Well Done Rosie Duffield

It doesn’t actually matter what RD’s views on safe spaces or female rights are, unless the party she is in supports her views.
As I have heard recently, MPs are elected to follow the party line. Do her views reflect the LP’s rulings?

I don’t think anybody on this thread said that MPs were elected to follow the party line did they? I said that if any MP stands for a party, they are promising the electorate that they will deliver that party’s manifesto on their behalf, which is not the same thing.

Ok perhaps I misunderstood.
Certainly, the local representatives were not willing to go against party dictats when I asked them to raise the matter of female safe spaces and the fact that you cannot change sex with the PM or the head of their party.

I think RD was dishonest to get elected as a Labour MP and then resign the whip a couple of months later. She has form on this and I think it's more of an attention seeking thing than a high moral stance. A convenient vehicle for her. Keir Starmer has emphasised country first, party second for quite a while now and did so again in his speech at the Labour Party conference last week. I don't think that he has had enough time in office to judge whether he will accomplish improvements for the UK. He has said that he is happy to be judged by whether the country has improved at the next election. (Not that he has any choice about that in a democracy!) It depresses me that a significant proportion of the British electorate live in fantasy land and expect quick fixes within 3 months and are so easily manipulated by much of the cynical British media (Bread and circuses and especially Sky news.) I don't care about the clothes as long as properly declared and within the rules. Better paid for by a millionaire than the taxpayer and leaders/wives need to look good on the world stage. Remember the furore about Michael Foot's 'donkey jacket' at the cenotaph?) I personally don't need the winter fuel allowance payment currently but have some anxiety about retired people who do need it. I do hope that older people will be helped to claim all the benefits to which they are entitled. But I also feel for younger people who need help, especially children. I also don't envy the privilege of politicians and regard some privilege as essential so that they can do an important job well. (But definitely not taxpayer duck houses and the like.)

RD didn’t have a crystal ball when she stood for Labour. RD wouldn’t have known about the secret life of Keir Starmer, Angela Rayner and Lord Alli when the election was first announced. Did anyone?

Better paid for by a millionaire than the taxpayer and leaders/wives need to look good on the world stage. Remember the furore about Michael Foot's 'donkey jacket' at the cenotaph?)
If he can’t manage to look good on his dual salary, then that goes a long way to explain why he doesn’t understand how those less well off have to manage.
Asking for help in choosing glasses and clothes which will improve his appearance is much less expensive, if he can’t do it by himself and doesn’t require freebies.

I so remember the right wing press attacking Michael Foot,it was brutal,claiming he wore a donkey jacket at the cenotaph, which was lies, Kenny Everet shouting ‘let’s kick .michael Foot stick away from him,brought much laughter.

Thank you Rabbitgran

Thinking more , Angela Rayner and the right wing press.

Interesting point about Michael Foot - he was thought at the time to be wearing the wrong type of coat, bought from Harrods, to the Cenotaph. Standing next to an immaculately dressed Margaret Thatcher, and surrounded by other men in conventional military and civilian dress, Michael Foot did not conform to the dress rules of the time.
The right wing press represented a section of society who recognised the need to conform in public service.

Michael had been involved in a serious car accident, I saw that coat, it was shot length because of the pain he had in his spine and legs.

Anniebach the coat was green- it might have been more acceptable in navy or black. Also a haircut might have helped. Perhaps politicians were less image conscious in those days unlike the present bunch.

Great post, * rabbitgran*.

Michael Foot was a good public servant. Imagine people still droning on about his overcoat.
Good post rabbitgran

Doodledog

Great post, * rabbitgran*.

Yes. Excellent.

Iam64

Michael Foot was a good public servant. Imagine people still droning on about his overcoat.
Good post rabbitgran

I know. It shows the level of political thinking in the UK, when an old man wears a warm coat to stand outside in the cold, and this is being brought up decades later, despite the decline in standards of what is appropriate that has clearly happened since. The coat was new, expensive and perfectly suitable for the occasion, but because a journalist referred to it as a donkey jacket it has gone down in history as such.

If anyone is in any doubt about the level of pettiness the LP has to put up with, and how slavishly people latch onto media slurs against the left, they need look no further than this 'incident'.

Levels of pettiness and slavish latching on to media slurs . . .
Yes, but they had such good examples to follow, set by the LP over the last few years.

I felt sorry for Michael Foot at the time. I felt the attacks on him by the press were unwarranted. It was cold, he was quite old and used a stick if I remember correctly, and he was Leader of the Opposition at the time. I felt that if he he needed the warmth of a good overcoat, then why would that not be acceptable? As for that comment about the stick being kicked away from him, I don’t remember that but it was a disgraceful comment and I don’t think he’d get away with it now, quite rightly. He was using a stick for a reason, and the reason was that he was a little unsteady on his feet, and he was required to stand for quite a long time in the cold. Disgraceful remark from Kenny Everet.

However I also thought the furore over Boris Johnson’s clothes was unwarranted. He is, whatever else he might be, a rather eccentric person, and his clothes didn’t always fit him properly. Possibly particularly because he has a rather strange, overweight figure. I don’t think he cares too much about his appearance. He was attacked a lot about that.

With regard to Keir Starmer, it’s certainly true that he has smartened himself up in recent years, possibly with his help of Lord Alli, but he didn’t always dress so smartly. He looks more like a PM in the clothing he’s wearing now. But it’s all image isn’t it? Does anyone remember how Margate Thatcher changed her dress style after she became PM? Her clothes became more corporate, more like a female version of what a man would wear. She started wearing suits and blouses, especially with the pussy bows (I’ve never liked pussy bows on clothes but that’s my personal choice) rather than dresses and coats.

Doodledog
All political parties have to put up with pettiness and media slurs, not just the Labour Party. It’s in the nature of politics these days, it’s just what it is.

Michael Foot needed the walking stick because he had been seriously injured in a car accident , broken leg, broken ribs,
pierced lungs

In fairness, the appearance of Boris Johnson is not going to fade in people’s memories either, I bet that will still be talked about in 30 years time too. It’s more the slant that the media puts on the way some people appear that influences some of the public I think - Boris is portrayed as lovably unkempt, but Angela in her green trouser suit had her morals called into question. It’s a segment of the media that only appeals to certain people though, most see through it.

maddyfour but the pettiness and slurs are currently not directed across the board and have not been for months. Its been a concerted effort from certain newspapers.

Regarding the current O/P and predictions of domino effects, we've had nothing of the kind. People are keeping their distance from Duffield and I agree with Robertgran's analysis.

Very predictable that she would be slated and people would try to dig up dirt on her isn’t it ? I think she is 100 % right. They should have a good hard look at themselves and I hope they do, for all your sakes.

maddyfour

I felt sorry for Michael Foot at the time. I felt the attacks on him by the press were unwarranted. It was cold, he was quite old and used a stick if I remember correctly, and he was Leader of the Opposition at the time. I felt that if he he needed the warmth of a good overcoat, then why would that not be acceptable? As for that comment about the stick being kicked away from him, I don’t remember that but it was a disgraceful comment and I don’t think he’d get away with it now, quite rightly. He was using a stick for a reason, and the reason was that he was a little unsteady on his feet, and he was required to stand for quite a long time in the cold. Disgraceful remark from Kenny Everet.

However I also thought the furore over Boris Johnson’s clothes was unwarranted. He is, whatever else he might be, a rather eccentric person, and his clothes didn’t always fit him properly. Possibly particularly because he has a rather strange, overweight figure. I don’t think he cares too much about his appearance. He was attacked a lot about that.

With regard to Keir Starmer, it’s certainly true that he has smartened himself up in recent years, possibly with his help of Lord Alli, but he didn’t always dress so smartly. He looks more like a PM in the clothing he’s wearing now. But it’s all image isn’t it? Does anyone remember how Margate Thatcher changed her dress style after she became PM? Her clothes became more corporate, more like a female version of what a man would wear. She started wearing suits and blouses, especially with the pussy bows (I’ve never liked pussy bows on clothes but that’s my personal choice) rather than dresses and coats.

No. Johnson deliberately courted that imagine eg before appearances he would deliberately ruffle his hair up. I was ashamed seeing him on the world stage representing us with his shirt hanging out clowning around with umbrellas etc.

With regard to Keir Starmer, it’s certainly true that he has smartened himself up in recent years, possibly with his help of Lord Alli, but he didn’t always dress so smartly. He looks more like a PM in the clothing he’s wearing now. But it’s all image isn’t it?
Well yes. I dressed much more smartly at work if I had an important meeting than if I had a day in the office, and when I'm at home all day I don't dress smartly at all. You're right that it's image, up to a point, but we learn as children that there are appropriate and inappropriate ways to dress, depending on the occasion. Clothes are a way of showing a level of respect for the occasion, and a PM is going to have more important occasions than most of us.

Doodledog
All political parties have to put up with pettiness and media slurs, not just the Labour Party. It’s in the nature of politics these days, it’s just what it is.
Can you point to a time when a government has had this level of constant sniping? People gleefully repeating childish names that they've read in the tabloids? Speculation about things the government has never even hinted at doing being presented as inevitable?

I really can't.

Well to some extent the sniping has been brought about through inadequate communication skills from the government. Once they sort themselves out, if ever, more rational responses might follow … or maybe not? It’s a silly season in the UK until the budget at the end of this month. Can’t guarantee what will happen then …