Trump has attacked Iran

Whitewavemark2

fancythat

Whitewavemark2

Maremia

On possibly a different thread, a Poster said only 'reasonable' states should have nuclear weapons.
Who would be judged as 'reasonable'? Trump's USA?

And that is why we have had the UN.

Quotes from Eisenhower

“To attempt to hinder or stultify the United Nations or to deprecate its importance is to contribute to world unrest and, indeed, to incite the crises that from time to time so disturb all men”.

In a very real sense, the world no longer has a choice between force and law. If civilization is to survive, it must choose the rule of law."

But force has been chosen.

Force can and does sometimes, come before the UN and International law.
You can tell me I am wrong.

You know that you are wrong don’t you.

No I dont.
In what way?

I mean force happened.
Presumably the Un and International Law wouldnt have wanted it to happen.

Unless you know otherwise.

LizzieDrip

^So how much support will Starmer have if he is asked to take the UK into this conflict? Very little I imagine and certainly not from me^

I second that Parsley3.

To date, I have largely supported Keir Starmer in most of the decisions he’s made since becoming PM - even when many have been unpopular.

I’ve done so because I believe he has the best interests of our country at heart.

To support Netanyahu and Trump by taking action in this illegal war would, IMO, be highly detrimental for the UK. Keir Starmer would not have my support to do so!

I sincerely hope this government does not put us in that position.

Lizzie
PM’s can’t pick and choose on things that involve our national security and interests.They will be advised and have to take a decision based on information and intelligence on what’s best for our country.

Like Blair when he was told about Weapons of Mass Destruction?

Netanyahu has been talking about imminent threat from Iran's nuclear ambitions for over 25 years.

I assume there is much intelligence gathered by all countries that the general public dont have a clue about.

You mean, like Iraq?

Starmer has warned of escalation in the middle east and beyond by the US action.

Jonathan Reynolds on LK today said that while the UK doesn't want Iran to have nuclear weapons Starmer would have gone about it a different way.
Clear that our government weren't fully in favour of the bombings.

Yes. Blair had to take a decision based on information at the time.Nobody can act in ‘retrospect’.

Why was none of this debated in Congress? I am just speechless. This is not going to end well and there will be repercussions. I just hope our Prime Minister keeps us out of this and makes his own decisions. Anyone who wants war can put their families in the front line first. Ive sacrificed enough of mine.

Oreo

Yes. Blair had to take a decision based on information at the time.Nobody can act in ‘retrospect’.

I, personally don’t blame Blair for Iraq because I believe he acted in good faith. I also think that he now bitterly regrets it and that we should have learned a lesson about following America. If only we were still part of a larger organisation and didn’t have to offer up our opinions on such things unilaterally.

AGAA4

Starmer has warned of escalation in the middle east and beyond by the US action.

Jonathan Reynolds on LK today said that while the UK doesn't want Iran to have nuclear weapons Starmer would have gone about it a different way.
Clear that our government weren't fully in favour of the bombings.

The old ‘we would have gone about it a different way’ 😄
The UK like just about everyone else doesn’t want Iran to have nuclear weapons.
Iran does want them.
Talking about it won’t butter any parsnips.
Israel and the US have done us all a favour but governments while secretly being happy about it have to now use honey covered words about ‘peaceful constructive talks’ soon with Iran and ‘de-escalation’.
What will actually happen now is anyone’s guess, but if the regime leaders want to live and hold onto power then they won’t mix it with the US.
Iran isn’t the powerful country it pretended it was.

MayBee70

Oreo

Yes. Blair had to take a decision based on information at the time.Nobody can act in ‘retrospect’.

I, personally don’t blame Blair for Iraq because I believe he acted in good faith. I also think that he now bitterly regrets it and that we should have learned a lesson about following America. If only we were still part of a larger organisation and didn’t have to offer up our opinions on such things unilaterally.

I never blamed him either.Being PM means making difficult choices in that regard.
That doesn’t mean we should never help the US ever again.

fancythat

Whitewavemark2

fancythat

Whitewavemark2

Maremia

On possibly a different thread, a Poster said only 'reasonable' states should have nuclear weapons.
Who would be judged as 'reasonable'? Trump's USA?

And that is why we have had the UN.

Quotes from Eisenhower

“To attempt to hinder or stultify the United Nations or to deprecate its importance is to contribute to world unrest and, indeed, to incite the crises that from time to time so disturb all men”.

In a very real sense, the world no longer has a choice between force and law. If civilization is to survive, it must choose the rule of law."

But force has been chosen.

Force can and does sometimes, come before the UN and International law.
You can tell me I am wrong.

You know that you are wrong don’t you.

No I dont.
In what way?

I mean force happened.
Presumably the Un and International Law wouldnt have wanted it to happen.

Unless you know otherwise.

Because force outside of the rule of law, is a free for all. That takes the world back to before the First World War, since when it has always been recognised that international law is vital to ensure that might is not always right, and to protect weaker nations.

Iraq was a disaster which has made everything worse ever since. The first illegal war- and now both sides can unleash illegal preemptive wars on each other with impunity.

I don't blame Blair either, and I do believe he acted on the information (lies) he was given by the US. We all now know what happened next, and should be very very careful not to fall in the same, multiplied by so many more 0000000s, disastrous trap- and certainly not on the bidding and lies of Trump and Netanyahu.

"Israel and the US have done us all a favour" I will reserve judgement on that one.

How about making the Middle East a nuclear free zone. Then everyone would be equal.

It’s now being said that all 3 targets were severely damaged, but nothing more heard about radiation levels. Was that a misspeak somewhere?

One of the rare times I went on a protest March - against involvement in Iraq. Didn’t work ,though,even though there were thousands of us. I’d go on one against joining in this war,too.

As for Iran being on days away from having a nuclear bomb?

Well, sometimes you need to look at things with some humour- it perhaps actually emphasizes the stupidity of it al even more. Since 2012.

fb.watch/AnLHEybEfy/

winterwhite

It’s now being said that all 3 targets were severely damaged, but nothing more heard about radiation levels. Was that a misspeak somewhere?

Perhaps because like Saddam's Weapons of Mass Destruction, which were never found- those didn't exist either?

Whitewavemark2

How about making the Middle East a nuclear free zone. Then everyone would be equal.

Surey as long as the 'West', including Israel in the Middle East, think they have the moral, political and religious superiority that gives them a God given right to have them themselves- ths can't work.

This is what many of us have been saying for a very long time, warning about the vast dangers or proliferation.

Whitewavemark2

How about making the Middle East a nuclear free zone. Then everyone would be equal.

Think we’re past that 😢

Highly likely the Cobra meeting will be about our participation in all this. No doubt Trump has asked to use our bases, possibly re-fuelling aircraft and other support. Starmer doesn't have the guts to turn him down and we will get dragged in.

Please sign the petition and write to your MP- never been a better time to do so.

I didn't sign petition because its press related. If it had been an official Govt one asking them to not support Trump in any way whatsoever in the Iran and Israeli conflicts then I would.

I believe in a ‘ if you want peace prepare for war’ approach, ever since my CND days when I realised that a lot of my beliefs were based on fear ( I still supported multilateral disarmament, though). But I don’t believe bombing Iran with no prior consultation with other countries that will be affected is the right way to go about things. If another country wants a show of strength they’re more likely to bomb a small island like the UK than anywhere else; it won’t be America that’s attacked. We’re just the buffer zone. Imo everything that’s happened recently is purely to protect Netanyahu, not Israel . No wonder he’s so pleased about what happened last night.