Radio 4 and Starmer

What amuses me is that a Tory Gov. would not dare implement these Welfare changes.
But
All might be forgiven is they get to grips with illegal immigration.
But
The zeitgeist of the UK is moving to Reform and Mr. Farage.
And
Labour only got in with disenchanted Tory votes.

GrannyGravy13

Iam64

Yes Not Spaghetti, I find myself thinking where is Alistair Campbell when we need him

Making £££ on various podcasts, after dinner speeches, cashing in on his time as Tony Blair’s spin doctor.

Oh and for preparing/sexing up the document on WMD, wouldn’t like to see him anywhere near Downing Street again.

Yes you make a reasonable point but -he’s interesting and imo often spot on when interviewed or podcasting,
Anyway - I meant a generic AC. Mis management of WFA and Pip should and could have been avoided
I was discussing this with other LP members, the consensus was the govt is right. The benefit bill is unsustainable. It needs overhaul. We have some areas with 40% on sickness benefits, inevitably they’re deprived areas with poor employment prospects and high numbers of people dependent on substances. What happened to levelling up
It’s huge job for any government.

The benefit bill is unsustainable.

What do you mean by 'unsustainable?

If you mean cost wise, then consider the fact that benefit payments are immediately spent into the local economy (and it matters not what they are spent on, any spending, whether others approve of what it is spent on ,or not, contributes to the economy, and so to GDP). Once it is spent it is subject to taxation, either direct or indirect, so some goes back to the Treasury.

Richard Murphy posted recently comparing the over all cost of health and disability benefits of about £70 billion (figures vary) with the cost of pension tax relief for those who can afford to save for their old age. This is also about £70 billion. While this money for a pension is being 'saved' it is 'dead money', doing nothing in the economy.

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2025/06/28/pension-benefits-for-the-wealthy-are-on-average-more-than-maximum-pip-payments-a-year/

I don't have a particular problem with the pension tax relief in itself, but it strikes me as unfair that the government is willing to forgo £70billion potential tax revenue from money that otherwise contributes nothing to the economy for years while it is prepared to cut welfare benefits 'to save money''. Not only adversely affecting the very poorest and disadvantaged n society but also conveniently forgetting that the money disbursed helps to keep the economy moving and much of it returns as tax.

I didn't ask for AC back.
Just aware he seems to have nobody helping him get the messages out there.

When Blair came in I loathed the man and his crew but he did do some good things with Education - SureStart for example which straddled health and education.

I agree that the messaging has been abysmal, and think that if someone had explained the reasoning behind some of the thinking it would have been a lot better. As we've seen on here, many people felt that the WTA was unnecessary as a universal benefit, but objected strongly when it was withdrawn, so maybe if the intention to pull it had been signalled, with reasons and expected outcomes it wouldn't have been so unpopular.

Again, the PIP debacle could have been much better handled if people had been told about measures to help people into work and the decisions explained, along with examples of how any money saved would be spent, and what measures would be in place to ensure that those in need don't miss out when changes are made.

I have been consistently aghast at how atrocious the comms have been from the start.

Boz

What amuses me is that a Tory Gov. would not dare implement these Welfare changes.
But
All might be forgiven is they get to grips with illegal immigration.
But
The zeitgeist of the UK is moving to Reform and Mr. Farage.
And
Labour only got in with disenchanted Tory votes.

Spot on.

The Tory government tried but were constantly defeated by howls of outrage from Labour and massed votes against them.
And if people are given allowances for poor health of course it matters what it is spent on; indulging on alcohol, cigarettes, a junk food etc. simply ensures longer on benefits and avoidance of work.

I don’t get that eazybee, as the Tories had an overall majority, just as Labour have now, so they had the mandate to do what they felt was necessary and get it voted through.

And, unlike Labour MP’s Conservatives don’t go against the whip when it comes to voting.