Goodness - golden boy Sunak now less popular than Starmer!

ajswan

Pantglas2

It’ll be the same people who didn’t have a good word to say about him even when they were grabbing all that furlough money.

I have friends who bought their council houses and still hate Thatcher for depleting social housing stock!

Hooray someone with a good memory and some sense. Some idiot freelancers have soon forgotten the billions given in furlough money and money to help businesses survive. If this was another country they would not have received anything and been left to go under. I notice that a huge number of people working from home were not in a hurry to get back to the workplace. The owner of Pimlico Plumbers ordered all his staff back to the workplace or they would be sacked.
Absolutely right about Margaret Thatcher, (my hero). How many people bought their council houses with a massive discount and then sold them for a massive profit after the number of years had lapsed before they could sell them. Margaret Thatcher, the milk snatcher, what a load of bxxxxxxs, she was actually outvoted on this issue.

Somehow I don't think that the employees of Pimlico Plumbers could work from home. Unblocking a loo by remote control perhaps? I think that he was referring to mask wearing - anyone who didn't want to would be sacked.

The self employed who received SEISS grants are now paying income tax and Class 4 NIC on those grants (from 2020/21) unless their total taxable income is less than the PA and below the lower level for Class 4 (lower than the PA)

I was born blind when it comes to economics, MaizieD so I could have totally the wrong end of the stick but doesn't the issuing of more money contribute to inflation and a lessening of our credit rating? Please educate me. If you can manage it you'll have managed what several economics lecturers failed to do. Economics scuppered any chance of me becoming a Chartered Accountant!

If we can just print money and ‘spend, spend, spend’ then why aren’t we all living in the lap of luxury? Increase the state pensions! Build 100 new hospitals! Let doctors train up at no personal cost! Open nursery schools that are fee-free so mums can return to work if they wish and keep all their wages! Heck - give everyone a ‘holiday voucher’ to spend as they wish every year.

It all seems a bit la-la to me?

Margaret Thatcher promoted the idea of us as a country ‘living within our means’. It’s certainly taken root.

Why haven’t Chancellors of the Exchequer (different stripes over the years) debunked what she said then and explained it all to us?

Also, why are some sovereign countries run like banana republics printing too much money so citizens need a suitcase of it to buy a loaf of bread?

Lots of questions, sorry MaizieD!
I can’t get my head around economics within a country.

I feel as though we’re all sitting up straight now in class waiting for our tutor to come into the room. Pencils at the ready.
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icanhandthemback

I was born blind when it comes to economics, MaizieD so I could have totally the wrong end of the stick but doesn't the issuing of more money contribute to inflation and a lessening of our credit rating? Please educate me. If you can manage it you'll have managed what several economics lecturers failed to do. Economics scuppered any chance of me becoming a Chartered Accountant!

Inflation either occurs because of price rises of commodities which are beyond a nation's control, such as the oil price rises instituted by OPEC in the 1970s, or by there being not enough resources to spend the available money on. 'Resources' could be anything, consumer goods, construction, more hospitals, schools, hairdressers... anything that money buys.

Excessive money in the economy can be controlled by 'cancelling' some by taxing it back, or by being cautious about issuing it... (no doubt there are other mechanisms, too)

But when you look around the UK there is so much in the economy that we could do with more money, and political will, that inflation caused by too much money chasing limited resources isn't really a worry, is it?

TBH. a lot of the more abstruse, technical economics stuff goes over my head, too. But MMT starts with a simple basic fact and any thinking person should be able to build on that.

I think that economics is a bit like education. Neither can be totally explained by scientific means because at their heart they are not dealing with rational actors which have predictable behaviours..

Credit ratings are weird things, because money is essentially a sort of confidence trick. It only works because people universally accept the principles behind it. Just think, our currency is worthless in other countries, you have to convert it to their currencies before you can use it.

Thank you, MaizieD. My son studies economics at Uni but if I ask him he blinds me with science and I am a bear with very little brain!

I still can’t get over that Rishi Sunak is married to a woman who is allegedly richer than HM the Queen.

If we can just print money and ‘spend, spend, spend’ then why aren’t we all living in the lap of luxury? Increase the state pensions! Build 100 new hospitals! Let doctors train up at no personal cost! Open nursery schools that are fee-free so mums can return to work if they wish and keep all their wages! Heck - give everyone a ‘holiday voucher’ to spend as they wish every year.

It might sound a bit la la to you, Ug, but there's no reason why we shouldn't. It would benefit the economy and it would benefit most of the citizens of the nation. All those jobs, all that money to spend on suppliers, on local businesses, on construction, on anything you care to mention.

The constraining factor is inflation if there is nothing, or very little, to spend the money on. Taxing some of the money back would help to control that, also being careful about how much money is issued.

Is there any shortage of things to spend money on in the UK?

Of course, governments can take a different path, like ours did with the pandemic money. They can push all money in the direction of their friends and donors, leaving little for the rest of the population. That's the kind of thing that happened in Zimbabwe & Venezuela. Most people call it corruption. We don't seem to be quite so fussy in the UK...

Sorry I've just read this and can't think of any reasons why we wouldn't want to do the things that Urmstongran has listed...

I just wasn’t sure how it worked volver. I love my proposals.
If a politician took the time and effort to explain all this to the voters (thank you MaizieD) we’d probably not have snorted along with the MSM at Corbyn’s money tree. We might even have voted for him.....

Why haven’t Chancellors of the Exchequer (different stripes over the years) debunked what she said then and explained it all to us?

Because Chancellors of the Exchequer are not economists for a start.

They are 'guided' by the professional economists and, until relatively recently, although the economists must know that the state issues new money on a regular basis, because it happens every year, many of them still haven't worked out the implications of this freedom. Most of them don't go back to the root of 'where does it come from? ' They just observe and study what happens when it's 'here'. They'll pay lip service to the fact that a national budget is in no way like a household budget, but then treat it as though it is. Weird...

Urmstongran

I just wasn’t sure how it worked volver. I love my proposals.
If a politician took the time and effort to explain all this to the voters (thank you MaizieD) we’d probably not have snorted along with the MSM at Corbyn’s money tree. We might even have voted for him.....

That's why Labour is so frustratingly cautious about their economic plans. They are always stymied by the 'How are you going to pay for it? question and their very ill deserved reputation for financial incompetence. Ferociously pushed by the tories and predominantly right wing media, of course.

Poor old Red Ed had just the same problem as Corbyn as far as his economic policies were concerned.

why is it suspicious shes from a very prominent rich family in india and rishis still doing a great job compared to some i think its jealousy and its been leaked out to get people talking

lalta

why is it suspicious shes from a very prominent rich family in india and rishis still doing a great job compared to some i think its jealousy and its been leaked out to get people talking

Please explain why you think Sunak's doing a good job? There's not many (on here at any rate) who agree with you.

Urmstongran

I just wasn’t sure how it worked volver. I love my proposals.
If a politician took the time and effort to explain all this to the voters (thank you MaizieD) we’d probably not have snorted along with the MSM at Corbyn’s money tree. We might even have voted for him.....

The Tories don't want to spend the money. They want a small state - more money to be made by their friends.

I saw quite a lot on tv about Corbyn's spending proposals and generally thought they were OK. Unfortuately I think he went too far when he talked about free broadband for everyone.

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bridgejj, would you want everybody to receive this as the state pension? What about people who get paid very healthy pensions including those who have worked for the State?

And Starmer's not doing very well is he.

Noam Chomsky called Keir Starmer “Keith”. He knew he was belittling the Labour leader, and rightly so.

But his words about what Starmer has done to the Labour Party are far more damning. In video published by the New Statesman, he said:

“He is returning the Labour Party to a party that is reliably obedient to power; that will be ‘Thatcher-lite’ in the style of Tony Blair.”

Noam said Keith pic.twitter.com/Q86px1tADW

— black lives matter (@jrc1921) April 8, 2022
The comments of the world’s leading left-wing thinker are important and relevant because they contribute to the demolition of the anti-Semitism smears to which Starmer has wedded himself.

twitter.com/jrc1921/status/1512505586495238150?s=20&t=x-ZTk4QETo_Uj_qHM5dfPQ

So now Sunak and his family have moved out of the Downing Street flat.

Grany does that mean Labour with Starmer as leader might actually be electable at long last?!

growstuff

So now Sunak and his family have moved out of the Downing Street flat.

The Daily Mail is reporting that he’ll be gone by next week. Having a Green Card apparently carries a legal undertaking that you intend to make the USA your permanent home and the Americans may stop Sunak from returning to the USA.
I think I’m beginning to feel a tad sorry for the Sunaks.

I think I’m beginning to feel a tad sorry for the Sunaks

You’re not the only one. I’m going to be tossing and turning all night worrying about them.

Grannynannywanny

^I think I’m beginning to feel a tad sorry for the Sunaks^

You’re not the only one. I’m going to be tossing and turning all night worrying about them.

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Sweet dreams.

They aren’t going to be homeless, they’ve got several luxury homes around the place.