Woman found guilty of raping two women. Remanded in custody for sentence end February

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I can't believe people would sign to remove this and leave nothing in place. Have you even read it?

If you would like policies encouraging staff to use preferred pronouns removed, would you also like policies removed that say staff do not need to tell parents a young person's sexuality if expressed by the young person? Because there are still many parents out there who would abuse or disown their own child for being LGB.

Disgusted at how blind this petition is and relieved it is almost over with very few responses and hopefully less from actual parents of young people.

The cass report is clear that social affirmation is not a neutral act, NHS guidelines now reflect that.
I need to look at the petition in detail but the cass report is nothing to do with sexuality.

The intention is not to leave nothing in place VS, as you'd see on the petition :

"Background information

Dr Cass said in her interim report on how to improve services, provided by the NHS, for children and young people experiencing issues with their gender identity, “it is important to acknowledge that it is not a neutral act” to socially transition a child, there are different views on the benefits versus the harms and ‘better information is needed about the outcomes’.

The school guidance encourages teachers to affirm the social transition of children who say they are trans, to use their chosen pronouns and to avoid misgendering, alongside changing pupils' names and their sex on official school records. We are concerned about this affirmation first approach and the risks it poses to vulnerable children. Emerging evidence advises against this approach and recommends 'watchful waiting'.

Referrals to the Sandyford Clinic have rapidly increased from 37 in 2013 to almost 300 in 2018. In our view, there is little doubt that the schools guidance and affirmation first approach will contribute to further increases in referrals."

"Calling on the Scottish Parliament to urge the Scottish Government to withdraw the 'Supporting transgender young people in schools: guidance for Scottish schools' resource, and await the outcome of the Cass Review before developing a new resource."

(my underlining)

What's your view on the actual topic of the thread, VS?
Dangerous male prisoners being placed in females' prisons?

Yes VioletSky I read it, and because of what FarNorth quoted in particular - “before developing a new resource” was happy to sign.

If you would like policies encouraging staff to use preferred pronouns removed, would you also like policies removed that say staff do not need to tell parents a young person's sexuality if expressed by the young person? Because there are still many parents out there who would abuse or disown their own child for being LGB.
How many times does it need to be said that conflating trans issues with those of gay people is missing the point? Why would staff report something a child says about their developing sexuality to a parent anyway? And why would the fact that someone doesn’t support affirmation of ‘gender’ change by teachers support such an intrusion into children’s privacy? There is a huge difference between going along with (and affirming) a child’s claim to be ‘in the wrong body’ and betraying a confidence about their sexuality. Arguably neither has anything to do with the school anyway.

I don’t know how schools can argue on one hand to remove self-expression from children when it comes to uniforms, make-up, hair styles and so on, yet see so-called ‘gender’ expression as something that has to be indulged.

Adam/Isla is standing up for his rights and aligning himself with children who may be suffering from gender dysphoria.

In arguing agains NS’s U-turn he says,
“It’s not just me, it’s for children who are coming out and who are suffering the worst from other children and their parents which is disgusting.”
Does he see himself as a rôle model for the children and an example of what being trans is about?

Alan Smyth/Smith like obfuscation too.
In an interview with LBC at Westminster, Mr Smith was asked if he thought trans people who are convicted of sex crimes should be in women's jails. He looked away, then replied: "I've nothing to say on that.”

He branded the row over the prison placements of trans double-rapist Isla Bryson - and other male-bodied sex criminals - as “a great big hoopla”, and said there needed to be “a sense of proportion".

And Mr Smith said people needed to remember the criminals who are “having their identities discussed in ways that are really pretty unpleasant.”
More unpleasant than being raped by a man, who then says he’s a woman? Really?

My post above doesn't make sense, sorry. It should read:

'And why would the fact that someone doesn’t support affirmation of ‘gender’ change by teachers mean that they would support such an intrusion into children’s privacy?'

In other words, the fact that someone might want school staff to stop interfering in discussions about 'gender' does not make it any more likely that they would think that teachers should report conversations about children's developing sexuality to parents. Why would it?

In arguing agains NS’s U-turn he says,
“It’s not just me, it’s for children who are coming out and who are suffering the worst from other children and their parents which is disgusting.”
Does he see himself as a rôle model for the children and an example of what being trans is about?
Good grief.

What does he mean by 'suffering the worst'? It sounds a bit like 'most marginalised group in society' (ie meaningless). And yes, putting himself forward as some sort of poster boy is ridiculous. In reality, the reverse is more likely to happen, with references to him being used as a way of bullying. If he really wants to help children (highly unlikely) he should keep as low a profile as possible.

GrannyGravy13

This photo is all over social media?

I've only seen the image on GN but to me it looks like a camel's
toe.

BlueBelle

Sorry Gransgravy my mistake anyway I ll repeat anyone with a penis is not a woman and is firmly a HE

What about hermaphrodites? Which prison would you send them to?

Dinahmo

BlueBelle

Sorry Gransgravy my mistake anyway I ll repeat anyone with a penis is not a woman and is firmly a HE

What about hermaphrodites? Which prison would you send them to?

What do you mean by a hermaphrodite?

I think that if a hermaphrodite became a sex offender, something that is probably unlikely, it would be a genuine case for individual circumstances to prevail. That wouldn't be too onerous as apparently true hermaphrodite or ovo-testicular disorder of sexual differentiation (OVO-DSD) is one of the rarest variety of all inter sex anomalies..

In general, I would say that if the victim is a woman and the offender has male gametes he should go to a male prison, but the point is that people can't 'pretend' to be hermaphrodites based on 'feelings'.

Dinahmo
What about hermaphrodites? Which prison would you send them to?
I never quite understand the distractions of “what ifs” but since you’ve asked, if the hermaphrodite had used a penis to rape, then that would identify them as committing a male crime, so where do you think the prisoner should be incarcerated?

If you mean people with a dsd, they are all Male or female and not some third sex.

That's why I asked for a definition, Galaxy. 'Hermaphrodites' aren't like seahorses.

Indeed.
It's up there with human beings arent clown fish.

Ive answered the thread many times it's not me who took it off topic but now it is.

Yes, get rid of the policy before implementing a new one... written by who by what deadline?

Again, if people aren't happy for school staff to use preferred pronouns without contacting parents... is it ok to know other information about young people like their sexuality and not tell parents? where is the answer to this

Also given that this policy has a main focus on preventing bullying which a lot of LGB and T young people have said is affecting their mental health and their ability to attain good grades or even finish school... why would anyone be happy for there to be no policy in place for any interim?

We have already lost huge amounts of mental heath support for trans young people with no backup plans in place.

Medical intervention is widely denounced on these threads

What exactly do people want in place to support trans youth? Where is that petition?

What does this focus on taking and giving nothing back achieve?

Where is there any space for trans people? Especially in such a huge part of their day at school where their social and emotional development must be protected?

Explain to me how this is in any way inclusive and accepting.

These questions belong in discussion so I'm putting them here but shouldn't it be those willing to sign this petition having those answers first?

If you want to campaign and sign petitions a fundamental understanding of the issue is a requirement or you are acting irresponsibly.

Because there are very serious concerns expressed by the Cass report and are now part of NHS guidelines that social affirmation is not a neutral act.
I actually anticipate that there will be legal action from the detransitioners with regard to this. We dont keep doing something if investigations have shown it is not the best way to approach this.
For me the involvement of parents is a seperate issue, there is not enough evidence that social affirmation isnt doing harm.

There are no answers there galaxy

You need them in order to act responsibly here, signing petitions like this gives you responsibility for the outcome.

The Cass report highlights issues, what does it solve? Much like these threads.

Again, for those who aren't solution based thinkers or do not feel they should be responsible for finding the solutions

Signing this petition makes you responsible and yet you won't be accountable

I cannot empathise with that

I will trust the Cass report and NHS guidelines rather than randoms on the internet. That's my accountability.
Who were you referring to when you said those who arent solution based thinkers?

Galaxy

Indeed.
It's up there with human beings arent clown fish.

I think those who ignored the red flags about the tavistock are accountable, I think those who ignored the red flags around the unexplained rise in girls transitioning are accountable, I think those who ignored the concerns about prisons refuges etc are accountable, and on and on. Luckily I did none of those things.

Galaxy

I will trust the Cass report and NHS guidelines rather than randoms on the internet. That's my accountability.
Who were you referring to when you said those who arent solution based thinkers?

Anyone who disagrees.

*Again, if people aren't happy for school staff to use preferred pronouns without contacting parents... is it ok to know other information about young people like their sexuality and not tell parents? where is the answer to this.

I gave my answer above. Why would a teacher report on a child's sexuality to their parents? What has it got to do with teachers? Young children won't necessarily understand their feelings, and older ones are entitled to privacy.

Also, you persist in linking trans issues with gay issues, and there is no connection. Gender and sexuality are not linked.