Starmer’s Dilemma Over Palestinian Situation

Callistemon21

More copy and paste.

I am beginning to think the poster is a bot

GrannyGravy13

Callistemon21

More copy and paste.

I am beginning to think the poster is a bot

I was asked about Netanyahu,s corruption. Well in this bit taken from Andrew Feinstein’s piece it clearly sets it out just how corrupt Netanyahu and his ministers are, with details, much better than I could write.

So what do you think of Netanyahu

What do you think would happen if Starmer changed tack and said there should be a ceasefire Grany?
The answer is nothing as neither Starmer or Sunak have any leverage with Israel or hamas.
So anyone resigning is doing it as a point of their own principle, or rather taking the Muslim side over the Jewish side is what it boils down to.

Anniel

This piece comes from the Conservative Party newsletter and is very even handed about Sir Keir’s awkward position. To be fair he has stared down the position of his Muslim MPs and Councillors so is taking a real decision.

Please acknowledge that this article sounds fairly sympathetic towards him.

conservativehome.com/2023/10/28/starmers-middle-east-dilemma-there-is-far-more-at-stake-here-than-the-future-of-a-single-political-leader/

So what do Grans think?

He cannot be on the side of a terrorist organisation. Hamas started this, with the outcome known to them, they can then plead victim. The only victims are the murderous incursion into Israel, unknow by stupid students on marches, and the victims of their incursuon on both sides. The finding of hand grenades and war plans next to childrens rooms, the amoury next to a beach., shows Starmer, for only once in his career, made a right move.

Keir Starmer has made the right decision. Many in his party have made the wrong one.

Grany

GrannyGravy13

Callistemon21

More copy and paste.

I am beginning to think the poster is a bot

I was asked about Netanyahu,s corruption. Well in this bit taken from Andrew Feinstein’s piece it clearly sets it out just how corrupt Netanyahu and his ministers are, with details, much better than I could write.

So what do you think of Netanyahu

It's still just one persons opinion Grany. That doesn't make it a truth.

Freya
The only victims are the murderous incursion into Israel,
Not the 10,000 Palestinians who have died?
Not the estimated 50,000 who have been driven out of northern Gaza? Many of those were refugees living in camps who had been driven from their original homes by Israel and are once again having to move.
Who are the real victims?

That’s a silly thing to say Glorianny. Of course, all the civilians caught up in this war are the victims - there are no ‘real’ victims.

Casdon

That’s a silly thing to say Glorianny. Of course, all the civilians caught up in this war are the victims - there are no ‘real’ victims.

"real" as distinct from the "only" Freya has identified?
I don't think saying "only victims" shows any idea that all civilians are victims. But it is interesting that it is my "real" you have chosen to focus on.

I was making the point that all victims are victims Glorianny, it doesn’t matter what side they are on, or if they aren’t on any side.

Casdon

I was making the point that all victims are victims Glorianny, it doesn’t matter what side they are on, or if they aren’t on any side.

So why not make it to Freya?

I wasn’t excluding what Freya said, I don’t agree with her either, although I do think that Hamas started this, and cannot have done so without knowing that it would provoke a massive backlash against their own people.
However, whatever Freya said it doesn’t excuse your silly comment, does it, it’s not a game of Top Trumps we are talking about here?

It wouldn’t matter to Grany or Gloriannie if Keir Starmer decided a ceasefire had become necessary. Nothing he does or says makes either of them support him as the leader of the party most Labour Party members hope to see as the next prime minister.

Iam64

It wouldn’t matter to Grany or Gloriannie if Keir Starmer decided a ceasefire had become necessary. Nothing he does or says makes either of them support him as the leader of the party most Labour Party members hope to see as the next prime minister.

Oh I don't know. I might start to think that the man has actually got some moral principles, even though it took a long time to find them.

I think the Far Left are weaponizing Gaza to attack Starmer because he has brought the Labour Party to the point of electability which it never achieved under Corbyn.

Corbyn and moral principles ?

Grantanow sorry to be simple but why would the far left oppose Starmer as the next prime minister? Surely he is a better choice for the far left than Sunak?
For sure Gaza is being weaponised but by many different factions?

The far left tend to hate the centrists more than they hate the Tories, to be fair that's also true the other way round.

Well I'm not "weaponising Gaza" I've been concerned with Israeli policies and their effect for a long time. This war was not the beginning for me. I find the concept that anyone is "weaponising" the situation completely unacceptable. It's fine to disagree with someone but casting aspersions on their reasons is not.
I'm disappointed that any Labour politician would not support a people who are living under an apartheid government.

Grany

GrannyGravy13

Callistemon21

More copy and paste.

I am beginning to think the poster is a bot

I was asked about Netanyahu,s corruption. Well in this bit taken from Andrew Feinstein’s piece it clearly sets it out just how corrupt Netanyahu and his ministers are, with details, much better than I could write.

So what do you think of Netanyahu

thank you Grany. Exactly what my Jewish friends tell me. Nothing, but nothing, puts Israeli and Jewish lives more at risk than Netanyahu.

More twaddle.
Hamas not only put Jewish lives at risk, it took them, and in the most horrible ways anyone could ever think of.
BN may not be popular it’s true, but to say ‘nothing but nothing puts Israeli and Jewish lives at risk ‘ than him is plainly ridiculous.

Grantanow

I think the Far Left are weaponizing Gaza to attack Starmer because he has brought the Labour Party to the point of electability which it never achieved under Corbyn.

This.

It’s another stick to beat him with.They are so concerned with doing everything to promote the far left that they may only be satisfied if he loses the next GE.Then they’ll say it’s because he isn’t far left enough.Crazy stuff.

He’s showing principles by not allowing himself to be cowed by resignations .

Glorianny surely if as you say you have been involved with Israeli policies and their effects for some time, you will understand that whether anyone on this forum thinks you personally are weaponising the Gaza conflict is quite irrelevant. Do you not think that there are a multitude of players at a country level who are weaponising this situation? Whether you are in favour or not of which way the weaponising is being played is a separate discussion?