What will save the Tory party?

I watched QT last night and Peter Hitchens doesn't hold out hope for either Labour or Conservatives.

Politics has changed so dramatically with the onset of social media.

For the life of me I can't understand anyone wanting to enter the political arena

I intend to vote Reform at the next GE. I lent Boris my vote for Brexit. The Tories are in the middle of an internecine mess. Cohesion is non existent. Cameron will be pushing for the One Nation middle ground but Sunak’s a dead duck that’s for sure. Tories are fighting amongst themselves. Some MP’s are panicking - they know they’re about to lose their seats.

If Sunak is given the heave-ho by the 1922 Committee in the NY (unlikely) then possibly fresh talent like Badenoch or Mourdant could save (some) of the day at a GE and stop a total wipe out.

As it is it’s Labour’s to lose.

My monies on Penny Mourdant as next leader, but not until after the GE

The next General Election doesn't have to be held until January 2025 so I've read. I predict Sunak will get his marching orders very soon and the members will vote in Suella Braverman to be the new leader and new PM 🙏 perhaps just wishful thinking on my part but I would vote Conservative at the next election if this were the case and not Reform. The big mistake Sunak made was getting rid of her.

Casdon

ronib

Casdon pmqs is one of life’s mysteries - no answer is ever given to any question. It’s a complete misnomer.
Waffle House more like.

You are I presume joking- it’s the most insight we get into what’s happening in parliament, widely quoted in the media every week. Where else do you think the electorate form their impression of individual politicians and parties and form political views than from the media?

And therein lies the problem - these days, the media have the power to make or break politicians more than ever before - Boris Johnson is a prime example. The media are as dangerous now, perhaps even more so, than the trade unions were in the 1970s.

Whitewavemark2

I’ve just been browsing the most recent polls and whilst I don’t for one minute believe that Labour will get a 270 majority as predicted, it does seem a huge mountain for the Tories to climb.

They are clearly hanging on and on in the hope things will start to improve, but every new initiative just seems to make it worse.

What on earth do Tory supporters think will save them from a wipe out?

Perhaps what might save them is if they stop focusing on policies that they think might save them, and instead concentrate on those things that a huge majority of the public are worried about.

Of course immigration is important - but so is the ever-increasing cost of living, the unaffordable hikes in utility prices, the dire state of the NHS, ambulances unable to answer emergencies because they're queued up outside hospitals, the crisis in mental-health services, the almost daily reports of stabbings, the lack of affordable houses to rent or buy, zero-hour contracts... the list is endless.

If Sunak's Rwanda deal goes through - will it make one scrap of difference to any of these issues?

They have abandoned traditional Tory politics and the electorate have had enough.

This.

I get the distinct impression that not even the tories are running the Conservatives.
So until they have a strong leader who is prepared to break whatever needs to be broken, they may continue to run around like headless chickens.

Casdon no I was not joking about pmqs. It’s quite often reminiscent of a bad Punch and Judy show. You might think it is how Parliament conducted business about 200 years ago but to my mind, it needs reform. It hasn’t served its function of holding the pm to account at all.

For one thing the PM needs to actually answer the questions put to him or her. If someone lies they should be made to tell the truth at the next PMQT. And these sycophantic questions from Tory back benchers need to stop.

ronib

Casdon no I was not joking about pmqs. It’s quite often reminiscent of a bad Punch and Judy show. You might think it is how Parliament conducted business about 200 years ago but to my mind, it needs reform. It hasn’t served its function of holding the pm to account at all.

I don’t see it like that. It has flaws, but you see the reality of how parliament conducts its business, warts and all. The public is entitled to that.

What are "traditional Tory politics"?

Nicenanny3

The next General Election doesn't have to be held until January 2025 so I've read. I predict Sunak will get his marching orders very soon and the members will vote in Suella Braverman to be the new leader and new PM 🙏 perhaps just wishful thinking on my part but I would vote Conservative at the next election if this were the case and not Reform. The big mistake Sunak made was getting rid of her.

You know you should! Vote Reform!

GrannyGravy13

My monies on Penny Mourdant as next leader, but not until after the GE

If I were Penny Mordaunt, I'd accept the leadership and immediately call an election. The Conservatives would lose. She wouldn't be PM, but quite frankly I wouldn't want to be at the moment. I'd spend the next five years trying to get an electable Conservative team together, developing some strategies which the electorate actually wants and have fun attacking Labour from the other side of the House.

Casdon

ronib

Casdon no I was not joking about pmqs. It’s quite often reminiscent of a bad Punch and Judy show. You might think it is how Parliament conducted business about 200 years ago but to my mind, it needs reform. It hasn’t served its function of holding the pm to account at all.

I don’t see it like that. It has flaws, but you see the reality of how parliament conducts its business, warts and all. The public is entitled to that.

It's not the reality of how parliament conducts its business. It's pure performance.

The real work is done in the committee stage of Bills where they are closely scrutinised, and the holding of ministers to account is done by the various 'Select Committees.

Even so, the party of government with a large majority is able to control the timetable of the Commons so as to evade any real public debate or meaningful scrutiny of Bills by MPs. It's rarely that any other party can influence legislation.

At the moment, the rather more independent Hose of Lords has had the greatest effect on influencing proposed legislation.

MaizieD

Casdon

ronib

Casdon no I was not joking about pmqs. It’s quite often reminiscent of a bad Punch and Judy show. You might think it is how Parliament conducted business about 200 years ago but to my mind, it needs reform. It hasn’t served its function of holding the pm to account at all.

I don’t see it like that. It has flaws, but you see the reality of how parliament conducts its business, warts and all. The public is entitled to that.

It's not the reality of how parliament conducts its business. It's pure performance.

The real work is done in the committee stage of Bills where they are closely scrutinised, and the holding of ministers to account is done by the various 'Select Committees.

Even so, the party of government with a large majority is able to control the timetable of the Commons so as to evade any real public debate or meaningful scrutiny of Bills by MPs. It's rarely that any other party can influence legislation.

At the moment, the rather more independent Hose of Lords has had the greatest effect on influencing proposed legislation.

That wasn’t my point though Maisie, I was talking about how the electorate view the politicians, there’s not much coverage of the grind committees, but PMQ is pored over and reported every week, so that’s what people see and remember.

growstuff

GrannyGravy13

My monies on Penny Mourdant as next leader, but not until after the GE

If I were Penny Mordaunt, I'd accept the leadership and immediately call an election. The Conservatives would lose. She wouldn't be PM, but quite frankly I wouldn't want to be at the moment. I'd spend the next five years trying to get an electable Conservative team together, developing some strategies which the electorate actually wants and have fun attacking Labour from the other side of the House.

Penny Mordaunt is in a vulnerable seat, there’s not a guarantee she’ll be there post election. If she is, I do think she’d make a better leader than many of her likely opponents for the leadership, as she has a cool head and behaves in a professional manner. The right aren’t going to want her though.

That wasn’t my point though Maisie, I was talking about how the electorate view the politicians, there’s not much coverage of the grind committees, but PMQ is pored over and reported every week, so that’s what people see and remember.

OK, I appreciate that, Casdon, but perhaps you should have said that PMQs is people's perception of the reality of how Parliament conducts its business.

MaizieD

^That wasn’t my point though Maisie, I was talking about how the electorate view the politicians, there’s not much coverage of the grind committees, but PMQ is pored over and reported every week, so that’s what people see and remember.^

OK, I appreciate that, Casdon, but perhaps you should have said that PMQs is people's perception of the reality of how Parliament conducts its business.

You’re right, I should. Given that PMQ is what they are judged on though, you would think they would up their game - with some honourable exceptions who are already on top of theirs, to be fair.

Nicenanny3

The next General Election doesn't have to be held until January 2025 so I've read. I predict Sunak will get his marching orders very soon and the members will vote in Suella Braverman to be the new leader and new PM 🙏 perhaps just wishful thinking on my part but I would vote Conservative at the next election if this were the case and not Reform. The big mistake Sunak made was getting rid of her.

I’d be interested why you or anyone else thinks Braverman would gain the Tories votes

If Braverman ever heads this country I m off nicenanny3 and I don’t think I d be travelling alone
You are welcome to this two faced cruel woman

The Conservatives need to go for the sympathy vote. perhaps if they were to conjure up a pandemic disease and through brilliance of planning and execution we come through it far better than any other country.

Oh, I have just remembered ..............

If Nigel Farage could lead the Tories then I am positive they will win the next election. Nigel stands for everything I believe in, stopping immigration, stopping all these woke individuals and don't get me started on the keyboard warriors on Social Media i.e. Tik Tok, X formerly known as Instagram. They really do my head in.

I’ve been reading the publication of Reform policies. They read like an extreme form of Liz Truss, with a healthy overriding dollop of xenophobia - I wonder if she will join them?

BlueBelle

If Braverman ever heads this country I m off nicenanny3 and I don’t think I d be travelling alone
You are welcome to this two faced cruel woman

Seconded. I said something similar on another thread and am still pondering on where on earth I could go to, though. Methinks I would have to, in a cowardly way, shut myself away from news and social media because I’m getting too old to fight such things.

GrannyGrunter For every voter farage might attract many many more would defect.