Welby still can’t read the room

A fugitive from the boardroom is perfectly suited to Lambeth Palace

A former colleague remembers him as “very shrewd and smart”: “He was obviously going places. If you’d said in 10 years’ time he’ll be in the Church, I’d have said no – he’ll be the finance director of a top FTSE company.”

www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/an-old-etonian-yes-but-justin-welby-the-new-archbishop-is-far-from-a-bullingdonclub-bore-8298185.html

November 2012

How interesting to look back at this comment by George Pitcher of The Independent.

It's worth reading it all.

Stephen Cotterel won’t be the next ABC. He’s too old and has admitted that. It won’t be an Evangelical this time. Rowan Williams (the best ABC in my lifetime) was an Anglo Catholic, (Oil) Welby was an Evangelical, so the next person should be another Anglo Catholic. I doubt if they’ll choose a woman as the African bishops would never accept her. Sad but true.

It bothers me that the African Bishops have so much influence, they’re anti gay an conservative not liberal

Oh yes - Welby should’ve gone quietly, I wonder who declined the invite

fancythat

Which I think, personally, is all part of the demise of Christianity in the Country.

We need Leaders who are doing things Biblically correct.

So basically ignoring about a third of the voting public.
That would be agnostics, atheists, and irreligious.
Not what I’d call democratic.

Ladyleftfieldlover

Stephen Cotterel won’t be the next ABC. He’s too old and has admitted that. It won’t be an Evangelical this time. Rowan Williams (the best ABC in my lifetime) was an Anglo Catholic, (Oil) Welby was an Evangelical, so the next person should be another Anglo Catholic. I doubt if they’ll choose a woman as the African bishops would never accept her. Sad but true.

Rowan Williams was an unusual choice because he was not a Bishop in the Church of England.

He was Bishop of Monmouth and Archbishop of Wales previous to being appointed Archbishop of Canterbury.
The Church in Wales is nonestablished.

Eton does seem to churn out particularly unsuitable unattractive young men. Add Prince Harry to that mix, although fortunately brother William has clearly been unaffected. No wonder the Wales' don't want their children going to this particular school!!

A list of Old Etonians - Keynes (favoured by some), George Orwell, Bear Grylls, Eddie Redmayne, High Laurie, Ian Fleming and where it went slightly wrong- 20 prime ministers….

Hugh ..,

The lovely late Bill Turnbull was an old Etonian.

I would assume he's saying thank you to people he has worked with, doesn't seem a big issue to me. I'm sure people have worked hard and I think most bosses have some sort of do to say goodbye and thank people, I'm sure he has probably done good things (I don't know as I'm not CofE and don't follow what goes on in the CofE) so if he reported it and relied on others to do their jobs it isn't ideal but it isn't the same as covering it up.

fancythat

Though I think has been said before, he did report it.
He didnt follow it up enough.
If I have got that right.

Makes me wonder about my actions. I was helping out at my child's school, doing craft and things with the children. One child said something about what happened at Cubs' camp that rang alarm bells. At the end of the day I went to his form teacher and told her what he said, she said leave it with me and I did. Should I have checked she did her job? Did I do the right thing to report it and trust the other person would do their bit?

Agree worriedwell , I am aglican

petra

fancythat

Which I think, personally, is all part of the demise of Christianity in the Country.

We need Leaders who are doing things Biblically correct.

So basically ignoring about a third of the voting public.
That would be agnostics, atheists, and irreligious.
Not what I’d call democratic.

I meant in the Church.
I wasnt clear enugh.

Iam64

It bothers me that the African Bishops have so much influence, they’re anti gay an conservative not liberal

Never mind. Black lives matter.

theworriedwell

fancythat

Though I think has been said before, he did report it.
He didnt follow it up enough.
If I have got that right.

Makes me wonder about my actions. I was helping out at my child's school, doing craft and things with the children. One child said something about what happened at Cubs' camp that rang alarm bells. At the end of the day I went to his form teacher and told her what he said, she said leave it with me and I did. Should I have checked she did her job? Did I do the right thing to report it and trust the other person would do their bit?

A good question.

I would like to think that years ago that would have been enough.[I could have been wrong].

Nowadays, I think we have to follow things up. Sadly.

theworriedwell

I would assume he's saying thank you to people he has worked with, doesn't seem a big issue to me. I'm sure people have worked hard and I think most bosses have some sort of do to say goodbye and thank people, I'm sure he has probably done good things (I don't know as I'm not CofE and don't follow what goes on in the CofE) so if he reported it and relied on others to do their jobs it isn't ideal but it isn't the same as covering it up.

He resigned (after being forced to) as he was criticised in the Makin Report for covering up child abuse. No he didn't report it. No he didn't check it had been reported. He, and others, covered it up. The consequences were scores more children/young men were abused. He laughed it off in his farewell speech in the HoL and he's thrown a party. I find it all a very big, inexcusable, issue.

The Makin report can be downloaded and read from the link on the CoE website. For anyone who has read it Welby's behaviour ( and the lack of other resignations) is inexcusable. This is not the only abuse covered up by the CofE, they are all horrific.
www.churchofengland.org/media/press-releases/independent-review-churchs-handling-smyth-case-published

Such a shame. I never trusted JW once he started to interfere in politics. He forgot who he was…
The ABY doesn’t seem much better. It’s really sad.
I still maintain that it’s not religion that is bad, just the people practicing it who are/can be.

Sarnia, black lives do matter. That shouldn’t exclude equality for gay men and lesbians, or indeed women .

fancythat

theworriedwell

fancythat

Though I think has been said before, he did report it.
He didnt follow it up enough.
If I have got that right.

Makes me wonder about my actions. I was helping out at my child's school, doing craft and things with the children. One child said something about what happened at Cubs' camp that rang alarm bells. At the end of the day I went to his form teacher and told her what he said, she said leave it with me and I did. Should I have checked she did her job? Did I do the right thing to report it and trust the other person would do their bit?

A good question.

I would like to think that years ago that would have been enough.[I could have been wrong].

Nowadays, I think we have to follow things up. Sadly.

I suppose it was about 25 years ago. I don't know if things are better or worse.

OldFrill

theworriedwell

I would assume he's saying thank you to people he has worked with, doesn't seem a big issue to me. I'm sure people have worked hard and I think most bosses have some sort of do to say goodbye and thank people, I'm sure he has probably done good things (I don't know as I'm not CofE and don't follow what goes on in the CofE) so if he reported it and relied on others to do their jobs it isn't ideal but it isn't the same as covering it up.

He resigned (after being forced to) as he was criticised in the Makin Report for covering up child abuse. No he didn't report it. No he didn't check it had been reported. He, and others, covered it up. The consequences were scores more children/young men were abused. He laughed it off in his farewell speech in the HoL and he's thrown a party. I find it all a very big, inexcusable, issue.

OK I read above he had reported it. I have just read a timeline in The Independent www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/justin-welby-archbishop-canterbury-archbishop-of-canterbury-africa-b2645880.html

It says he was told about the allegations in 2013 and was assured the police and local authority were informed. Maybe he should have followed it up but in another report he states he received reports of abuse on a daily basis, I assume he also dealt with other things so is it possible he wasn't covering anything up but was trusting what others told him? So maybe he was lax but it doesn't seem fair on that evidence to say he covered it up.

From what I can see there were people in the CofE who covered it up but I don't see evidence it was him.

That is quite apart from the fact that as the head of any organisation you do have vicarious responsibility for what happens in that organisation so I don't think it was wrong that he resigned.

I think it is fair to say scores of young men and children were abused because he trusted the people who were lying to him. Who are they and are they being held responsible?

As I said not my church and I have no idea who lied to JW and they aren't named in the timeline although job titles are given so some people must know.

This is the problem when people rely on quoting media rather than the actual report, you misinterpretations and misconceptions. I have given the link to the report.
It really isn't relevant that it's "not your church" especially if you choose to comment on it.
The survivors/victims remain traumatised by the refusal of the church to effectively act on the recommendations of the report. To further make comedic speeches and party is absolutely a kick in the teeth to all those that suffered.
Would you not think that if abuse was reported to you on a daily basis you'd start doing something about it? He did nothing.

I find any defence of the Archbishop of Canterbury, incomprehensible. Read the report then say "he didn't know" he is the liar. As l said earlier, the police are investigating to see if criminal charges should be brought. I hold out no hope. Anyway... On with the party - middle finger to the victims.