Will Trump really support Ukraine at meeting with Putin?

NotSpaghetti

I think he will make it look like Zelenskyy is rejecting something he has worked on.

I hope I'm wrong but fear he and Putin will go on blaming Ukraine.

He will have completely shot his credibility if he does that, and not just with Europe. I’m not sure his ego can cope with being seen to fail his ‘allies’, he’s already being portrayed as weak in the US press. His back is definitely against the wall.

It is worrying that on Monday, Trump will lay impossible demands on Zelenskii - which he will not be able to agree to..

Trump will then blame Zelenskii, and then walk away.

Oh! I should have read your post notspaghetti 🙄

Whitewavemark2

It is worrying that on Monday, Trump will lay impossible demands on Zelenskii - which he will not be able to agree to..

Trump will then blame Zelenskii, and then walk away.

I hope he will walk away. While Trump has been in Alaska Zelensky was courting European leaders, they no doubt agreed a plan of their own so let’s hear that.

If Putin can say “get lost” to Trump I’m not expecting a better response to Europe.

ronib

Lathyrus3 there’s a lot of blood shed between England and Scotland over the centuries.

Are you really saying that because, centuries back in the wild and woolly past, other regimes have used force to get power over other countries whose people did not want them taking over, a regime or a leader in the enlightened twenty-first century with expansionist ambitions can bomb the shit out of a country whose land and resources they covet with impunity, and then share out the spoils with a fellow-conniver in the name of "ceasefire" and "peace", while the rest of the world looks on and says "Well, it is no different to what happened to XXXX" ?

Elegran No I am not saying that.

I would add that the West has some pretty screwed up ideas about Russia who in turn exhibit some psychotic attitudes towards the West.
Thanks for reminding me Elegranthat we can simply ignore and disregard all the blood shed over the centuries because… it happened centuries ago. That’s okay then.
The present time doesn’t seem to have moved on much since the Battle of Bannockburn. Look at Gaza, Sudan, Ukraine and Northern Nigeria for example. Real examples of enlightenment…. Not.

I would add that the West has some pretty screwed up ideas about Russia

I'm wondering what exactly those screwed up ideas are?

Now that the "Summit" turned into a damp squib (instead of showcasing Trump as a saviour) he's changed his mind and decided Ukraine should hand over large chunks of territory to Russia.

Obviously, Trump has displeased his Puppet Master, Putin, and must appease him. Or else.

Even if it means throwing Ukraine under a bus and significantly risking WW3.

My point exactly Whitewavemark.
How awful.

I hope Europe will do something big.
I fear it won't.

The biggest thing Europe can do is encourage a new Eastern Bloc as Russia and China form a new alliance. Alternatively Europe could start listening to the concerns Russia has been voicing for some time now. Fat chance.

Ronib when you say "listen to the concerns of Russia" what or who are you actually talking about? The Russia which interferes in the elections of other countries and funds hackers to cause mischief and mayhem in the infrastructure of other countries, cuts undersea cables, poisons people with nerve gas putting non Russian citizens at risk, locks up opponents in gulags until they die, throws opponents out of windows, contols the media and siphons off money from it's citizens as if it's own private thiefdom. Oh and invades it's neighbours, kills it's women and steals it's children etc etc Listen to the concerns of that Russia?

Russians had no concerns apart from their fall in living standards etc which almost certainly meant that the psychotic murderer and bully Putin would have been voted out - unless of course he managed to kill more of his opponents.

So he took the opportunity to start a war - to keep peoples’ minds focused and away from their rubbish economy.

I don’t think that the signals are looking good from Trump over Ukraine.

Once again he has been persuaded by someone he perceives as “strong”

I thought Putin had made it so there are no elections in Russia and that he would be the leader until his death? Perhaps I imagined it but I thought he took away their democracy some time ago. Once a KGB man, always a KGB man. I don’t think Europe has the power to stop him, sadly. Trump is,right at the moment, the only chance but he will likely sell Ukraine down the river. Hope, really hope,I am wrong and peace can be found.

If Putin is not stopped and Trump succeeds in “giving” him some of Ukraine, and possibly a Ukrainian President who favours Putin, then he will be laying down the preparations for WW3

I found a lecture by Professor John J Mearsheimer on YouTube on “The causes and consequences of the Ukraine War”.
In a nutshell, Russia has always wanted Ukraine as a bulwark against the expansions of the West. Russia has a complete red line- Ukraine must not join NATO nor the EU. Russia has only 190,000 soldiers in Ukraine and this is not sufficient to conquer and invade Ukraine. Russia is not after the whole of Ukraine but a specific section in the Donbass region.
Etc
foxie48.

Yes wwm2 we’re beginning to see a consolidation between China and Russia as the new Eastern Bloc against an increasingly weak West.

foxie48 some of your comments apply to Starmer’s government at the moment- control of the media and siphoning off money from its citizens for example. It’s not just Russia.

Ukraine is a sovereign country.

Since when has it been acceptable for another country to dictate its foreign and domestic policy.

wwm2 I can’t remember the full details but there may have been some treaty or agreement to cover Ukraine’s position with NATO and the EU. We’re underestimating the importance of Ukraine as a bulwark to Russia against Western expansion.

Presumably you mean the man behind Offensive Realism, Ronib?

NotSpaghetti

Presumably you mean the man behind Offensive Realism, Ronib?

Yes. The video is informative NotSpaghetti

No there wasn’t a treaty to cover NATO and EU membership after all.