, have been offered by the UK, one ex Navy chief was saying. All help been turned down by the French.

Given the anti-French rhetoric emanating from this government, it's hardly surprising our offer has been turned down.

... and France is as precious about its sovereignty as we are.

Also, certain laws and regulations would have to be put in place to govern the behaviour of our military / police on foreign soil. We are now a third country, no longer a partner.

Put the boot on the other foot - how willing would Britain be to allow the French to patrol our borders do you think?

I was only repeating what had been said. All the bad rhetoric has not been onesided either, the French blaming us because we don’t have ID , oh and a job market that is thriving, and I’m sure they have as much a thriving black market as we do.We also must remember these migrants are actually on French soil, not the UK. So in France their problem, non?
We have been requested to help on the Ukraine border, who may have an escalation with Russia, and we have gone to help. So make of this problem what you will, France in no way will seek a joint arrangement with us. So no need to be snarky with me. Yes if it was a dire problem, which this is, then yes I think we would accept help, under our jurisdiction, as Patel has offered with France, but they won’t countenance even that. They just want to lay all the blame at our door.

So, lets be pragmatic and practical.

What actions would you like French police / CRS - take on the beaches. Just give practical examples of what they should do- over this massively long stretch of coast.

The Police who see migrants arriving with a dinghy- surrounded with people, men, women and children. Should they shoot? Do you think that could get a clear shot of the dinghy without risking maiming killing any of the people carrying the dinghy, getting into it, or once in it.

Just a simple practical question for you.