Are young people turning gay?

VS
Even though you post on threads involving them, their practices and recommendations, you support children, without ‘following’ and therefore knowing about the companies who have got things so terribly wrong for so many children, young people and trans.
VS.

Oh dear.

Thanks Molly - exactly my point.

I just don't understand how anyone can be so vociferous in the defence of organisations about which they claim to know nothing. It's not as though it is difficult to find out either.

Hang on I see a certain lack of logic here. If Mermaids is such an influential organisation and is actively changing policies in schools then surely Violetsky will not only have encountered them she will know what they are promoting and how they are doing it.
She says she doesn't.
Therefore apparently she is unqualified to speak about transissues.
Come on either Mermaids have brainwashed her or they haven't. You can't have it both ways.

I

I talked about binders....

binders which was at least 50% of the topic right?

Definitely holding on to all my faculties not brainwashed and not feeling the need to be mean to people on the Internet in the name of any group, organisation or personal vendetta

Glorianny

Hang on I see a certain lack of logic here. If Mermaids is such an influential organisation and is actively changing policies in schools then surely Violetsky will not only have encountered them she will know what they are promoting and how they are doing it.
She says she doesn't.
Therefore apparently she is unqualified to speak about transissues.
Come on either Mermaids have brainwashed her or they haven't. You can't have it both ways.

I

Does Mermaids change policies in schools? I thought that was Stonewall. My understanding is that Mermaids is an advisory service, who will respond to specific enquiries and 'train' staff to respond to those. So, for example, if a child has dysphoria they will advise on that, as it is a rare condition which most staff would never come across in a whole career. That could be wrong though - I've never worked in a school, but I don't think that all schools have all-staff training from Mermaids by any means.

AFAIK, few of us on here is 'qualified' to speak about trans issues, and nobody has said anything about VS's qualifications. The point that was raised was that VS has posted on numerous threads on the subject, and it seems odd, therefore, that she doesn't know about Stonewall or Mermaids, given how often they crop up.

Rosie51

VioletSky

I don't follow Stonewall or mermaids so I'm not sure what you want me to do?

I'm only active in my intersectional feminist grouo and even then, well, taking on 3 million odd people is a bit much for me... you could try? Pantsuit nation on Facebook, go, have fun!

doodledog am heartbroken. I'll comfort myself with carrot cake

I suppose I wanted you to back up your statement there were other umbrellas without the T, which as far as I'm concerned there is only the one, which is under attack. I'm disappointed you seem ignorant of Mermaids' actions. As the transgender* children's charity who have so much input into schools I'd have expected you to have come across their activities a lot, especially as like them, you've endorsed 'positive affirmation'. With at least two of the trustees on their board being exposed as totally unfit to be within 10 miles of any child or policies pertaining to children you may not need to learn anything about them in the future. Google is your friend, there's plenty of information about theses scandals online.

Rosie51's assertion about Mermaids
So who is it Stonewall or Mermaids?
Or (surprise, surprise) is it actually neither of them?
Because changing school policies is not as easy as you like to pretend and (more surprise) teachers tend to be well informed people from a variety of backgrounds with lots of differing views.

What's your point, Glorianny?

Is what Stonewall or Mermaids, and who is 'pretending' that changing policy is easy? I'm a bit lost.

The point, again, is that it seems odd that VS doesn't know about the main organisations which support the trans agenda, given her position on these threads. It is not for anyone on here to comment on her professional abilities, if that's what you are suggesting - as I say, it's hard to tell what your point is.

Do I need to follow or be a part of an organisation to have an opinion?

Mermaids has been removed from the DoE list of approved sources

Oh Doodledogyou are much too bright to pretend ignorance or misunderstanding.
I posted Rosie51's post.
If as she alleges Mermaids has a substantial input into schools then Violet Sky should know about them. But she doesn't know much.
You are now saying it's Stonewall with the input.
So which is it? Or is it neither?
The point is that either you are mistaken and there is no input from either organisation because someone actually working in a school knows little about them. Or you are saying the VS is lying or not taking on board the training provided.
Either way it doesn't really matter because what is emerging is that the allegations about the enormous input the two organisations have had are not supported by the evidence. And in fact you and Rosie51 are now contradicting each other. So stop trying to dodge the bullet and explain to me who has the influence in schools? and is VS just the exception who hasn't had all the input she's supposed to have had? or is the whole idea that these two organisations are busy converting people just a figment of the imagination?

I have completed level 2 and level 3 which is a diploma and I am up to date with all staff training.

I can confirm, absolutely no mention of Stonewall or Mermaids at all

Really VS? Really?
Oh dear.

VioletSky

I have completed level 2 and level 3 which is a diploma and I am up to date with all staff training.

I can confirm, absolutely no mention of Stonewall or Mermaids at all

If no mention why have the Department of Education removed it as one of their resources ?

Does it differ from area to area?

I have heard of it in a Primary School less than 10 miles from me.

What did the primary say about it and which one? Mermaids or Stonewall?

I searched our academies website and there is no mention of stonewall or mermaids. Nothing on the main academy website either...

I'm still not sure what this has to do with whether I should have an opinion on trans rights?

One thing we did cover in training was the equality act which I obviously do agree with and I believe it should be followed correctly and I agree sometimes that isn't happening.

Another thing we teach in school is our British Values of Individual Liberty, Tolerance and Respect.

I've also told you that we do not teach about trans and neither does my children's secondary school.

I've also mentioned that my responsibility to children having difficulty with gender would be listening, offering comfort and reporting concerns.

But these are things I have said on these threads all along.

Where is the problem exactly?

Took less than 30 seconds to find

Do you understand what a resource is? We use many many different resources on a daily basis and choose depending on what works best for a need or create our own from inspiration.

I'm telling you, neither Stonewall or Mermaids are mentioned in my training or my coursework.

Why is that not being accepted?

Because if they were mentioned I still agree with my coursework and my training and I would simply say so

Mermaids was used in a training event I attended which was delivered to early years staff. People are going to be back pedalling so hard you will see the smoke.

Yes VioletSky I do know what a resource is.

I was just pointing out that mermaids was an Educational resource, just because you haven’t experience of them does not mean that nobody in education has.

I did my latest training within the last few months but I have just been through it again

Neither Stonewall or Mermaids are referenced at all.

Not on the list of policies and acts that that guide our policy

Not on the long list of support organisations

Nowhere

I value the opportunity to refresh this though

GrannyGravy13

Yes VioletSky I do know what a resource is.

I was just pointing out that mermaids was an Educational resource, just because you haven’t experience of them does not mean that nobody in education has.

Where have I said "nobody has"?

VioletSky

GrannyGravy13

Yes VioletSky I do know what a resource is.

I was just pointing out that mermaids was an Educational resource, just because you haven’t experience of them does not mean that nobody in education has.

Where have I said "nobody has"?

You have repeatedly told those posting linking mermaids with schools they are wrong in your experience

Where have I said that?

I've been asked about it and I have answered

Glorianny

Oh Doodledogyou are much too bright to pretend ignorance or misunderstanding.
I posted Rosie51's post.
If as she alleges Mermaids has a substantial input into schools then Violet Sky should know about them. But she doesn't know much.
You are now saying it's Stonewall with the input.
So which is it? Or is it neither?
The point is that either you are mistaken and there is no input from either organisation because someone actually working in a school knows little about them. Or you are saying the VS is lying or not taking on board the training provided.
Either way it doesn't really matter because what is emerging is that the allegations about the enormous input the two organisations have had are not supported by the evidence. And in fact you and Rosie51 are now contradicting each other. So stop trying to dodge the bullet and explain to me who has the influence in schools? and is VS just the exception who hasn't had all the input she's supposed to have had? or is the whole idea that these two organisations are busy converting people just a figment of the imagination?

Glorianny, this is a load of waffle in an attempt at a 'gotcha'.

(a) Rosie and I are allowed to contradict one another. We are two separate people, and do not post as one.

(b) Whether or not VS understands the input of organisations into schools or not is neither here nor there. It is the fact that she claims not to know about them that I find disconcerting. That's all. Rosie may have other thoughts on the matter, which last time I looked was ok.

(c) I thought you were of the opinion that telling people what they think is not ok?

(d) as I have already stated, I do not work, and never have worked in a school. My understanding of the input of the two organisations in question is that Stonewall provides general 'training' on what it sees as diversity, and gives its kite mark to organisations that fulfil its demands. Mermaids has a more advisory role, aimed at children and young people. Where adults are concerned it concentrates on answering questions from those who support children and young people, which may take the form of very specific training on single-issues. But, as I said, I may be wrong about that. As I have never worked with under 16s I have had no need to know the detail. I am far more concerned about the advice given by Mermaids to callers, who, on the whole, are minors, and who are encouraged to deceive their parents.

If I am mistaken (perfectly possible) it is not 'because someone actually working in a school knows little about them', which is what is confusing. It doesn't make sense. It is because, well, I am mistaken. I don't think I am though. Instead of doing the 'gotcha' thing, why not tell me whether you think I am right or wrong?

17.36.06 first paragraph VS