Yvette Cooper / Migrant Watch / Stopping The Boats

Sparklefizz

A guy was interviewed on the News last week. He had come over from Turkey via the boats. He had not yet been assessed. He complained that his youngest child hardly knew him. He said his wife and 3 children were in Turkey. Presumably if he is accepted, then he will want them all to come over .... so not one immigrant but 5 people coming to use our services.

Now I understand that some people are going on a hunger strike on the Bibby Stockholm complaining about what is provided.

I'm afraid it's not just 5 people. Anyone who has done their family history will know how quickly numbers can grow. He has 3 children, he may have more. Anyone with 6 children can easily have 12 grandchildren and 24 great grandchildren, maybe more. If they are all still alive that would be 44 living people counting the original couple. Assuming the original couple has died that's still 42 people from just one couple, possibly within the next 50 years.

So when we calculate numbers just think how many we may have in the future. Each person entering the country is not just one person if they have a family.

Grasping at straws , Chestnut ?

Yes Chestnut I agree with you, but this is completely overlooked by those supporting open migration.

I live in South Gloucestershire and we have been told that South Glos Council is going to have to build 20,000 new houses. There are already massive new housing estates - but no more doctors' surgeries or doctors, no dentists, our hospitals can't cope, the schools are full and there is gridlocked traffic in the rush hour on the Ring Road and all the roads leading into the towns.

The answer is not more people.

It's always said that we need migrant workers to fill our job vacancies, but I have always felt deeply uncomfortable with this. We are in effect stealing workers, possibly skilled, medical, construction, whatever, from another country who may actually need them more than we do.

Don't people who advocate controlled migration, beneficial for us, feel guilty about this? I know I do. Any country should be able to supply its own workforce, and if not then find a way through training and decent salaries. Not through taking people from other poorer countries.

Any country should be able to supply its own workforce, and if not then find a way through training and decent salaries

Precisely what the Labour government is proposing Chestnut.

Proposing something and doing it are two different things, and even so it will take time. Meanwhile, people are still banging on about how we 'need' more people. I'd say 67 million is quite enough people, how can we need more?

growstuff

Chestnut

Casdon

Chestnut

Of course we have and I agree that we should have a faster and more robust way of granting or refusing asylum to those who come through legal channels.
How fast and robust would it need to be? We've had 1,000 arrive on boats since Labour took over and they would need assessing along with the legal arrivals. Don't forget many throw out their passports and ID.

What you describe is status quo for an average summer week of arrivals Chestnut. The situation hasn’t changed at all since Labour came into power. It will inevitably take time for things to change.

Sorry, I wasn't implying that was Labour's fault, just illustrating the speed and number of arrivals are unsustainable. We have 1,000 people arriving in 10 days. How can we process and find accommodation for so many people on an ongoing basis? Where are they being housed? Maybe growstuff and others can tell us where this 1,000 can go, plus the next 1,000 and the 1,000 after that.

One per cent of the country's housing stock has currently been empty for more than six months.

So. Will it be another Robin Hood gesture by this Gov. Like raiding pension pots as has been mooted today. Yay Gordon Brown lives on.
Anyway HR act states "compulsory acquisition of private property is prohibited".

Sadly the compulsory acquisition of private property is not prohibited..

olddog. There really is no need to use foul language like that. (Page 12). It just makes “you” look common and uncouth.

I am surprised the mods have not removed this.

I agree. Not language that I have ever used nor, thankfully, have heard. That someone sees fit to use it here says a lot about them. Presumably nobody has yet reported it.

Just been listening to an Australian man involved in their Border Force. He was discussing the problems here and said “over time these figures will continue to grow.”

He also said that Labour in Australia had to reverse their position on immigration and the UK should definitely reconsider the Rwanda scheme.

We should be listening to theAustralians.

Primrose53

👏👏👏👏

Primrose should we really be listening to the Australians???

“Australia: Appalling abuse, neglect of refugees on Nauru.
Around 1,200 men, women, and children who sought refuge in Australia and were forcibly transferred to the remote Pacific island nation of Nauru suffer severe abuse, inhumane treatment, and neglect, Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International said today.
The Australian government’s failure to address serious abuses appears to be a deliberate policy to deter further asylum seekers from arriving in the country by boat. Refugees and asylum seekers on Nauru, most of whom have been held there for three years, routinely face neglect by health workers and other service providers who have been hired by the Australian government, as well as frequent unpunished assaults by local Nauruans.
They endure unnecessary delays and at times denial of medical care, even for life-threatening conditions. Many have dire mental health problems and suffer overwhelming despair—self-harm and suicide attempts are frequent. All face prolonged uncertainty about their future.
Few other countries go to such lengths to deliberately inflict suffering on people seeking safety and freedom.
Anna Neistat, Senior Director for Research at Amnesty International
“Australia’s policy of exiling asylum seekers who arrive by boat is cruel in the extreme,” said Anna Neistat, Senior Director for Research at Amnesty International, who conducted the investigation on the island for the organization.
“Few other countries go to such lengths to deliberately inflict suffering on people seeking safety and freedom.”
Australian authorities are well aware of the abuses on Nauru. The Australian Human Rights Commission (AHRC), the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR), a Senate Select Committee, and a government-appointed independent expert have each highlighted many of these practices, and called on the government to change them.” (amnesty.org)

Thanks LizzieDrip for that information.
We have nothing to learn from Australia on how to respond to the vulnerable or about racism

I agree Iam.

Chestnut

Proposing something and doing it are two different things, and even so it will take time. Meanwhile, people are still banging on about how we 'need' more people. I'd say 67 million is quite enough people, how can we need more?

Firstly, the country needs HE students' money. Secondly, we have an ageing population who rely on others for personal care. Even if they were paid more, I'm not sure I'd want to be cared for by people who were otherwise unemployable and only doing the job for the money. Thirdly, we need people with higher level skills which aren't available in the UK.

How can anybody say how many people are "enough"? It's not as though the country is actually sinking with the weight of all the humans on it.

Well said growstuff

What do the anti refugee/asylum seeker posters suggest is to be done. Rwanda -illegal even if we are prepared to disregard human need

Wars and climate change means the need to try and get to safety will increase. It’s a global problem. It needs international co-operation.

Iam64

Thanks LizzieDrip for that information.
We have nothing to learn from Australia on how to respond to the vulnerable or about racism

👏👏

Also
www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/jun/04/number-of-asylum-seekers-on-nauru-jumps-as-australia-transfers-37-people-who-arrived-by-boat

"“Senate estimates heard Australia’s offshore processing regime on Nauru has cost, in the nine months to the end of March, $240m this financial year.
The regional processing centre itself has cost $111m, and settlement services $122m.

Shoebridge said that based on 64 people held on the island (the figure at the time of questioning), it was costing Australian taxpayers $4m a year to hold a single asylum seeker offshore

Thanks Wyllow.

Clearly, we definitely should not be listening to the Australians!

Iam64

Well said growstuff

What do the anti refugee/asylum seeker posters suggest is to be done. Rwanda -illegal even if we are prepared to disregard human need

Wars and climate change means the need to try and get to safety will increase. It’s a global problem. It needs international co-operation.

Rwanda:

Meanwhile in Rwanda, 22.000 prisoners from the appalling genocide in the 1990's are being released this year.

www.justiceinfo.net/en/130199-rwanda-2200-genocidaires-released-2024-who-are-they.html#:~:text=And%2C%20according%20to%20the%20SCR,the%20Tutsi%20genocide%20in%201994.

There are also tensions with the Congo

"Rwanda-backed rebels are choking the Congolese people, yet this is one conflict the world can easily end"

www.theguardian.com/global-development/2024/apr/11/rwanda-militias-drc-goma

Safe as houses for us to operate there still?.

There is so much trouble in the world. Here in the UK we already have immense problems. By allowing uninvited and unknown individuals to come here means we have even more problems to sort out which we cannot do. We definitely definitely do not need any more people.

Chestnut As far as skilled workers are concerned, the deal is very often reciprocal.

Good question Iam64.

What do the anti refugee/asylum seeker posters suggest is to be done?

I already suggested what I thought needs to happen.

So what do you and all the welcome all, legal or not, with open arms posters say you would do?

You’ve probably watched the news where people here are saying they can’t afford/find a house.
You may have read or even contributed to posts about the increasing need for food banks.

NB I’m a bit concerned about asking.

As one poster put it earlier today.

This isn't some kind of interrogation.

Skydancer

There is so much trouble in the world. Here in the UK we already have immense problems. By allowing uninvited and unknown individuals to come here means we have even more problems to sort out which we cannot do. We definitely definitely do not need any more people.

I'm afraid the country does need more people. We certainly need the money and expertise they bring with them.

Oops! Just realised you're another one who confuses legal immigration (which makes up the majority of immigration) and people who arrive "on boats".

All I can say is, I am glad I am on my way out & not on my in, dread to think what this country is going to be like in 10/20 years time. Think of the legacy you are leaving for your grandchildren