Can a woman have a penis?

I forget people can't see past UK
Why have you forgotten that? On a UK forum it seems natural that we will mainly discuss how things work in our culture. Stats for Peru or Greenland are not necessarily going to tell us much about what’s happening here, are they? If you have a source to back up your claims, where are they from?

I'm an intersectional feminist so....
So what? It’s not a free pass to say what you like and expect to be believed, is it?

Where is the thread about it galaxy?
If I start a thread about flying saucers on London Bridge will that mean they are there? You have a very strange idea about evidence.

There are many on my Intersectional feminist group
Many what? Plastic surgeons? statistics? Threads? If so, I’m still confused. Threads about children getting plastic surgery? Again, that proves nothing, but if there are any verified stats in there, why not share them?

Look at Ovarit... Their brand preaches feminism, almost every thread is about trans... It's just not healthy and it's harming women
I don’t know what Ovarit is - should I? Whatever it is, if Ovarit is saying that trans obsession is unhealthy and harmful to women? If so, I agree. I wish the whole ‘identity pick and mix’ would calm down and children could grow up without the pressure of choosing from hundreds of identities. Maybe there would be fewer sufferers from anxiety and eating disorders if meddling adults would let them be children. I absolutely believe that the trans lobby is harmful to women and girls. We should have safe spaces and the right to congregate with other women- without men in dresses pushing in, taking over and spreading fear.

Hear hear Doodledog 👏

It's the forum set up after platforms removed GC feminist groups for hate speech, I see threads from there posted elsewhere at times

No threads about the fact that teens are having plastic surgery as well as Botox and fillers

Of course we should be teaching children they are beautiful as a previous comment said but where is this in practise?

Also it doesn't help gender dysphoria so we need more mental health support until they become adults and then we need a working solution. At the moment, that working solution is transition... Conversion therapy doesn't work. So who has a different workable answer?

And yes preventing people mistakenly transitioning is important but mistakes are not proof transitioning is the wrong choice for others

But where is the solution based thinking. Where is the empathy and understanding?

What actual good does running around shouting about chromosomes and what's in people's pants do?

No good at all.

Your safe spaces are protected. Your sports should be and will be protected. Your prisons are being protected

Yet the obsession remains and it's at great detriment to women in general and the far bigger picture

But hey... Let's just have another thread saying the same old thing

Friendly reminder

I don't read or answer rudeness anymore

I'm like Santa, bad behaviour gets no presence

The changes in 'our' sport for example are due to some very brave women 'talking' about this Navratilova and Sharron Davies for example. So yes we are going to keep on talking. It's interesting how the talking about it has always been problematic, almost as if when people hear the issues they will say hold on a moment. Far better to be quiet sshh.

That's strange galaxy really because every single person I know who is trans inclusive also think that sports was an issue... Including trans people

Yet you think the GC should get the credit?

That's not how it works

Many people are working towards common sense based solutions to issues

Violetsky
In your post @08.01. you use the word your a lot.
With your love of inclusivity shouldn’t that be our

You are the one saying the same old thing, VS. Realistically a forum for self-declared Intersectional Feminists is unlikely to be anything other than biased in favour of the idea that women are not important as a group - that’s the tenet that underpins Intersectional Feminism.

It’s not for us to come up with solutions for the problem of men saying that they are women, and wanting to be in our spaces! Why would we do that? Anyway, where are your solutions? The shouting about ‘what’s in people’s pants’ comes from the trans lobby, which sees women as lesser than men. Pretending that anyone who says that biological sex is important must be penis-obsessed is condescending, sexist and would be disingenuous if it were’t just a cliche from the playbook that is repeated without much thought.

Are you so far removed from caring about women that you have now distanced yourself altogether? Sports, spaces and prisons are ‘ours’ now, but not yours too? And no, incidentally- they are not protected- saying doesn’t make it so.

Not interested in credit . Interested in talking and discussing without someone saying stop talking about this. A tactic used over and over again.

Galaxy

Not interested in credit . Interested in talking and discussing without someone saying stop talking about this. A tactic used over and over again.

As is ‘say what I want to hear or I will flounce or ignore you (but not until after I’ve had my say).

Claiming that those transitioning is a drop in the ocean when compared to the numbers of children having nose surgery and breast implants, with full parental consent, lends nothing to the discussion VS and only serves to undermine your argument, when you have no evidence to support it.

As does your response that you wont read or answer rudeness anymore. No one has been rude when requesting your source for this 'information' yet you are either unwilling or unable to provide any evidence.

I do also think people forget what age we are living in, so there are thousands of clips and tweets showing women speaking about sports and prisons etc and thousands of screenshots calling them bigots. Stonewalls statement on men in womens rugby is there for all to see.

Well no, Terri- the women I am talking about have no penis, let alone in a state of arousal. And they are no risk to anyone- and the kindest, gentlest of women. They wanted to be women partly for this reason, because they did not want to be associated with the violence of men, sadly.

This is an extraordinary statement - given that trans ideology is TWAW. So in effect you're saying that they are not really women, just wanted to be women partly because of the violence of men.

From what you say they've suffered a lot - I hope they're happy now.

Doodledog

Galaxy
Not interested in credit Interested in talking and discussing without someone saying stop talking about this. A tactic used over and over again.
As is ‘say what I want to hear or I will flounce or ignore you (but not until after I’ve had my say)

Or
I won’t answer you since I don’t like the way you put things-meaning I haven't got an answer.^

A very interesting and Socratic approach LadyHonoriaDedlock! But does it not depend on the initial judgment of the person recording the subject's status at birth? It's clear that doubtful assignments have been made because the external sexual features were uncertain in the recorder's opinion or because elements of both sexes were present and an arbitrary decision was taken. Just asking.

And can we say that a 'surrogate penis' is identical to a natural penis? It may look the same but is it of exactly the same construction and is it functionally identical in all respects?

Here is link for Ovarit
There is a wealth of information on there, very interesting
ovarit.com/all/hot

It’s for feminists who aren’t ‘intersectional’

Thanks, Fanny. I'll check it out later.

VioletSky

Friendly reminder

I don't read or answer rudeness anymore

I'm like Santa, bad behaviour gets no presence

I don't see anyone being rude to you - just questioning your assumptions, as you are likewise questioning theirs.

What actual good does running around shouting about chromosomes and what's in people's pants do?

As this is the essence of the debate, I think it does a lot of 'good' in that people make it clear why they believe that a TW is not a woman. And that is why - in certain circumstances - it matters very much "what's in people's pants".

But where is the solution based thinking. Where is the empathy and understanding?

I've seen comments that have shown both empathy and understanding towards TW (and TM). I think quite a few of us accept that many individuals don't identify with the expectations thrust on them because of their biological sex. I have, personally, thrown off some of those assumptions myself in order to live the life I want to live.

It is not 'rude' to disagree. It's not rude either to ask for facts or information to back-up claims made.

Just come back, got fed up yesterday and gave myself a rest.
Thank you for your contributions Doodledog as usual I agree with what you write about this subject.
Thinking back to yesterday when I started the thread (was it only yesterday?) I realised the discussion was veering towards the trans supporters (for want of a better description) appearing to believe that those like myself are trans haters. That’s how it seemed to come over. I will categorically say I’m not a trans hater and I think it unlikely that anyone else on here is either. My original question was can a woman have a penis
and I asked that question because the previous evening I’d seen Ed Davey give an interview in which he claimed that a woman can have a penis. I also know that Keir Starmer seems to have struggled with this question when it was put to him. I didn’t mention Rishi Sunak because I had no idea what he thinks about this question. Posters have said on this thread that he has said that women cannot have a penis. So, three different politicians, three different views.
Anyway my point is, I didn’t ask if trans women were nice, I didn’t ask if they could have gender reassignment (they can) and I didn’t ask if we should all be kinder to them, nor if it’s possible to tell who is a trans woman (sometimes it is, sometimes it isn’t.) I simply asked if a woman can have a penis.
I would never support bullying, harassment, unkindness nor lack of acceptance of trans women, so long as they are not bullying, harassing, being unkind, or not accepting of natural born women. I have no trans family members but I have met trans women in my life and always found them to be normal, nice people. But that wasn’t what I asked.
I totally support the human rights of all people including trans people. What I don’t support is people with a natural penis being in women’s spaces, even though I realise it’s perfectly possible that I’ve been in women’s toilets alongside trans women and not known it. The vast majority of trans women are perfectly law abiding citizens, but what do we do about those few who are not?
I don’t know the answer but I do know that a woman cannot have a penis and is therefore not able to rape another woman but a small minority of trans women do rape other women. Rape is defined in law as penetration by a penis, anything else is sexual assault.
Anyway that’s the end of my ramblings and thoughts. As you were.

We are defined by our bodies, not our minds. A man has a penis, a woman doesn't.

Have just seen the sky news interview with annalise Dodds from Labour, a really clear no, and saying we need to be clear about the difference between sex and gender. If that's their approach then they have been listening.

Maddie there is no need to explain. It happens every time. The same people come on to turn the discussion into one about trans rights and accuse everyone else of being obsessed with 'what is in people's pants', then moan that threads go over the 'same old, same old' and complain of rudeness. Accusations of bullying are usually not too far behind, particularly if they are asked to verify their assertions and when they refuse to answer simple questions.

To coin a phrase: too sensible for GN maddyone