Scarf in Suffragette colours not allowed in Scottish Parliament.

Trans women are not women and never will be - a man cannot become a woman, its a biological impossibility. That said, I am more than happy for trans people to live their lives as they choose, and that they have equal rights under the law. Its the noisy and abusive activists who are demanding more than equal rights, and they do their cause - and that of the majority of trans people who just want to quietly get on with their lives - no favours. Believing that a man cannot becomes a woman, or vice versa, is NOT a far right view. It is in fact the view of the vast majority of people, it is also scientific fact. I've noticed people bring out the "far right" argument when they have nothing sensible to say - a small step away from invoking Godwin's Law.

Many of the views of trans activists fit exactly with the far right views of today and particularly of the past.

Infiltration of existing systems
Removing established rights of other groups
Removing access to help for the vulnerable
Promoting a culture of strength as right
Promoting a culture of bodily perfection
Removal of literature
Depriving those who disagree of their livelihood
Gay erasure
Intimidation in public places

All seen n the past and in trans culture today.

Saetana

Trans women are not women and never will be - a man cannot become a woman, its a biological impossibility. That said, I am more than happy for trans people to live their lives as they choose, and that they have equal rights under the law. Its the noisy and abusive activists who are demanding more than equal rights, and they do their cause - and that of the majority of trans people who just want to quietly get on with their lives - no favours. Believing that a man cannot becomes a woman, or vice versa, is NOT a far right view. It is in fact the view of the vast majority of people, it is also scientific fact. I've noticed people bring out the "far right" argument when they have nothing sensible to say - a small step away from invoking Godwin's Law.

I couldn't agree more, Saetana. Many of us have been saying this for years on here, and it's like plaiting fog.

I agree that the 'right wing' slur is a deliberate attack, and is usually aimed at people who are known to be broadly left in their views, to throw in an extra insult. It's a bit like the 'feminist' one. The idea that women are failed feminists if they stand up for other women and say 'no' to men's wishes is ridiculous, but often heard on here, too.

Lathyrus

Many of the views of trans activists fit exactly with the far right views of today and particularly of the past.

Infiltration of existing systems
Removing established rights of other groups
Removing access to help for the vulnerable
Promoting a culture of strength as right
Promoting a culture of bodily perfection
Removal of literature
Depriving those who disagree of their livelihood
Gay erasure
Intimidation in public places

All seen n the past and in trans culture today.

Yes, Lathyrus. There is also the acceptance (or promotion) of violent attacks on dissenters. It's frightening, isn't it?

What a cold, simplistic, black and white world you live in glory. Stalinist or Maoist springs to mind. You’re either Right or Wrong. You decide along with your minority accolytes. The rest of us are banished to camps where we will be re-educated. Terrifying prospect

Should have added

Target youth
Imply connections with undesirable ethos of other organisations

to that list.

It’s very scarey when you see the parallels and the history of where this goes.

Sorry if this has been mentioned but I have just seen it. Susie Green has resigned. Sone good news.

Iam64

What a cold, simplistic, black and white world you live in glory. Stalinist or Maoist springs to mind. You’re either Right or Wrong. You decide along with your minority accolytes. The rest of us are banished to camps where we will be re-educated. Terrifying prospect

Actually it's a lovely world where no one is pre-judged or vilified because of who they are. Where women can be strong and purposeful and not simply victims, where men can be caring and considerate and not simply aggressive and violent. It's one where people are regarded as individuals and addressed as such, they may dress as they wish and choose their pronouns. Where everyone is valued and no one is ignored. After all if it wasn't I wouldn't still be on any of these threads debating with people whose views are so inflexible would I?

It's so idealistic that it's dangerous

Where women can be strong and purposeful and not be called transphobic for being strong and purposeful?

it's a . . . world where no one is pre-judged or vilified because of who they are

Once again a superb description of what you do, G.

Glorianny

Iam64

What a cold, simplistic, black and white world you live in glory. Stalinist or Maoist springs to mind. You’re either Right or Wrong. You decide along with your minority accolytes. The rest of us are banished to camps where we will be re-educated. Terrifying prospect

Actually it's a lovely world where no one is pre-judged or vilified because of who they are. Where women can be strong and purposeful and not simply victims, where men can be caring and considerate and not simply aggressive and violent. It's one where people are regarded as individuals and addressed as such, they may dress as they wish and choose their pronouns. Where everyone is valued and no one is ignored. After all if it wasn't I wouldn't still be on any of these threads debating with people whose views are so inflexible would I?

It’s a lovely make believe world. 🤔

Now back to reality……..

Lathyrus

Now back to reality……..

Not yet Lathyrus
I’m still enjoying Glorianny’s approval of JKR et al-
all those strong purposeful women that the TRA want to victimise but who refuse to be victims. 👏👏

💗 Glorianny

I don't know how you have patience to stand against what seems to have evolved into the conspiracy theory of the decade and some of the most vile behaviour I have seen on this forum but I'm cheering for you

‘Conspiracy theory of the decade’
Another description of the nonsense peddled by mermaids
Have you read the case report glory and violet

VS what ‘vile behaviour’ (have you) ‘seen on this forum’?

That sounds a tad melodramatic.

More vs VS and just in case you hadn’t noticed, Glorianny mentioned the strong and purposeful women who refuse to be victims. I was enjoying her praise for them.
^ women can be strong and purposeful and not simply victims^
Are you saying that she only meant strong and purposeful ‘women’ like EI or Sonia Sodha and not females?

Not just vile behaviour Fanny some of the most vile behaviour ........ seen on this forum.

Perhaps you could give examples VS.

JFK is strong and purposeful and has been and continues to be vilified. Has anyone said that men cannot be caring and considerate? Has anyone said that men can only be aggressive and violent? Has anyone said that everyone can't dress as they wish and choose their own pronouns?

I do wish that we could have these discussions without posters being accused of saying/doing this they haven't said or done.

Your views are no less flexible Glorianny. It shows you are passionate about this subject, just as we all are.

JFK!!!! JKR.

Has anyone said that everyone can't dress as they wish and choose their own pronouns?

Yes, dress any way you want.

I certainly say that people shouldn't choose their own pronouns, tho.
If it's wanted to stop referring to people's sex all the time, we need a single pronoun for everyone.
But individual pronouns, or even she & he being used wrongly, are ridiculous.

I have been into work today, and notice that the loo that went from Ladies to ‘gender neutral’ is now labelled ‘unisex’. A small thing, and still annoying as the Gents’ is still there, but at least there is no ‘gender’ pretence now, which may be a small step in the right direction.

All the same, the people in the meeting I was at were something like 12 women to 3 men, but all the men used the ‘unisex’ loo rather than walk along the corridor to the Gents’, which is, of course, off limits to women. The room we were in was nearer the ‘unisex’ one, but all the same, the blatant unfairness is dreadful.

The ‘unisex’ loo also has the disabled cubicle, too. So basically it’s blokes in one with both cubicles and urinals and everyone else in the three-cubicles that women can use, shared with the disabled, transpeople and idle men.

My employer did this several years ago. A couple of women rebelled when the grubby way they men left the toilet irritated. They demanded we return to men and women and it worked
What woukd happen now

Ooh, the sign on that door would be sooo tempting Doodledog

Smileless2012

Not just vile behaviour Fanny some of the most vile behaviour ........ seen on this forum.

Perhaps you could give examples VS.

VS anything to add?
It’s really not on accusing decent women of incomparable ‘vile behaviour’ with absolutely nothing to back it up with.
You are not doing yourself any favours