The Johnsons baby announcement

Baggs

We need to stop talking about mothers of young children "going back to work". They are at work looking after their children. It really pisses me off that so few people recognise bringing up one's children oneself as a good job to do. I think its importance is very under appreciated.

Well said.

If looking after children at a nursery, being a childminder is considered valuable work why is looking after your own children considered to be less so? Even lazy or demeaning!

FannyCornforth

And they are both teachers.
My initial point was that working class men with blue collar jobs earned enough to amply provide for his family

No they didn’t!
My Dad was a postman and our house was council, we had no car either and hardly any holidays unless you count staying with relatives.Mum ( now 80) had to make a little money go a long long way.We ate, but hardly ever had any new clothes or outings.People only just managed it wasn’t some golden age.
Difference now is people want so much more and feel cheated if they can’t have meals and coffee out and drinks nights and holidays abroad along with everything else.DD enjoys going to work, says it’s great to get away from nappies ( muggins here has to do it!)

Oreo

FannyCornforth

And they are both teachers.
My initial point was that working class men with blue collar jobs earned enough to amply provide for his family

No they didn’t!
My Dad was a postman and our house was council, we had no car either and hardly any holidays unless you count staying with relatives.Mum ( now 80) had to make a little money go a long long way.We ate, but hardly ever had any new clothes or outings.People only just managed it wasn’t some golden age.
Difference now is people want so much more and feel cheated if they can’t have meals and coffee out and drinks nights and holidays abroad along with everything else.DD enjoys going to work, says it’s great to get away from nappies ( muggins here has to do it!)

Difference now is people want so much more...

I think that's true - but then, there is so much more available for consumption that we didn't have 50 / 60 years ago!

And, we are encouraged to consume - in-your-face advertisements pop up on every online site; supermarkets full of all kinds of 'stuff' (the 'middle isle' in, what is it - Aldi or one of the other low-budget supermarkets?) on display.

I also remember - it wasn't that long ago - pensioners being encourage by a few economists / journalists and other assorted bods to spend their money into the economy rather than (as they implied) "selfishly" saving it!

In a way, it's hardly surprising that people want "things" and feel deprived if they can't have them.

Even a child's birthday party - something that used to be quite a simple affair - is now commercialised with all kinds of additional goodies to make the event 'special'.

Thrift is a thing of the past.

No it’s not surprising that they want them and feel they can’t live without them.Mind you I used to want things too, still do but can’t afford them so live within my means with little debt.

Thrift is a thing of the past.

Thrift is the very last thing that our capitalist consumer society needs or wants. Consumption is the thing that 'grows' the economy and we (meaning the government and, loosely, the population at large) are fixated on 'growth'.

I'm not saying this to justify over consumption, in fact it has worried me for years, but, despite continual warnings of the contribution to climate change and harmful pollution made by it there is very little serious effort made to change our consumption. And I can understand that because an enormous number of jobs depend on it. What happens to them?

A whole new way of thinking and active change is needed.

Which obviously would relate to how and when people work in paid employment... and how 'work' is shared between people raising families.

Maizie Thrift is big business and can support a lot of jobs. Look at how many people work in the green industries, reusing, and recycling materials. These are not domestic jobs reusing and recycling domestic waste, but industry also now recycles and reuses.

When our local coal fired power station was demolished, reccling materials formed a key part of the demolition contract and something like 80-90,000 tons of different materials were recovered and recycled. All this recycling employs 10s of thousands of people

There is room for this to expand. More electrical goods should be repairable,

There are a lot of jobs in thrift - and there could be many more

I don't disagree with you, MOnica, but it would be instructive to know the comparative sizes of the 'thrift' and 'consumption' sectors. I suspect that the latter is very much the larger.

I still think the economy can evolve and adapt to a non growth economy, based on recyclingand reusing, almost everything. One of the fastestgrowing sectors of the economy recently has been the services industry. My neighbours employ cleaners and gardners, something we never thought of, even though both of us, in our time, had well paid professional jobs and were time poor. Look at the number working in child care, I managed without it, as it wasn't available - and those are just immediate domestic service jobs. Coffee shops are booming, I cannot ever remember even thinking about taking a bought coffee into work, the shops selling them weren't there.

The economy may change to meet new circumstances, as it has since time immoral.