Will Trump pull out of Ukraine?

Germany has today offered support to Ukraine in the shape of a particular kind of missile (name escapes me at present) that can reach into the heart of Russia and hit Moscow.

I sometimes wonder why these things are announced. Surely it gives Putin a chance to strike first, at Germany, hence spreading the conflict and potentially worsening it. Why not just quietly supply the missiles and claim it later, once Putin has been stopped? All this announcement is going to do is anger a man who wants to go out in a blaze of glory.

Trump has, as yet and so far as I know, not commented on Germany's actions.

I fear that if Ukraine prevails, Trump will be next in line to demand access to what Ukraine has beneath its soil. That's all he's interested in...

Lets say things go really bad.

If European countries had to act in a big hurry, what could they muster up?
Just musing aloud really.
And I dont mean "with US back up".
I am with FGT in her comment of, we didnt half look stupid before, when we would do this and that, as long as the US was there to provide back up.

I decided to find a summary of whats "on the table" as a peace offer.

Whats on the table from Trump/Ukraine wise?

The borders are frozen where they currently stand. Russia gets Crimea outright, and the occupation of all the Russian currently held areas can remain.

No joining NATO

The US gains access to mineral rights

The Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant — the largest such facility in Europe — considered as Ukrainian territory but operated by the U.S., with electricity supplied to both Ukraine and Russia.

It sounds like a carve up between Putin and Trump to me. A part US occupation of the Ukraine? (because of access to mineral rights, and especially with control of a nuclear plant)

What are the Ukrainians supposed to gain?

A vague “A robust security guarantee" involving an ad hoc group of European countries and potentially also like-minded non-European countries. No details, nor US taking part.

Access to Dnieper River

Compensation and assistance for rebuilding (sources of funding not given)

Ilovedragonflies

Germany has today offered support to Ukraine in the shape of a particular kind of missile (name escapes me at present) that can reach into the heart of Russia and hit Moscow.

I sometimes wonder why these things are announced. Surely it gives Putin a chance to strike first, at Germany, hence spreading the conflict and potentially worsening it. Why not just quietly supply the missiles and claim it later, once Putin has been stopped? All this announcement is going to do is anger a man who wants to go out in a blaze of glory.

Trump has, as yet and so far as I know, not commented on Germany's actions.

I fear that if Ukraine prevails, Trump will be next in line to demand access to what Ukraine has beneath its soil. That's all he's interested in...

Possibly the announcements made are a gambit as well as a reality (given the Russia heavy attacks) whilst talks continue because they run contrary to the deal Trump wants where any NATO action is precluded and Europe reduced to a vague "security guarantee?

Whitewavemark2

Appeasement springs to mind when reading your posts david49

Remember what happened last time - once again Poland is at risk.

Nothing to do with appeasement I hope Ukraine does get a deal that maintains sovereignty, increasingly it looks like Trump will pull out and Europe won't provide enough back up to stop Russia

An interesting side snippet:

"Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelensky is on a historic visit to South Africa, signalling a dramatic improvement in the once-strained relations between the two nations.

The visit marks a diplomatic breakthrough for the Ukrainian leader in his efforts to counter Russia's strong - and growing - influence in Africa.

"I'm sure that Russia will be annoyed by the visit, but I don't think it can do much about it," said Steven Gruzd of the South African Institute of International Relations think-tank.

Seems that Neo colonialism at work here:

But it's in a very crowded space - Russia, China, Turkey, and the United Arab Emirates are all trying to increase their influence in Africa

something the UK/Europe need to keep eyes open on for the future.

(BBC)

Yes, I do think that announcing armaments support in advance, is all part of the strategy.
Another 'side swipe', one of the Chinese soldiers captured in Ukraine, said that the Ukrainian resistance was stronger than he had been led to believe, and that in his experience, the Russian side was 'chaotic'.
Some economic analysts feel that the Russian economy is almost on its knees.
Of course, everyone who comments has an agenda, or a side they are on, but the 'two days to victory' have gone on for much longer than Putin expected.

What will Trump do? Does he even know himself from day to day? Does anybody else think that he has begun his dementia journey?

I wouldnt put it past Trump to try and tie economic deals with support (or not) with Ukraine. He's got himself into a right mess with all the promises to 'sort it".

If the US just pulls out then bye bye to all those minerals he wanted.
- and bye bye to power in the region. Or should I say "our region?".

All the US military bases in Europe....unless he is prepared to let the lot go?

Wyllow3

I wouldnt put it past Trump to try and tie economic deals with support (or not) with Ukraine. He's got himself into a right mess with all the promises to 'sort it".

If the US just pulls out then bye bye to all those minerals he wanted.
- and bye bye to power in the region. Or should I say "our region?".

All the US military bases in Europe....unless he is prepared to let the lot go?

We’ve seen so many U turns it’s unpredictable what his aim is, the US pulling out forces from Europe would save him a lot of money. Europe would be forced to spend a similar amount to fill the gap to deter Russia.

That’s really bad for us, it’s up to us to change our priorities to find the money to rearm, we can do that if needed, double defense spending, less on other things. My big worry is will Europe as a whole contribute.

only reason even
talks about it because he can get nobal prize
as dumb as he is probably thinks it comes from usa
other wise he wouldnt be nasty to everyone

Would even the Uk send it's children to fight in Ukraine?
Front line fighting that is?

US President Donald Trump has said he is "not happy" with deadly Russian strikes on Kyiv and that President Vladimir Putin should "stop".

"Not necessary, and very bad timing. Vladimir, STOP! 5,000 soldiers a week are dying. Let's get the Peace Deal DONE!" he said in a post on Truth Social.
From BBC news
I am sure Vlad will be suitably chastised.

Diddums is sulking because Ukraine is standing firm and the Orange Man-child really wanted a Nobel Peace Prize.

So tantrums all round.

dotpocka

only reason even
talks about it because he can get nobal prize
as dumb as he is probably thinks it comes from usa
other wise he wouldnt be nasty to everyone

Exactly

Putin isnt listening to Trump.

More deadly attacks - 12 killed in Kyiv yesterday

Trump said he has his own deadline, that is 30th April (100 says in office)

Meanwhile a headline in Telegraph that Starmer challenges the peace plan and there are plans for more arms and limited UK troop support (backroom training stuff) He also said that in any peace the US would have to be involved in security guarantees not just Europe (well especially if the US are to do mining and control the nuclear power plant.

I do t hold much hope for the current peace plan neither, Putin or Zelensky are in favour, Russia seems to hold all the cards and really doesn’t want western troops in Ukraine after any ceasefire.

I hope Trump thinks long and harder tactically than on most situations and consults his military people before closing bases in UK and Europe.

I found a month old article in the Telegraph that suggested he might be considering moving troops from Germany to Hungary where one of his bessie mates Orban is in charge (for what you have to ask) - it has a small border with the Ukraine as well as a huge one with Belarus, another Russia buddy.

I don't think he's done with trying to meddle in matters at all.

As for his chosen Defence supremo, one can only recoil in shock

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pete_Hegseth

How on earth can a peace deal be negotiated when one of the states are left out of the talks!

Anyone uninvited to the talks could check in on progress by tapping into hegsethleaks.com.

Or lunch with Mrs H.

Whitewavemark2

How on earth can a peace deal be negotiated when one of the states are left out of the talks!

Yes - "key meeting" just started between Putin and Witkoff.

Trump:

"Yesterday, Trump said that he has "nothing to do with Crimea" after meeting Norway's Prime Minister Jonas Gahr Støre. Instead, he said the contentious issue was "given" to him by former US President Barack Obama

As a reminder, Crimea is a southern peninsula of Ukraine that was illegally annexed by Russia in 2014. Ukraine's President Zelensky has repeatedly rejected the idea of recognising the region as Russian.

This week, Trump hit out at Zelensky, saying "if he wants Crimea, why didn’t they fight for it eleven years ago?"
In the same interview, external the US president put blame on Kyiv for starting the war with Russia, saying: “I think what caused the war to start was when they started talking about joining Nato."

BBC News - Ukraine may have to give up land for peace - Kyiv Mayor Klitschko - BBC News
www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp348ygjgy3o
This is a very interesting interview with the mayor of Kyiv. In the sound bite of him saying, very reluctantly, that Ukraine may have to give up land for peace he makes it very clear that this would only be considered as a temporary measure.

Chocolatelovinggran

Anyone uninvited to the talks could check in on progress by tapping into hegsethleaks.com.