Reform activists depict female cabinet ministers as cows in abattoir.

X posted with you Galaxy. Yes institutions for children and adults with learning or other difficulties. Many of whom now live independently and have children. Austerity destroyed the support services they need

Coming in a after a longish break on the thread, the one post switch from should we prosecute or publicise portraying women as cows for the abattoir :

to a claim are CCTV's in classrooms

has to be a record segue even for GN!

Indeed Wyllow

Oh I don't mind that too much, it is what happens in real life.

It is and, it generated interesting discussion

It is interesting that the poster who was downplaying the original point is the one who has mostly derailed the thread!

I think the original subject had probably had all said on it just intrigued by why CCTV in classroom 🙂

And I suppose there are tenuous links around monitoring and legislating in relation to behaviour.

AGAA4

Well those adults in reform haven't learned how to behave that's for sure.

I disagree with the casual dismissal of blatantly aggressive behaviour.
It doesn't need legal intervention it just needed Farage to say that this was not acceptable in Reform. He didn't.
Starmer could have defended those women too.

What nonsense.
60 yrs ago class sizes were nearing 40 and no classroom assistants, behavior was much better, teachers were not going to school in fear of being assaulted.
Children were well prepared for the adult world as it was then.

Why do you think that children are well prepared for today’s adult world?.

It wasn’t children who put up the Reform display though David49, it was mature adults, some of whom no doubt went to school in the halcyon days of our youth.

Casdon

It wasn’t children who put up the Reform display though David49, it was mature adults, some of whom no doubt went to school in the halcyon days of our youth.

Of OUR youth, our generation had a very good deal we have had a much better outcome than we envisage for our children and grandchildren.
Our parents faced far more uncertainties in their lives, it is us that were brought up expecting to work hard and improve our lives, it wasnt easy we didn’t expect it to be. We heard the tales how hard it was in the 1930s, even worse in WW2, we wanted better and as a generation we achieved it. Now we are expecting hard pressed later generations to care for us despite the wealth our generation holds.

Reform are a rag bag of disenchanted Tories, playing on the emotions of those that the current system is failing

Just one more good reason not to vote for them.

David I completely agree with you regarding Reform. However I disagree with you regarding schools. Have you been in a school since you left it? Do you have family or friends who work in education? Everybody has an opinion on how schools should operate because everybody went to school (generalisation, I know) but that isn't how things were in the past. Rose colour specs, I fear.

The only family that work in schools are 2 classroom assistants, the both are on the verve of quitting, the morale of staff is low, behavior is poor, parenting of children is poor, morale, behavior and parenting issues all coincide with national concerns. In addition teachers at our local school actually went on strike, because the workload expected was too much, all this in an area that is relatively prosperous

I’m sorry if others consider the present system is good and doesn’t need major change. As I posted, 1960s education met the needs of the times and produced employable workers, 2020s education fails miserably at 16, 18 and Graduation, because large numbers cannot find work at the level they as aspire to.

David49 were you a teenager at school in the 60s? I was and behaviour wasn't that good in most schools.
The reasons for young people not getting work are not because of education but the whole social spectrum.
In the 60s there were apprenticeships available and people were doing the work that bots do now.
Now there are far fewer jobs available and a lot more people.
Despite your ideas that schools are turning out ill educated morons most of the young people I know are well educated, have good manners and will do well in life.

I was at school in the 1970s and behaviour ranged from excellent to downright disruptive.

Now I live in a very ordinary market town. Mostly working or middle class folk leading ordinary lives. Our local social media is very often full of members of the public, shopkeepers, local charities etc praising the local comprehensive school and its pupils as they go about their daily business.

My cottage is on a lane leading to the school and every day hundreds of children pass by in each direction - 99% of them are polite, respectful and well behaved. In my volunteering roles I meet lots of children working for their Duke of Edinburgh awards and find them delightful. They are hard working, kind, informed and yes again respectful not just of people but the environment.

There will always be some hellers, but I think you need to see the schools and children closer David and you will get a much more mixed picture than you are seeing now.

I did ask if a poster on here was American by the spelling of 'behavior'. No reply. As this thread has been totally changed from *Wyllow's original post I'm wondering if this is an attack on British schools and young people?

I don't recall saying the present situation was good David so don't make assumptions about what I said. There are always issues to deal with in education because we are dealing with people in their infinite variety. There have always been issues but these, too, are varied. When I started teaching, the main discipline problem was dealing with under achieving boys who saw no reason to work because their role models had lost their job in the Thatcher era and it percolated downward. Before I retired, the issues were around poor parenting and parents who were drug addicts. Also anxiety in pupils became more common. You are entitled to an opinion regardless of it's merit, but it is an opinion, not based on knowledge nor real understanding

2020s education fails miserably at 16, 18 and Graduation, because large numbers cannot find work at the level they as aspire to.

School leavers and graduates almost by definition do not go straight into work at the level they aspire to. They work hard over many years to achieve their goals. This has and almost certainly will always be the case.

Back to the original post.
This type of activity seems to be Reform's MO and their supporters seem to like it.

I’m not sure how this drifted from the behavour of a major Reform donor to behaviour in schools.

What’s the connection?

Andrew Perloff, the perpetrator of the distateful stunt, was born in 1944 so will have gone to school from 1949 to at least 1964. If these were halcyon days in education and it’s all about learning respect, why is Perloff so unpleasant? This isn’t the first time he’s appeared in the media saying dubious things about women.

Age seems irrelevant in the context of questionable behaviour from members of Reform. We have an 80 year old multi-millionaire donor depicting female cabinet members as cows for slaughter.

Meantime, Leicestershire County Council now has a new 22 year old deputy leader, one Joseph Boam, fan of Andrew Tate - as is Farage.

Who knows, AGA. There have certainly been attacks on women's rights to have their professional knowledge respected (that's 'womansplaining', apparently) and to simply disagree with a man, as he will 'return the insult' without offering reasons other than that he knows better.

In the 'good old days' children may have been prepared for work by the education system, but that wasn't educating them. Depending on the area and the industry surrounding it, they were divided at an early age into those suitable for labouring, apprenticeships or office work (boys) and factory/shop, typist-level office work or nursing/teaching (girls), and treats accordingly. Very few were educated in the way we understand it now until the expansion of grammar schools in the 60s, and even then, only a few benefited, and the number of places depended on the needs of the local workplace, so it wasn't really ability-based across the country.

Behaviour in schools used to be regulated by the use of corporal punishment, which wouldn't have been necessary if children in those days had been inherently respectful polite beings grateful for an education. Had it even had a deterrent effect, nobody would have been beaten more than once, which was not the case.

Joseph Boam is grim. His social media is full of Tate quotes, telling women to get back in the kitchen and anti immigrant/muslim sentiment.

Here's a quote from him, “Depression isn’t real. You feel sad, you continue with life because there’s no alternative. You will always be depressed if your life is depressing. Fix it.”

Adrian Edmondson's autobiography is an eye opener about the severity, cruelty and failure of corporal punishment in schools during the 60s and 70s.

Doodledog an excellent post. Thank you

Doodledog 👏👏