Anniversary of Israeli massacre

nanna8

I hope Iran doesn’t respond but I think they will. It is becoming more and more alarming, I wish they would just leave each other alone.

Iran won’t necessarily respond, Israel went for military targets not the big ‘surprise’ Netanyahu had promised, the US called for restraint and looks like on this occasion it worked. Is tit for tat and now the US will be in talks behind the scenes with Iran calling for them to call it a day. I imagine the easing of a sanction in return might work.
This could actually be a good sign inasmuch as Netanyahu is just getting his show stopper in before he goes to the negotiating table. I certainly think he would have done more damage if he wasn’t thinking of ending things soon.
Here’s hoping 🙏🏾🙏🏾

ronib

The UK fought in two World Wars with a devastating loss to life. I hope that the Middle East will find a way through their conflicts but is it really our fight too?

My guesses Ronib - why so much of the Western world involved -

one has been a genuine desire historically to back a safe haven for Jewish people: (although this has been complicated by those who have wished to expand the initial territory)

second, oil supply worldwide which means that the US has wanted control and friendly governments (its now believed by many to be behind the Iraq war) in the Middle East

And thirdly, what is characterised as the "War against Terror"after 9/11 and other instances. Iran's possible nuclear capability. Putins possible contacts with Iran.

so the US and other countries spend billions in involvement in the area

Hoping indeed, Babs.

Babs03

We tend to reserve our blame for governments, not ordinary people, whatever religion they are.

Who’s ‘we’ ?
I can assure you that lots of ordinary people, Jews, get the blame for all sorts of things.
I don’t need to mention what happened historically do I?

I believe it’s as it always had been, Progroms, holocaust

I always thought Hitler’s hatred of Jews was more to do with their shrewd business acumen and property acquisition than their religion.

Babs03

Fleurpepper,
Exactly so. Is just down to greed and ambition, religion is simply used to manipulate the masses and muddy the waters with regard to what is really going on.

Unsure of your meaning there.
Which religion is manipulating the masses and muddying the waters?
What’s ‘really going on’ is Israel making sure that Islamist extremists can never again mount a murderous attack on its own people in its own country.

merlotgran

^I believe it’s as it always had been, Progroms, holocaust^

I always thought Hitler’s hatred of Jews was more to do with their shrewd business acumen and property acquisition than their religion.

It was race for him more than religion, he just hated Jews.

Oreo

Babs03

Fleurpepper,
Exactly so. Is just down to greed and ambition, religion is simply used to manipulate the masses and muddy the waters with regard to what is really going on.

Unsure of your meaning there.
Which religion is manipulating the masses and muddying the waters?
What’s ‘really going on’ is Israel making sure that Islamist extremists can never again mount a murderous attack on its own people in its own country.

It needs to be reiterating that, as far as I know, Jewish people have not formed terrorist groups in many countries around the world and perpetrated acts of terror, suicide bombings, hijacking planes, etc in the name of their religion.

That made me go and look it up. How his ideas developed explained well here by the Anne Frank house.
www.annefrank.org/en/topics/antisemitism/why-did-hitler-hate-jews/

It’s more important to understand why any other Tom Dick or Harry hates Jews tho.
Hitler is thankfully long gone but the antisemitism that went before and came afterwards and stayed is what’s worrying.

Well, yes - in a sense Hitler just tapped into long existing and still existing hatred, we had it in the UK at the same time with Mosley.
Why do far right groups in the US/UK cling to that hatred?

Antisemitism is not new. It has gone on for many centuries. I have never been able to understand why this is. I wonder if it's jealousy as they seem to be clever, successful people. As far as I know they have never caused any problems unlike other religions that can be aggressive to get what they want.

Also, why do the far left in the US/UK also buy into it?

Some, oreo, some. Traditionally the far left were allied with Jewish people very strongly, they were in Germany in the 30's, and the UK, in the 30's and long before.

Absolutely Netanyahu has not done much yet. I mean what 41000+++ Gazans not living 2.1 m not eating (starving) and 1.9m “moved” sorry gently displaced at the point of a gun. Figures from the UK DEC one of those anti Semitic organisation along with the 93000 injured by another hateful organisation called the UN.
The middle east branch of mother theresa also know as the IDF is holding, sorry re-educating 10000 children without a syllabus (or was it detention hey lets not talk nuance).
Ok the IDF puts bullets into children’s heads (Gentle metal head persuasion) but because they don’t understand biology they have to fry them at 2000C just to be sure with ordnance designed for cratering runways.
Poor Netanyahu. Ah I get it pregnant Gazan Palestinian women have to be made “non living” twice.

It’s called the IDF. They are not jews but Zionists. Its bad people who do bad things independent of race or creed. I would never allege any race does inherently bad things.

@Oreo am not just talking about religion muddying the waters or manipulating the masses in Israel, it happens in Iran - though some brave people there are fighting said manipulation. And it happens with Catholicism, indeed Spain colonised South America with Catholicism. Is a long story but in a nutshell politicians with nefarious agendas will wrap it up with religion to make it more palatable.
Even now people are seeing the conflict in Gaza as an attack on the Jewish people, certainly Jewish people have suffered terribly but this is basically about territory and power.
You probs won’t see it that way which is fine, horses for courses, but that is my opinion based very much upon living and travelling in the ME for many years when younger.

Btw of course Hamas and Hezbollah are religiously brainwashed too, which is bad enough but it scares me more when regimes/governments are the same.

Anniebach

Quote Fleurpepper Sat 26-Oct-24 11:01:30
Anniebach
But it has everything to do with religion
I don't believe so. It is about power and control, land and money.

I believe it’s as it always had been, Progroms, holocaust

And I repat, NO I do not believe so. Who is exterminating one race at the moment?

And I repeat , it has always been so

There you go- we totally disagree. Do you truly think Netanyahu is religious?

Talking about long term prejudice and war- what were the Crusades all about. Islamophobia has been going on for centuries. All about power and who rules, not religion.

Do you believe the hatred between Northern Ireland and Southern Ireland is about religion. Or the wars of religions between Protestants and Catholics?

It needs to be reiterated that, as far as I know, Jewish people have not formed terrorist groups in many countries around the world and perpetrated acts of terror, suicide bombings, hijacking planes etc in the name of their religion

This.

Were the Programs caused by power control, land and money ?

Was the Holocaust caused by power, control, land and money ?

Religion is one way that the ruling “elite” control the population, along with patriotism and just plain greed, is a fact that religion has been the cause of more wars than anything else. Even different sects of the same religion.