Stand off drowning migrants and report – or face prosecution, sailors warned

Let’s find someone else to blame! France takes more asylum seekers than the U.K.- so why should France help the U.K. take even less than them? If we had migrants travelling through the U.K. to get to, say, Norway, would we stop them leaving and keep them unwillingly in the U.K.? The migrants in the boats are headed for the U.K., so why on earth should the French stop them leaving? Especially as the U.K. are being so hostile towards them

From another young friend - yes, as said before, and Raab took a long time to realise, and some on GN too- geography does matter.

''One of the most laughable things about little England mindset in this country is that anything which advantages them is always right and fair, anything which disadvantages them is wrong and outrageously unfair.
I mean, I’m sure if we were geographically positioned where Turkey, Greece or Italy are (or more so - Libya, Lebanon and Sudan), we’d still be shouting that refugees should stay in the first country they get to, right? Nah. We’d be screaming from the rooftops that other countries weren’t doing enough, why should we have to deal with everyone? But when we’re a geographical outpost then yeah, everyone should stay where they are, cos that’s fair, isn’t it. ''

What no one is understanding or wanting to understand, is that asylum seekers are perfectly entitled to seek asylum in the country of their choosing. The police can advise them of the danger of taking a small dingy to sea, but the cannot legally stop them going to a country of their choice.

Lincslass

Dickens

Lincslass

Believe extra drones , and other navigational aids to help catch these smugglers, have been offered by the UK, one ex Navy chief was saying. All help been turned down by the French.

Given the anti-French rhetoric emanating from this government, it's hardly surprising our offer has been turned down.

... and France is as precious about its sovereignty as we are.

Also, certain laws and regulations would have to be put in place to govern the behaviour of our military / police on foreign soil. We are now a third country, no longer a partner.

Put the boot on the other foot - how willing would Britain be to allow the French to patrol our borders do you think?

I was only repeating what had been said. All the bad rhetoric has not been onesided either, the French blaming us because we don’t have ID , oh and a job market that is thriving, and I’m sure they have as much a thriving black market as we do.We also must remember these migrants are actually on French soil, not the UK. So in France their problem, non?
We have been requested to help on the Ukraine border, who may have an escalation with Russia, and we have gone to help. So make of this problem what you will, France in no way will seek a joint arrangement with us. So no need to be snarky with me. Yes if it was a dire problem, which this is, then yes I think we would accept help, under our jurisdiction, as Patel has offered with France, but they won’t countenance even that. They just want to lay all the blame at our door.

This is toddler mentality. "But ... but ... but ... he's as bad as me ... it's his fault ..."

Kali2

Not at all- her comment was factual- in direct response to the 'Britain is full' argument seen again and again.

These are your comments are they kali ‘the young friend’ ,as you have used this phrase many times with the hobby horse of Brexit.
Please do stop using the emotive issue of Covid deaths to further justify the anti Brexit comments.

Whitewavemark2

What no one is understanding or wanting to understand, is that asylum seekers are perfectly entitled to seek asylum in the country of their choosing. The police can advise them of the danger of taking a small dingy to sea, but the cannot legally stop them going to a country of their choice.

Have you told the French police this?
I think that slashing the dinghies now and again is stopping them, but it needs more manpower.Which is where we come in, except Macron would seem to be blocking any UK help.

lemongrove

Kali2

Not at all- her comment was factual- in direct response to the 'Britain is full' argument seen again and again.

These are your comments are they kali ‘the young friend’ ,as you have used this phrase many times with the hobby horse of Brexit.
Please do stop using the emotive issue of Covid deaths to further justify the anti Brexit comments.

I have not. What do you mean, my comments? I said they were a friend's (who happens to be young)- what right have you got to say they are 'mine'. But yes, I shared, with her permission- as I totally agree with what she said, on several occasions.

No WAY at all has she, or I, used Covid deaths to justify anti Brexit comments. Those comments were made, and I repeat, in direct response to the 'UK is full' - it is not.

“Smugglers shot a scared migrant in the kneecaps after he refused to board a boat on the same night 27 people died trying to cross the English Channel.

Volunteers in the Calais jungle migrant camp rushed to the aid of a 20-year-old man who was “quickly losing a lot of blood” after a smuggler became frustrated at his refusal to board the vessel and drew a gun on him.

The smuggler felt he had “lost out on easy money,” volunteers said, as the gangs are believed to only receive the full fee for transporting migrants once they have arrived in the UK. The assailant is on the run, according to French media reports.“

This, just now in the Telegraph illustrates well what a hugely organised and lucrative business people trafficking actually is. Like drugs just a different commodity.

Perhaps it is just too easy to get across Europe with Schengen? Maybe it’s time to reintroduce borders and checks across Europe?

Whatever, law enforcement across Europe and here needs to up the game. These gangsters buying rubber inflatables in Germany & Belgium, are running rings around all of us. So much money is exchanging hands here. They won’t give up this without a fight.

Kali, your 'young friend' has used covid deaths to justify immigration. You said you are proud of what she wrote and her 'insight' and you have also said that you agree with her, therefore these are your comments too and pretty disgraceful they are. Don't try to bring Brexit into this by way of an 'excuse' for such deplorable comments.

No she did NOT, and I have explained why.

If you deny that Brexit is a strong factor in what is happening now, then you are in true denial.

growstuff

Lincslass

Dickens

Lincslass

Believe extra drones , and other navigational aids to help catch these smugglers, have been offered by the UK, one ex Navy chief was saying. All help been turned down by the French.

Given the anti-French rhetoric emanating from this government, it's hardly surprising our offer has been turned down.

... and France is as precious about its sovereignty as we are.

Also, certain laws and regulations would have to be put in place to govern the behaviour of our military / police on foreign soil. We are now a third country, no longer a partner.

Put the boot on the other foot - how willing would Britain be to allow the French to patrol our borders do you think?

I was only repeating what had been said. All the bad rhetoric has not been onesided either, the French blaming us because we don’t have ID , oh and a job market that is thriving, and I’m sure they have as much a thriving black market as we do.We also must remember these migrants are actually on French soil, not the UK. So in France their problem, non?
We have been requested to help on the Ukraine border, who may have an escalation with Russia, and we have gone to help. So make of this problem what you will, France in no way will seek a joint arrangement with us. So no need to be snarky with me. Yes if it was a dire problem, which this is, then yes I think we would accept help, under our jurisdiction, as Patel has offered with France, but they won’t countenance even that. They just want to lay all the blame at our door.

This is toddler mentality. "But ... but ... but ... he's as bad as me ... it's his fault ..."

So rude aren’t you.

So you think I'm wrong?

A news reporter quoted a figure of a quarter of a million pounds per boatload Urms so yes, an extremely lucrative business indeed.

I do wish though that these tv news reporters would ask more searching questions of the migrants.
One family from I think, Iraq, when asked why they were so determined to get to the UK , when they were already safe in France said that it’s better for families than France.
I did wonder why the reporter didn’t ask the woman more searching questions to find out what gave her that impression.

It’s probably well known to these migrants that even if they fail to be granted asylum they have a virtually zero risk of being deported once here.

Kali I will say again that you are using Brexit as an excuse. You seem obsessed with it. Some days you identify as a member of the UK, others you identify with the EU. The consequences of Brexit upon the way in which migrants are dealt with are known to us all on here. Stop using the ‘little England’ mentality shown by some to justify Brexit to bash people on this thread who have shown no signs of being infected with it and who have expressed horror at recent events.

Germanshepherdsmum

Kali I will say again that you are using Brexit as an excuse. You seem obsessed with it. Some days you identify as a member of the UK, others you identify with the EU. The consequences of Brexit upon the way in which migrants are dealt with are known to us all on here. Stop using the ‘little England’ mentality shown by some to justify Brexit to bash people on this thread who have shown no signs of being infected with it and who have expressed horror at recent events.

Exactly. Excellent post.

I have a question when will Britain, England be full up?

It looks nearly full to me, the grid locked traffic on the motorways and towns. Packed hospitals, packed gp surgeries. dentists can't take any new patients, school classrooms bursting, some children unable to get their first choice school. Houses estates like new towns being built everywhere and they all get snapped up straight away. Shortage of rental properties. The list is endless. We are fit to bursting in my opinion.

I have a question when will Britain, England be full up?

When hell freezes over.

Not so much full up Maudi as lacking in infrastructure.

Thanks Robin.?

Well which is it?

Are we full up? No. We're the 49th most densely populated country in the world, out of 232.

Is our infrastructure lacking? Yes, because of the massive underinvestment over the last few years. Have a word with Boris.

Maudi

I have a question when will Britain, England be full up?

It looks nearly full to me, the grid locked traffic on the motorways and towns. Packed hospitals, packed gp surgeries. dentists can't take any new patients, school classrooms bursting, some children unable to get their first choice school. Houses estates like new towns being built everywhere and they all get snapped up straight away. Shortage of rental properties. The list is endless. We are fit to bursting in my opinion.

Not our part of the UK, Maudi. We don't have any problems like that.

Germanshepherdsmum

Kali I will say again that you are using Brexit as an excuse. You seem obsessed with it. Some days you identify as a member of the UK, others you identify with the EU. The consequences of Brexit upon the way in which migrants are dealt with are known to us all on here. Stop using the ‘little England’ mentality shown by some to justify Brexit to bash people on this thread who have shown no signs of being infected with it and who have expressed horror at recent events.

Kali2 is a British citizen. She's as entitled to post what she wants as you are, Gsm. Stop trying to control the forum and police people's posts.. If you don't like what she posts, don't read it. It's quite easy to do.

17:08Germanshepherdsmum

Kali I will say again that you are using Brexit as an excuse. You seem obsessed with it. Some days you identify as a member of the UK, others you identify with the EU. The consequences of Brexit upon the way in which migrants are dealt with are known to us all on here. Stop using the ‘little England’ mentality shown by some to justify Brexit to bash people on this thread who have shown no signs of being infected with it and who have expressed horror at recent events.

Spot on GSM well said its like a stuck record isn't it Brexit Brexit Brexit and a few 'little England' jibes thrown in.

As for saying GSM is trying to control the forum and control people's posts pot black comes to mind.

Maudi ''Spot on GSM well said its like a stuck record isn't it Brexit Brexit Brexit and a few 'little England' jibes thrown in.''

are you actually saying that what is happening now is not linked to Brexit?

Are you denying that the country is currently much less crowded than it was 2 years ago, for a variety of reasons?