ICJ seeks arrest warrant for Netanyahu and others for war crimes.

maddyone

Well said Oreo.
The figures of dead are disputed. We don’t know how many people died. Most of the dead are most likely Hamas as they were engaged in battle with the IDF soldiers and as Oreo says, one IDF soldier was fatally wounded.
Any civilian deaths are the responsibility of Hamas. Hamas killed them. Hamas took hostages and held them for eight months, and they could have ended this on any one of those days, but they didn’t. They could end this tomorrow but they won’t. They could release the other 120 hostages but they won’t. The responsibility is solely the responsibility of Hamas. They care less for their own people than GNetters care for the ordinary Palestinians. It’s utterly shameful behaviour from Hamas.

An MSF doctor said "It's a nightmare at al Aqsa. There have been back-to-back mass casualties as densely populated areas are bombed," said Samuel Johann, the organisation's coordinator in Gaza.

But you are right to question the numbers of dead, with little medical provision many of the wounded will die as well.

I wonder do you imagine that the bombs Israel drops somehow only kill Hamas members? This was an attack on civilians. Most of the dead are innocent Palestinians.

I felt very emotional watching the hostages being returned to their families. What a blessed relief. I hope that they can now live in peace.

What also filled me with hope was the fact that contrary to what so much propaganda would have you believe, they were clearly in good physical health.

I felt filled with utter horror at the savage violence that took place in rescuing them and the disregard for human life. Watching the footage of children cut to shreds, with gaping wounds to face, limbs and bodies.

How can that be justified.

Well it can’t.

Those committing those crimes must be brought to full justice for those little torn bodies.

Michael Rosen

Don’t mention the children.
Don’t name the dead children.
The people must not know the names
of the dead children.
The names of the children must be hidden.
The children must be nameless.
The children must leave this world
having no names.
No one must know the names of
the dead children.
No one must say the names of
the dead children.
No one must even think that the children
have names.
People must understand that it would be dangerous
to know the names of the children.
The people must be protected from
knowing the names of the children.
The names of the children could spread
like wildfire.
The people would not be safe if they knew
the names of the children.
Don’t name the dead children.
Don’t remember the dead children.
Don’t think of the dead children.
Don’t say: ‘dead children’.

How could the hostages be rescued without the IDF and Israeli police returning fire? They were attacked by hamas continually during this operation.Hamas cause Palestinian casualties too you know!
It’s hamas who need to be brought to full justice.
As to good health for these hostages you can’t know what they’ve been through.Their mental health will be poor, that’s for sure.

Don’t mention the children

I'm sure everyone is pleased to see hostages back with their families and in good health but it's a high risk strategy. Netanyahu needed a successful rescue but they lost a member of the IDF and killed quite a few civilians, I think a deal would have been a better option but that wouldn't serve Netanyahu's purpose and it might hold his government together for a bit longer. Those hostages who have been returned have mainly been by negotiation, there have been some killed by the IDF by bombs, three who escaped got shot by the IDF and some have died in ways as yet unknown but the numbers do speak for themselves, negotiations is safer and more likely to get them home.

I wonder how many of the children killed hsve fathers, uncles
grandfathers who are members of Hamas

I don’t blame the IDF for the deaths because they were following orders and doing their job. I’m sure you don’t mean them though Whitewave.
I agree that those to blame for this whole situation should be brought to justice, and those are Hamas. Bring Hamas to justice. The deaths of every person and child who has died is the responsibility of Hamas. Jewish deaths, Palestinian deaths, Hamas!

The poem was written by a Jew in response to Netanyahu’s ban on any publication/media outlet publishing the names of children killed by Israeli police/military in the West Bank and Gaza.

Blaming the innocent for the sins of their fathers - not a good look.

Anniebach

I wonder how many of the children killed hsve fathers, uncles
grandfathers who are members of Hamas

Why is this relevant?

The group who rescued the hostages were a special antiterrorist trained force together with Shin Bet.The intelligence was so good and precise that they trained on a mock up of the apartments beforehand so they could get in and out quickly.They still faced fierce action from hamas even so.
Whitewave21 we all hate war, it isn’t just you and Glorianny
Tho it does seem that several posters care about some children over others, if you insist on constantly mentioning them.
All the children and babies murdered and mutilated by hamas and done on purpose for the fun of it were easily ‘forgotten’ by some on forums.M Rosen is very left wing and anti the Israel government it has to be realised, and would lists of German children be compiled by us for publication or British children by Germany during 1939-45.
Anniebach makes a relevant comment btw as very many men and women are either hamas or their supporters in Gaza.

Yes because none of us think about the children, in this complex situation that stretches way beyond Istael and Palestine.

I think irony is wasted Galaxy as few seem to get it on forums.
Thinking about the only true innocents in any war or conflict comes easily to most people doesn’t it.
So much suffering world wide, Ukraine and many African countries included.Enough to banish sleep.

Oreo

How could the hostages be rescued without the IDF and Israeli police returning fire? They were attacked by hamas continually during this operation.Hamas cause Palestinian casualties too you know!
It’s hamas who need to be brought to full justice.
As to good health for these hostages you can’t know what they’ve been through.Their mental health will be poor, that’s for sure.

This was not a question of returning fire this was the bombing of a civilian area.
I've asked before how many Palestinians have to die in order that Israel can believe it has destroyed Hamas.
Hamas in any case is not a Palestinian organisation, it is run by people outside Gaza. It is also an idea and wars do not destroy ideas.
One thing is certain those hostages are in better health and will have better care than any Palestinian child injured by Israeli bombs. Many of them will die for lack of medical care.

Oreo

The group who rescued the hostages were a special antiterrorist trained force together with Shin Bet.The intelligence was so good and precise that they trained on a mock up of the apartments beforehand so they could get in and out quickly.They still faced fierce action from hamas even so.
Whitewave21 we all hate war, it isn’t just you and Glorianny
Tho it does seem that several posters care about some children over others, if you insist on constantly mentioning them.
All the children and babies murdered and mutilated by hamas and done on purpose for the fun of it were easily ‘forgotten’ by some on forums.M Rosen is very left wing and anti the Israel government it has to be realised, and would lists of German children be compiled by us for publication or British children by Germany during 1939-45.
Anniebach makes a relevant comment btw as very many men and women are either hamas or their supporters in Gaza.

So why is it relevant?

Hamas declared the alleged dead in Gaza ‘martyrs’ , !

As has been said several times, the expression has many meanings but tbh I would expect Hamas to say that as it suits their cause. It does not, however, mean that everyone who was killed or injured was either a member of Hamas or a supporter of the terrorist group.

It’s relevant because if Hamas hadn’t started this latest war in Israel on 07/10, no child, either Palestinian or Israeli, would be dead or injured or orphaned.
There is something particularly unpleasant about the type of one upmanship of some people trying to imply that other people don’t care about the children. However many times it is repeated, it is ignored or not accepted, that if Hamas hadn’t begun all of this, then thousands of children, both Israeli and Palestinian, would still be alive, uninjured, and not orphaned. Stating who the perpetrators are is not being uncaring about children of any nationality. It is putting the responsibility firmly where it lies. And what is more, the responsibility for ending this also lies with Hamas. They could have started yesterday by releasing those four hostages into the care of the soldiers sent to free them. They didn’t, they chose to violently defend the place where the hostages were, ensuring that far more deaths and injuries occurred than were necessary.

We all know foxie that not all the dead, injured, or orphaned in this war were members of either Hamas, or members of the Israeli government or even members of the IDF. When Hamas started this war, they knew that innocents would be killed, both Palestinian and Israeli innocents. Do you think Hamas didn’t know that, or that they even cared?

Hamas invaded Israel, raped and murdered innocents, took
hostages, why take hostages, did they invade Israel to capture
hostages?

Had Palestinians elections not been stopped by Israel and USA they would have had the opportunity to make a choice in who governs them, but the right to democracy was denied them by two countries who do nothing but talk about their own democracies.

Hence Hamas has remained in power for 18 years and whether the people like it or not, that’s all they have.

As fir Hamas using the population as shields, not forgetting that the population have nowhere else to hide since Gaza is surrounded by walls and checkpoints, but whoever does the killing, which fails to protect innocent civilians is at fault.

Of course it’s wonderful for the families who have their loved ones back physically unharmed and in good shape , but at a huge cost of Palestinian lives which have always seemed cheap. I never understood why and I just can’t understand the lack of human compassion towards them on this forum.

Possibly we dont indulge in the 'I am such a better human being than you are" strategy.

Galaxy

Possibly we dont indulge in the 'I am such a better human being than you are" strategy.

Oh but you do. Hamas and the Palestinians are the ones who don't count. The better human beings are the Israelis and the hostages.
Only they aren't
The sacrifice of so many Palestinians by Israel or Hamas is wrong.
It's quite simply a question of valuing all human life, not just some.

If we wanted to carry this argument further as to responsibility. The hostages were taken to exchange for Palestinians held by Israel. These are people held without trial. If Israel hadn't had those people there would have been no need for any hostages.

Dear God. There are no words.
Oh and I will be really clear.
Absolutely Hamas dont count.
The misplaced empathy of some in the West will end in utter disaster.

It has already been said Annie but this did not start in October last year but many decades ago. The difference is that this is the first time that Israel has suffered more than just a few casualties.
Palestinians have been killed and imprisoned in their hundreds into thousands frequently over many years when Israeli soldiers go into their towns and villages often with settlers who throw people off their land which they have lived in fir generations past. Whole villages emptied for no reason other than to extend Israel and build more houses for settlers, villages emptied to build a theme park ( check Silwan). These people have suffered for generations.
Please, the terrible things which happened on 7 October did not come out of nowhere and hope that those on both sides who want peace for all are successful because killing indiscriminately only brings more recruits to the struggle.