Next step in overriding female rights!

Having seen photos, I don't think there would be any need, the patients would know without asking.

I find his statement worrying, especially from a doctor…

I wonder how Muslim patients would feel about this, or Orthodox Jews, or extremely conservative Christians, or anyone whose culture insists on female doctors for female patients. Additionally some women who aren’t any of the above may be very uncomfortable with a male doctor who insists they are female, doing an intimate examination.

I urge everyone to read as much as they can about this case, as it has quite far-reaching consequences for all women and girls. This doctor has stated in the tribunal that he is a 'biological woman' and that biological sex is merely a 'nebulous concept'. The whole case came about after a very experienced nurse said she felt uncomfortable about having to change in the same changing room as Dr Upton. I've been following the tribunal on a daily basis and this doctor's evidence has been quite horrifying.

That's just the tip of the iceberg with this absolute nutter. I've been following the case thanks to people on Mumsnet who are transcribing it all.

Ilovecheese

Having seen photos, I don't think there would be any need, the patients would know without asking.

The photo is immaterial.
If he lies about one thing, do you trust him about anything else?
If this is accepted, then any other male will be allowed to do this regardless of his looks.

If you don’t care, that’s one thing, but if you’ve asked for a female then his presence is a lie.

I'm confused, isnt this about changing rooms and the nurses complaint?
www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8j8dygdm19o#:~:text=Dr%20Upton%20denied%20this%2C%20saying,to%20know%20who%20I%20am.%22

Or was she asked about patients during the process?

Wyllow the lawyer for the nurse has asked some very searching questions. The doctor in question was asked about safety protocols for patients as he brought the matter up.

This success story hasn’t received a lot of print space but it’s still a huge step in the right direction.
I think the civil service will think again now this case has been won 👏👏👏👏

freespeechunion.org/civil-service-to-revise-transgender-policies-following-whistleblower-settlement/

I do object to calling this doctor an 'absolute nutter'. That is so disrespectful. It is not a term to be used to describe any other person .

Wyllow3

I'm confused, isnt this about changing rooms and the nurses complaint?
www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8j8dygdm19o#:~:text=Dr%20Upton%20denied%20this%2C%20saying,to%20know%20who%20I%20am.%22

Or was she asked about patients during the process?

I’ve been following this case on MN. The general feeling is to support the nurse.

It's also concerning that any doctor flatly refuses to accept that there are biological differences between male and female. Heart attack symptoms, for instance, can present very differently in a woman - and that's just one example. As I say, I've been following the tribunal closely online (look for @tribunaltweets on X if you want to) and the more I've read, the angrier I've become.

Wyllow3

I'm confused, isnt this about changing rooms and the nurses complaint?
www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8j8dygdm19o#:~:text=Dr%20Upton%20denied%20this%2C%20saying,to%20know%20who%20I%20am.%22

Or was she asked about patients during the process?

He was asked if a woman came into A&E with heavy vaginal bleeding and asked for a female doctor would he attend. He replied yes, but if at any time the woman objected to him he would then leave, but compared it to someone not wanting a black doctor.

The 'confrontation' was when Ms Peggie went to the changing room because she'd suffered a menstrual flood and desperately needed to clean herself up and change her clothes. That was when she challenged him about his being in the women's changing room. A previous time was cited when she waited outside until he'd changed and left the changing room, apparently that was hurtful and disrespectful of her not to get undressed in front of him. Beth Upton is a transwoman who displays male entitlement with every fibre of themself.

I don't know enough about the case to comment.
I shared a bathroom with a transgender person on an away weekend with my church, last year and was crossing my legs waiting to use the loo first thing in the morning.

I knocked on the door to check there was still someone inside but after about 20 minutes he/she appeared, fully dressed and made up, presumably shaved.
I wasn't best pleased and said there were several of us waiting, which was true.

If you’re on X, then you can read up on the daily Tribunal sessions from - Tribunal Tweets@tribunaltweets or for a précis of each session - boswelltoday@boswelltoday.
I can’t actually think of a word to describe this deluded man’s evidence, frankly the closest I get is insane.
Sandy Peggie, a nurse with 30 years of experience, was suspended because Dr “Beth” Upton felt “unsafe” when she spoke to him in the female changing room.
The Tribunal is yet to hear from NHS Fife management, they and Dr U are co-respondents.

I’m on the fence here. If I was bleeding profusely from anywhere I wouldn’t care who treated me so long as they were qualified.

I’d judge the doctor by their treatment and competency, I couldn’t care less if he/she was black, white, pink, gay, straight, male, female or trans.

And that's fine for you Cossy and I dare say for lots of us. But if your personal preference, or indeed religious or cultural requirement was for a female doctor, then no matter Dr Upton thinks that because he says he's female then he qualifies, then he'd be wrong. It's the deception that is concerning.

I was surprised that the question of religious or cultural requirement wasn't addressed.

Rosie51

And that's fine for you Cossy and I dare say for lots of us. But if your personal preference, or indeed religious or cultural requirement was for a female doctor, then no matter Dr Upton thinks that because he says he's female then he qualifies, then he'd be wrong. It's the deception that is concerning.

I agree, if someone specifically requests a female doctor or nurse or carer that is what should be provided, a biological female, ie at birth.

I wouldn’t care who treated me, but I would care if they lied.

But if your culture/religion dictated that you could not be treated by a member of the opposite sex Cossy you might care and if a woman is being intimately examined by a trans woman, would that negate the legal requirement for a chaperone to also be present?

Ilovecheese

Having seen photos, I don't think there would be any need, the patients would know without asking.

That seems to me irrelevant. It's not about who can 'pass' best, it is about who is male and who is female.

Personally (speaking only for myself) I wouldn't mind who treated me if I were seriously ill, or even a routine check, but I do mind being treated by a doctor who thinks male people can be biologically female. Sex is immutable, whatever people have in their minds or how they feel. If anyone should understand that it is a doctor.

Doodledog my feelings exactly

The case with this doctor is about him saying that a nurse was bullying him as she refused to share a changing room with him.
He says he is female and has as much right to the women's changing rooms as she has.
He walked in on her when she was just in her underwear. She had to leave as he refused to go.
This is on the BBC website.

And there is sufficient reporting of males presenting as female then attacking women for any woman to feel uncomfortable sharing a changing room with a male bodied person however they chose to represent themselves. Yet another example of natal women’s rights being eroded,