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Sunak has used a lot of Political Credit on sorting out the Northern Ireland Protocol deal ...

(216 Posts)
DaisyAnne Sun 26-Feb-23 12:28:00

But will he have the courage to take the whip away from the ERG and others, if they vote against on a three line whip?

Whitewavemark2 Sun 26-Feb-23 12:30:40

Sunak helped make the duff deal - he is only trying to mend something he never helped fix in the first place.

Fleurpepper Sun 26-Feb-23 12:35:11

Well yes, he did. But at least he has admitted it is not working, and something just has to be done. Francois talking absolute bo**ocks this morning. BTW where has he been lately.

It is time Sunak and other One Country Conservatives stood up to the ERG. If it is Sunak, allied to Starmer- so be it.

DaisyAnne Sun 26-Feb-23 13:07:57

I will give people their due for what they do Whitewave. He is trying to make amends.

It doesn't make me want a government of the people who have driven so many into poverty and left them starving and cold. It doesn't make me want to vote for the party that has lost the country hundreds of years of soft power. We were known for usually/often doing the right thing. This last dozen years has destroyed much of that view.

I certainly don't want another government driven by the far-right, so I wonder if he dares to take the whip if they don't vote when it's a three-line one?

I also don't know, as yet, what I think the other lot would do.

DaisyAnne Sun 26-Feb-23 17:43:38

Downing Street has announced that Rishi Sunak and Ursula von der Leyen, the European Commission president, are to meet tomorrow for talks on the Northern Ireland Protocol.

No 10 has said that the two leaders have "agreed to continue their work in person towards shared, practical solutions for the range of complex challenges around the Protocol on Ireland and Northern Ireland".

To be honest this could mean anything but it wouldn't surprise me if an agreement was announced tomorrow. They will want to make a show of it so having Ursula von der Leyen there will help.

All that is left then is to get it through Parliament hmm

Fleurpepper Sun 26-Feb-23 18:15:54

Someone just told me he is sure it is all for show- so he can say 'I truly tried, but can't make it work'. I hope this is not the case. And I so hope he will stand up to the ERG, Johnson and the DUP, and do what is best for the country.

Whitewavemark2 Mon 27-Feb-23 06:39:40

Interesting week.

I suspect that in the final analysis

1. the ECJ will be the ultimate arbiter of any trade disputes in NI.

2. There will still be a wall of some sort between the U.K. and NI

Sunak will try to spin the detail but - The question now is how big will be the revolt by the headbangers?

I’m sure Sunak will be able to get the bill through with Labour support, but the interesting thing will be how weak a Sunak looks by the end of it all.

fancythat Mon 27-Feb-23 06:58:58

Sounds to me, and am quite happy to be told I am wrong, that he cant be getting things far wrong?
Not that many people complaining?

Fleurpepper Mon 27-Feb-23 14:11:38

She knew, and could see it all


Fleurpepper Mon 27-Feb-23 14:39:38


Sounds to me, and am quite happy to be told I am wrong, that he cant be getting things far wrong?
Not that many people complaining?


The DUP and the ERG are complaining, very loud and bitterly, and doing everything they can to scupper his efforts (if his efforts are genuine- as said above, many are saying it is just for show, and just so he can say 'ah well, I tried..').

Whitewavemark2 Mon 27-Feb-23 14:50:10

I think that the focus is now on the DUP, because the issue here is not only the NI protocol, but power sharing and the fact that they are now the minority party in NI - a bitter pill that I think that they are not really prepared to swallow.

Urmstongran Mon 27-Feb-23 14:55:43

7 tests of the DUP otherwise Stormont might not get up and running.

I worry this might all be short term gain (trade) for long term pain (ECHR).

But then maybe just accept an improvement. The EU could have done green lanes and red lanes from the start. There must be something in it for them - otherwise - why now??

Whitewavemark2 Mon 27-Feb-23 15:01:38

The red/green lanes were offered to the U.K. by the EU, but Johnson turned it down.

The U.K. will not be leaving the ECHR and put the GFA into absolute peril.

Grantanow Mon 27-Feb-23 15:02:25

Good on Sunak if he pulls it off and restores Storemont but the DUP are looking for a way out of being deputy to Sinn Fein in NI. The democratic deficit lies in their attitude to election results. Sunak should not hesitate to withdraw the whip from the Tory headbangers or chuck them out of the Party.

Whitewavemark2 Mon 27-Feb-23 15:12:18

Getting Brexit done ………………. Again 😄

Urmstongran Mon 27-Feb-23 15:16:32

I still ask ‘why now’ for these enormous concessions from the EU? Why are they being so conciliatory now??

Whitewavemark2 Mon 27-Feb-23 15:19:46

What enormous concessions?

Urmstongran Mon 27-Feb-23 15:31:34

Oh l I was just repeating what I heard on the news just now ... ‘enormous concessions’.

Let’s face it, Sunak is a ‘money man’ - with the traders and other money men. £££ signs here and €€€ signs in Europe signs will focus minds. We’ve all flatlined following a pandemic and war in the Ukraine.

When the details are published will this just ‘spin’.

Sunak is being dubbed ‘Sellout Sunak’ ...

Whitewavemark2 Mon 27-Feb-23 15:38:48

Listening to Sunak - there is no way that he will take the U.K. out of the ECHR.

Green/red lane confirmed. At last - only took 7 years. Which of course will allow changes to VAT and excise by the U.K. to NI goods.

Stormont break - will have a jurisdiction over new EU laws. I suspect that this will very rarely happen particularly with Sinn Fein as the majority party.

Fleurpepper Mon 27-Feb-23 15:39:53

By some, DUP and ERG- but I believe, supported by the vast majority of the UK, including Labour and others.

The DUP and ERG represent a TINY % of the UK population.

Whitewavemark2 Mon 27-Feb-23 15:41:39

I do like her hair

Fleurpepper Mon 27-Feb-23 15:42:05


The red/green lanes were offered to the U.K. by the EU, but Johnson turned it down.

The U.K. will not be leaving the ECHR and put the GFA into absolute peril.

Why have so many people forgotten this, I wonder. The EU is NOT at fault here. Prof Dougan, all legal experts and experienced international negotiators said it just could not work- but Johnson wanted Brexit done- at any cost whatsover. He and the ERG are entirely at fault here. And Arlene, Paisley and the DUP took the bung to shut up, and now ...

Fleurpepper Mon 27-Feb-23 15:42:42


I do like her hair


Whitewavemark2 Mon 27-Feb-23 15:45:06

I do! The EU bod I am talking about😄

Whitewavemark2 Mon 27-Feb-23 15:46:06