Furious with the Tories...

Maizie D: Amid all your gloom, it is amazing that 'Gross domestic product (GDP) is estimated to have grown by 0.9% in November 2021 and is above its pre-coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic level (February 2020) for the first time, by 0.7%.'

It seems that our population has not fallen since Brexit but, of course, we have had the small matter of the pandemic to contend with.

As for being boiled frogs, I wouldn't presume to judge but Brexit was never going to be seamless and, despite the stereotype, many Brexiteers did not see the going easy after Brexit. It is undeniable that the pandemic has made the headwind all the harder but, nevertheless, GDP and employment has recovered and unemployment is now falling. Inflation is a major issue but can hardly be attributed to Brexit - unless Brexit had worldwide inflationary consequences!

Maizie D: Amid all your gloom, it is amazing that 'Gross domestic product (GDP) is estimated to have grown by 0.9% in November 2021 and is above its pre-coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic level (February 2020) for the first time, by 0.7%.

How does that compare to other countries Cunco?

Because if we went up by 0.9%, and they all went up by 2%, that's not quite so good, is it?

Ummmm

GDP to Q3 2021

commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn02784/

Oh I know, some will say 'it is just JOB whinging again' -

but he is so so spot on. And the Press is unanymous- and the whole world is laughing, TV, Press, cartoonists are having a field day- and it is not really Johnson that is being laughed at, it is the whole Nation- what used to be so respected as Great Britain.

fb.watch/aVdmyJxJ5p/

Not wanting to excuse him in the slightest, but there was that small matter of the pandemic ...

Did they not have the pandemic in those other countries then GSM?

Germanshepherdsmum

Not wanting to excuse him in the slightest, but there was that small matter of the pandemic ...

We all had teh Pandemic, and we followed the rules and did NOT Party. Relevance???

Yes, I am annoyed too and getting more annoyed by the day. The Saville quip! Does anyone remember that Mrs Thatcher invited him for Christmas several times at Chequers? He received a knighthood… why was Ian Blackford kicked out of the Commons yesterday for accusing Johnson of lying when Johnson himself lied through his teeth about Kier Starmer? Unbelievable. And then, I think it was Raab, sticking up for him this morning. Nearly as bad was an obviously ‘refreshed’ Nadine Dories defending him on Channel 4 news last night, I don’t usually defend any Tory, but Ruth Davison, also on Channel 4 News was upset to the point of tears. Any Tory MP who defends this absolute nightmare of a PM will surely lose all credibility. Finally, I wonder what Carrie is whispering in Johnson’s ear these days?

She has sent him much further than Coventry- to Ukraine!

And I'll repeat, other NATO countries are truly worried that this bull in a China shop, in so much trouble at home and totally distrusted- is today in Ukraine WITHOUT any mandate from NATO, and putting everyone at huge risk if he shouts his stupid mouth off. Dangerous in the extreme.

Kali2

She has sent him much further than Coventry- to Ukraine!

And I'll repeat, other NATO countries are truly worried that this bull in a China shop, in so much trouble at home and totally distrusted- is today in Ukraine WITHOUT any mandate from NATO, and putting everyone at huge risk if he shouts his stupid mouth off. Dangerous in the extreme.

He’s offered 88million in aid, while at home there are food banks and rising fuel costs.

If there are "decent Tory politicians" then now is the time for them to prove that they are by kicking Johnson out immediately.

Our GDP is growing because it fell much more spectacularly than other countries, so is coming from a low base , we also have the highest death toll, most polluted rivers, lowest pensions etc etc in Europe - don’t hear BJ bogging on about that. What I really hate about this current bunch of shysters is the constant assertion that “the public aren’t interested in this - we are getting on with the peoples priorities” - I want to shout - “Don’t you tell me what I am interested in or what my priorities are, I AM interested in your bloody lies and corruption and one of my priorities is seeing the back of you lot.”

The Ukraine issue isn’t that straightforward. My Ukrainian friend says over 40 % of Ukrainians are actually Russian. Makes things seem a bit different somehow. Why is the uk and USA involved ?

17% of Ukrainians are ethnically Russian. Makes not a blind bit of difference. Russia doesn't get to threaten to walk in to anybody else's country, any more than we would.

But the British have done that sort of thing for years. Maybe not so much recently . I am surprised someone from Scotland would say that. It is not their business. Where were they when China invaded Tibet?

What?

It's not years ago, it's now. If the Ukrainians need our help, we help them.

I'm not naive enough to think it's all done from altruism, but it's not something to be ignored because it's not our problem.

Veganrock I agree. The “the public aren’t interested in this - we are getting on with the peoples priorities” stuff is ridiculous.

One of the most frustrating moments in a sea of frustrating moments in parliament on Monday was the MP saying (and I paraphrase here) 'When I talk to people about the parties they say to me, we're not worried about that, just get back on with stopping the little boats arriving.' God alive.

vegansrock

Our GDP is growing because it fell much more spectacularly than other countries, so is coming from a low base , we also have the highest death toll, most polluted rivers, lowest pensions etc etc in Europe - don’t hear BJ bogging on about that. What I really hate about this current bunch of shysters is the constant assertion that “the public aren’t interested in this - we are getting on with the peoples priorities” - I want to shout - “Don’t you tell me what I am interested in or what my priorities are, I AM interested in your bloody lies and corruption and one of my priorities is seeing the back of you lot.”

What I really hate about this current bunch of shysters is the constant assertion that “the public aren’t interested in this - we are getting on with the peoples priorities”

That bugs me too. Remember Gove's "I think the British people have had enough of experts..."

The arrogance! It's simply a way of excusing and exonerating themselves - this pious reference to "the people" doesn't wash with everyone but unfortunately there are too many with whom it does. Goodness knows why integrity, decency and honourable behaviour doesn't matter to them but obviously, it's not that important. I suppose if a government gives you what you want - and has contempt for the same people you do, so to speak, they'll be excused virtually anything.

midgey

I am very angry with Mr Johnson but getting cross with the opposition parties…why aren’t they using the golden opportunity to tell us what they stand for?

There are rules for the management of PMQs to which I assume you're referring. Witness:

The Speaker usually calls the Leaders of the two main Opposition parties to ask supplementary questions at Prime Minister’s questions. The Leader of the official Opposition usually asks six questions, and the leader of the third largest party two questions. They do not have to table questions in advance.

The Opposition are regularly featured in other programmes and in the print media should you wish to learn more.

Johnson actually told his audience that the UK was leading the
opposition to Russia over Ukraine. I cringed when I heard him.

I do think these forums are all biased to Labour, it’s not about balanced argument. I think whatever way they can they want to
get rid of Boris, by whatever means. It seems they see no fault at all in Labour, proved by those supporting Corbyn, also Blair.
Boris is a joke in lots of ways, however he gets things done and got the votes and won’t do another term anyway.

Not everyone who is totally anti-Tory is a Labour voter/supporter, Allsorts. Other parties are available. In this constituency, for example, there is no point in voting Labour as they will never get in. Might explain why we have had SNP and Lib Dem MPs as they are the only ones who have a chance of beating the Tories.

This thread isn’t about Labour and “finding fault” with them though is it allsorts ? you can start another thread on that if you want. Why assume that those who criticise this current shower are Labour supporters ? Some of the critics actually voted tory.

Allsorts

I do think these forums are all biased to Labour, it’s not about balanced argument. I think whatever way they can they want to
get rid of Boris, by whatever means. It seems they see no fault at all in Labour, proved by those supporting Corbyn, also Blair.
Boris is a joke in lots of ways, however he gets things done and got the votes and won’t do another term anyway.

These forums are not required to have equal numbers of Labour and Tory supporters - so if you think there's more Labour than Tory posters it is because either there's more support for Labour - or Tory posters aren't interested in the arguments.

Also, why assume Labour supporters are Corbynites? I'm not and I know others who aren't - on here and elsewhere. And Blair is equally unpopular with quite a few Labour supporters - including me.

Of course some of us want to get rid of 'Boris' - for the reasons many have stated. If you believe a party and its leader lack integrity, honour - if you're angered by broken promises and lies - why would you not want to get rid of it and him?

Did anyone bother about Corbyn getting well and truly trashed by the media - they, and the people they represent wanted to make sure he didn't get anywhere near the reins of power. His opponents - including Starmer - wanted rid of him on the political landscape "by whatever means". That's how politics work in our antiquated, two-party, adversarial system. Each party scores political points over the other.

Boris is not a God, he's not a President - he has no automatic right to lead, all Prime Ministers are accountable to us - the taxpayer, whichever party they represent.

"He gets things done" He signed a rushed-through Brexit Deal, a major constitutional change to our whole way of life which, even he knows, will take decades to bed-in. Brexit is far from "done". He makes decisions - the vaccination programme was his best - but he doesn't actually do the work involved. He also doesn't get things done - remember his pledge to pensioners not to break the triple-lock... I won't mention the others...

Dickens Thanks for the above.

Some people just don't understand the level of animosity/anger with Johnson and the Tories.