Sir K claims "a budget for Working People", ha!!!

DGD told me that buying a starter home with a very small footprint, that you will need to move out of as soon as you have children is not economical. Starter homes there are around the £350,000 mark.

My daughter has rented for a couple of years and is now in the process of part by part rent (I know it’s not ideal, but it’s the only way she can afford to get a house)
The house is a three bed mid terrace in St Albans and it is £620,000…🤷‍♀️

St Albans is one of the most expensive areas in the country.
A 3 bed mid terrace where I live, 15 miles from central London, would be less than half that.

Smileless2012

If KS is saying that transwomen are women, then he doesn't know what a woman is Doodledog. He may have fallen for TRA propaganda that the trans community are the most vulnerable in society, but that doesn't excuse his ridiculous statement that 99% of women don't have a penis.

Believe me, I am not in any way defending his idiocy on this matter .

I am suggesting that he knows perfectly well what a woman is, in the same way that TRAs know what women are. Changing the language will never change that.

The trans issue is like walking on eggshells, not wanting to cause offence, yet having concerns about certain aspects.

silverlining48

St Albans is one of the most expensive areas in the country.
A 3 bed mid terrace where I live, 15 miles from central London, would be less than half that.

There was a thread on MN recently where someone was asking why her St Albans house wouldn't sell for £600k. She was aiming at first time buyers and divorcees. The house had 2 beds (one tiny), a downstairs bathroom and no parking (not just no garage or driveway, but no parking outside at all). One of the bedrooms may have been in a basement - I can't remember now.

My gast was flabbered. Prices like that are insane, and if people have to reduce them, so be it. It is sad for those who may have bought them at a similarly insane price, but it's just not sustainable to have £600k as a starter price for young people or older ones starting again on their own. The fact that this may be the case in some parts of the country doesn't make it ok.

This one wouldn't have been much use as a family house, as the baby would have been on another floor from the parents, so a young couple would likely have to budget for a probable next move soon afterwards. She'd done it out nicely, but all the same. . .

No wonder the birthrate is falling.

No one has to live in St Albans! There are perfectly okay places nearby with a slightly more reasonable price.

Having lived in one of those ‘ okay places nearby’ I would say St Albans or move far away.
The new towns circling St Albans, the housing built mostly without garages. Like living in a giant car park.

What is this thread about anyway. It seems to veer between house prices and trans women. Most odd

Well JamesandJohn33have you missed the point about working people needing some where to live? In addition to the most ridiculous property prices, there is the problem of lawyers and conveyancing which in England is a joke. Very much a concern for the working people…

ronib

No one has to live in St Albans! There are perfectly okay places nearby with a slightly more reasonable price.

That is true . I only mentioned it (a) in response to a post upthread, and (b) because I read the thread on MN and was shocked at how little you get for your money.

I suppose some people probably do have to live in St Albans though. Who serves in the shops, drives taxis, cleans houses etc? Not people who earn enough to pay £600k for a 2 up 2 down terrace, I'm sure.

I must admit that I'm sometimes surprised that more people don't move to cheaper areas of the country, as opposed to grottier areas near the expensive ones. Now that more people can work from home, there is no need for concentrations of people near large employers' premises.

It's a bit of a Catch 22 though. People move to cheaper places, these then become popular and desirable, and the property prices go up and up.
DS1 moved from London to Devon, along with 100s of other workers, after covid and was continually outbid in his search for a house. 1930s - 50s places were being snapped up, so many people wanted to renovate and build working from home offices on the site. He spent nearly 18 months trying for such a house in a specific location, and ended up paying more than back in London.
The problem then comes when there are so few plumbers and electricians available in the area.

Doodledog

ronib

No one has to live in St Albans! There are perfectly okay places nearby with a slightly more reasonable price.

That is true . I only mentioned it (a) in response to a post upthread, and (b) because I read the thread on MN and was shocked at how little you get for your money.

I suppose some people probably do have to live in St Albans though. Who serves in the shops, drives taxis, cleans houses etc? Not people who earn enough to pay £600k for a 2 up 2 down terrace, I'm sure.

I must admit that I'm sometimes surprised that more people don't move to cheaper areas of the country, as opposed to grottier areas near the expensive ones. Now that more people can work from home, there is no need for concentrations of people near large employers' premises.

I think it depends on the stage of life. My daughter and husband are looking to move. They're also thinking about starting a family, so they're thinking about schools and what it would be like to bring up children in particular areas.

silverlining48

St Albans is one of the most expensive areas in the country.
A 3 bed mid terrace where I live, 15 miles from central London, would be less than half that.

St Albans has good access to London, the motorways and M25 and good schools.

growstuff I don’t think you have been to St Albans recently? The volume of traffic is very high, the railway station to London is a 20 minute walk away from the conservation area, and the fares are extortionate. Workmen add premium prices on to work done on the home. It’s also very hilly and difficult for the elderly to walk safely on pavements which are poorly maintained. Etc.

I have never been to St Albans. I just can't understand how first time buyers (or those splitting up and buying for one) can be expected to pay £600k for a two up two down with no parking and a downstairs bathroom, wherever it is.

growstuff, that's what I was meaning. I would prefer to bring up children in a nice town far from London than a grottier one near to London, particularly if the cost of doing so meant that I could give them a higher standard of living.

I do see what you mean, escaped, but it would average out over time, I think. Obviously areas of natural beauty with beaches, countryside etc will usually command higher prices - house prices will always vary according to area and type of house - but now that people can work from home they don't need to be in particular areas for work, so why should a house in St Albans be so much more expensive than a similar one in, say, Lancashire?

ronib

No one has to live in St Albans! There are perfectly okay places nearby with a slightly more reasonable price.

One of the main reasons for staying in St Albans is because her two children are very happy and settled in their school…..
Also, she wants to be in close proximity so the children can see their father..
Is that okay with you?

Shinamae well of course. Bucking the trend a bit as quite a few families move further out once their children have a place at a coveted St Albans school….

Doodledog

I have never been to St Albans. I just can't understand how first time buyers (or those splitting up and buying for one) can be expected to pay £600k for a two up two down with no parking and a downstairs bathroom, wherever it is.

growstuff, that's what I was meaning. I would prefer to bring up children in a nice town far from London than a grottier one near to London, particularly if the cost of doing so meant that I could give them a higher standard of living.

I do see what you mean, escaped, but it would average out over time, I think. Obviously areas of natural beauty with beaches, countryside etc will usually command higher prices - house prices will always vary according to area and type of house - but now that people can work from home they don't need to be in particular areas for work, so why should a house in St Albans be so much more expensive than a similar one in, say, Lancashire?

One word ... jobs. Not everybody is able to work from home and it is still the case that London has more highly paid jobs than most other places.

I know St Albans quite well and I'd love to live there. I'm not really a 'country gal' and St Albans has loads of facilities and is ideally situated for all sorts of transport links. I'd hate to live in a satellite town or in the middle of the countryside (however beautiful) because one is reliant on having a car and spending more time travelling to shops, cinemas, hospitals, etc.

Having said that, my partner is retiring in December and we're looking to move to a different part of the country. The places we have our eye on do have facilities close-by, but they don't have too many jobs (which, of course, we don't need) and we're beyond bothering about good schools. The area we're looking at is cheaper than St Albans, but it's not exactly cheap either. People pay for location, not just the house/flat, although people's needs differ.

ronib

growstuff I don’t think you have been to St Albans recently? The volume of traffic is very high, the railway station to London is a 20 minute walk away from the conservation area, and the fares are extortionate. Workmen add premium prices on to work done on the home. It’s also very hilly and difficult for the elderly to walk safely on pavements which are poorly maintained. Etc.

Actually, I was in St Albans last month.

PS. A twenty minute walk to a station is nothing to somebody without mobility problems!

I adore St.Albans, my sister and brother-in-law lived there before they had children, it is one of my retirement dream locations

There are many villages close by which are picturesque and equally as desirable, especially where my darling sister lives.

If only I could persuade our children to all move nearby I would move there in a heartbeat.

In most Counties there is a desirable area which commands higher prices for property, supply and demand…

Of course people pay for location. That’s not my point, which is that a house like the one on MN was cramped, inconveniently laid out and would be awkward for visitors etc. Obviously they are the sorts of compromises that FTBs make anywhere, but £600k seems to me a lot to pay for something like that, when there are good schools and facilities all over the UK, and you’d get a lot more for your money. It would be way out of the reach of most self-financing FTBs, so I wasn’t surprised it wasn’t selling, which is all I’m saying, really.

I realise that people have family ties etc, and not everyone can work from home but it is much more widespread now, so people have more options than before.

People pay for location, not just the house/flat

The people on Kirstie and Phil's programme seem to pay for both! The budgets of some young buyers are eye-watering, but not representative of most people in their 20s or 30s.

I don't know St. Albans. Is it the historical element that makes it popular? I always think Roman places like Bath, York and Chester command a premium house price-wise. Anywhere that has olde worlde streets also seems more expensive.
Maybe if you're working from home you also need a nice historical or otherwise place to pop into for a coffee and a treat. DS1 goes to an upmarket Devon farmshop for a snack break, and a wander round their deli. (He works from home for a company in Saudi Arabia!)

The census shows £31912 average salary and £714886 average property. Something doesn’t add up here. Unless wealthy families are buying property in St Albans for their adult children. This has been known.

I can only speak anecdotally the people I know who live/d in SA, all in highly paid jobs, both working, often commuting in to London.