Nearly 1 million children faced destitution in the UK in 2022..

There seems to be some confusion between destitution and deprivation on this thread.

Destitution = Extreme want of resources or the means of subsistence; complete poverty. (that's what the report is about, poverty)

Deprivation in the sense that it is used sociologically, comparing one group to other groups:

Relative deprivation is the lack of resources to sustain the diet, lifestyle, activities and amenities that an individual or group are accustomed to or that are widely encouraged or approved in the society to which they belong.

People who are in deprived areas aren't necessarily destitute. The two words are not synonymous.

Galaxy

And in addition to funding shortfall nurseries/ early years settings are having serious problems with recruitment which is impacting on support for children with disabilities.

and adults with disabilities!

I agree with lucky girl too

Luckygirl13 just wanted to say I agree 100% with your posts.

And in addition to funding shortfall nurseries/ early years settings are having serious problems with recruitment which is impacting on support for children with disabilities.

Glorianny

Callistemon21

A quick online search shows that there are still baby clinics in the U.K

There are clinics here, but they don't seem to be the same. They are run by the practice nurses and an appointment is necessary. More like a check-up than a social occasion.

The number of health visitors has dropped dramatically and they consider the service is not suitable. It's complicated because some are employed by the NHS and some by other organisations However what is absolutely certain is that the support many of us had when we had children is no longer there. ihv.org.uk/news-and-views/news/health-visitor-workforce-numbers-in-england-reach-an-all-time-low/
It will of course be children born into poverty who will suffer the most, many of them will be underfed and some will be abused
^Despite health visitors’ best efforts, families are being left without the support that they need, and the consequences have been catastrophic for some families.^

It used to be an enjoyable social occasion, friends were made, some lifelong.

The last Health Visitor I saw was over 35 years ago, she was dismissive and unhelpful. She made a perfunctory visit when we moved here, I tried to voice my concerns about DC3 and she airily said she'd be fine and I never saw the HV again.

ronib

Luckygirl3 but families on one salary paying either rent or mortgages especially in the SE will be tipped into economic deprivation?
The government does have payments for families to help with housing benefits etc and next year is introducing free childcare for 15 hours a week for children over 2 years. Children over 3 now have 30 hours free childcare. So seems deliberate policy to encourage two income families?

But nurseries are closing because the money the government is supplying is not enough, and they would need to increase the cost to parents to cover the shortfall. When this isn't possible they close.
ndna.org.uk/news/childcare-crisis-98-4-of-nurseries-losing-1000s-due-to-funding-shortfall/

Callistemon21

^A quick online search shows that there are still baby clinics in the U.K^

There are clinics here, but they don't seem to be the same. They are run by the practice nurses and an appointment is necessary. More like a check-up than a social occasion.

The number of health visitors has dropped dramatically and they consider the service is not suitable. It's complicated because some are employed by the NHS and some by other organisations However what is absolutely certain is that the support many of us had when we had children is no longer there. ihv.org.uk/news-and-views/news/health-visitor-workforce-numbers-in-england-reach-an-all-time-low/
It will of course be children born into poverty who will suffer the most, many of them will be underfed and some will be abused
Despite health visitors’ best efforts, families are being left without the support that they need, and the consequences have been catastrophic for some families.

I believe so ronib. If that enables people to work rather than claim benefits I fully support it. Work should pay more than benefits.

Luckygirl3 but families on one salary paying either rent or mortgages especially in the SE will be tipped into economic deprivation?
The government does have payments for families to help with housing benefits etc and next year is introducing free childcare for 15 hours a week for children over 2 years. Children over 3 now have 30 hours free childcare. So seems deliberate policy to encourage two income families?

The government’s policy is that work should pay more than benefits - if you are able to work then you should. Do you consider that’s wrong Lucky?

ronib - that is not deprivation - it is unfortunate, but not deprivation. which is far far worse than the scenario you describe.

I ask again - what has this government done to improve the lot of the poor?

Okay deprivation is caused by rising inflation, low wages and increasing fuel and food prices. However I met a granny recently who was sharing her 3 bedroom cottage with her married daughter, son in law and 2 grandchildren. Daughter was a stay at home mother and son in law not in a well paid job. They managed.
So deprivation will be handled differently according to circumstances?

MaizieD

^But in many cases deprivation isn't caused by poor parenting - it's caused by lack of money Parents could go to any number of parenting classes, but it wouldn't improve the state of their bank accounts.^

I love the way nearly every poster is steadfastly ignoring this extremely salient point. 🤔

Prices have gone up across the board, particularly energy costs. If you are already on a limited budget any price increase can be the proverbial straw that breaks the camels back

Whilst in principle I do no agree with Universal Credit to top up low wages (employers should pay their employees a decent wage, which in turn helps with a happy and more productive workforce, win win situation) it is a lifeline for many families.

I can only repeat my earlier post it is never the child’s fault

But in many cases deprivation isn't caused by poor parenting - it's caused by lack of money Parents could go to any number of parenting classes, but it wouldn't improve the state of their bank accounts.

I love the way nearly every poster is steadfastly ignoring this extremely salient point. 🤔

ronib

Growstuff the consultant medic I spoke to said full time was the norm but perhaps she meant for her particular job? Still much shorter maternity leave than here.

That's not what my Dutch friend says.

This article (and others I've read) support that:

www.dutchnews.nl/2022/09/most-mothers-never-go-back-to-full-time-work-survey-shows/#:~:text=Some%2070%25%20of%20women%20in,SCP%20researcher%20Wil%20Portegijs%20said.

That is not a rhetorical question.

And what has this government done to help with any of this?

Callistemon21 Barnados works with children who are the main carers to their parents and siblings. This category of children is known about but for some reason, ignored by governments. I think it’s a disgrace.

For sure, children with only one parent are likely to have less help and attention from adults than children with two parents. They might also be vulnerable emotionally as well as economically. It's a hard one to measure.

A quick online search shows that there are still baby clinics in the U.K

There are clinics here, but they don't seem to be the same. They are run by the practice nurses and an appointment is necessary. More like a check-up than a social occasion.

ronib

Joseann interesting that you have not considered the impact of mental illness on family life. Not just you of course … but the majority of politicians who speak around the subject. Also impact of being a child Carer …..

ronib, did you see the child carers on a news item yesterday? One 12 year old boy was taking sole care of his mother, a young girl had been the carer for her mother and younger siblings since she was 11, doing everything including washing, ironing, cooking etc.

There seems to be little in the way of help for these children

Yet again, no fathers appeared to be present.

Callistemon21

Whitewavemark2

ronib

Well the beauty of the Dutch system is that all mothers can access support and six weeks is a long time to wait when in crisis. Help given in the first 8 days makes much better sense.
I am surprised that Angela Rayner isn’t looking into this type of intervention or perhaps she is?

But you see, we used to have that sort of help in the U.K. - as far as we are concerned the Dutch are reinventing the wheel. After giving birth to my children, I was visited by the local midwife for 10 days I think and after there were weekly meetings in the local health centre, where mums could get advice, help and support if necessary. If mums failed to turn up at the weekly meetings, the nurse knew enough about her mums to know who might be in difficulties etc, and pay them a visit or speak to them in the road etc.

Trashed by the Tories.

Yes, there were the baby clinics, staffed by health visitors where you could go weekly to get baby weighed, buy milk etc if you couldn't breastfeed, ask for advice get told off if your baby didn't gain weight and meet other new mums for a chat.

A quick online search shows that there are still baby clinics in the U.K.

I have one near me (within walking distance)

Whitewavemark2

ronib

Well the beauty of the Dutch system is that all mothers can access support and six weeks is a long time to wait when in crisis. Help given in the first 8 days makes much better sense.
I am surprised that Angela Rayner isn’t looking into this type of intervention or perhaps she is?

But you see, we used to have that sort of help in the U.K. - as far as we are concerned the Dutch are reinventing the wheel. After giving birth to my children, I was visited by the local midwife for 10 days I think and after there were weekly meetings in the local health centre, where mums could get advice, help and support if necessary. If mums failed to turn up at the weekly meetings, the nurse knew enough about her mums to know who might be in difficulties etc, and pay them a visit or speak to them in the road etc.

Trashed by the Tories.

Yes, there were the baby clinics, staffed by health visitors where you could go weekly to get baby weighed, buy milk etc if you couldn't breastfeed, ask for advice get told off if your baby didn't gain weight and meet other new mums for a chat.

Yes of course and if they dont the government should ensure those children are protected financially, even if magically that happens those children will still experience disadvantage compared to those with non absent fathers. If I remember rightly the impact is particularly significant for boys.

I can empathise with struggling single mothers even though I had no personal experience of that and I can get very angry on their behalf.
Absent fathers should be made to pay up.