Setting a precedent?

Mt61

PoliticsNerd

People most likely to use "do-gooder" are those who want to diminish or undermine the moral efforts of others.

On GN it's a perjorative word people use because, although it's inflammatory, they think GN will ignore it. Most people leave name calling in the playground. A few never grow out if it.

Saying someone is a ‘do-gooder’ isn’t being inflammatory- some people do good, some people don’t.

It's used as a perjorative, to express contempt and disapproval Mt61, as I think most people would be aware.

If you are not sure you, or others, are being insulting perhaps you should check - otherwise you are being very non-GN. Some don't care of course.

Oreo and Mt61
France actually receives a much larger number of asylum claims than us, – 167,000 in 2023, compared to 67,000 in the UK.

I think a relatively small proportion asylum seekers actually want to come to the UK.

Oh really Politicsnerd, will take that on board 👍🏻

StripeyGran

Not entirely sure what an irregular person is ? Do you mean neuro diverse?
I live with two of those, if that helps at all.

Isn’t that what King Charles calls them?

We were told not to call them illegal migrants, I thought ‘irregular people’ was the new term, mind you that could change next week!
Not sure what we have to call these people.

People?

NotSpaghetti

Oreo and Mt61
France actually receives a much larger number of asylum claims than us, – 167,000 in 2023, compared to 67,000 in the UK.

I think a relatively small proportion asylum seekers actually want to come to the UK.

🤣🤣🤣🤣

Mt61

Would you volunteer to house one, or two, Stripeygran, & perhaps politicsnerd?

I believe it's important to approach this with compassion and understanding.

While I understand the challenges involved, I think solutions should be fair, well-organised, and ensure that both those seeking asylum and the wider community are supported. Ultimately, I think addressing the broader considerations and responsibilities is key.

Re "irregular". It is the migration that is irregular, not the people. The phrase that has been used is "irregular migration." The issue for the people involved is that there is very little in the way of regular paths for those seeking asylum.

The strength of today's protests - they were small - tells me that although there are one or two on here, and a small number in the country with strong anti-assylum feelings these protests are a lot smaller than the pro-Brexit feelings, smaller than the Rejoin March and certainly the Gazza protests. This tells me that feelings aren't as strong as the press trys to make out.

Mt61

We were told not to call them illegal migrants, I thought ‘irregular people’ was the new term, mind you that could change next week!
Not sure what we have to call these people.

Irregular arrivals is the term used by the UK Government, Mt61

That may change next week, of course.
Keep up at the back.

petra

Mt61

Mt61

That’s it, we haven’t got the infrastructure to cope with the amount of people coming across. Why don’t they settle in France, much bigger than our country. Why do they want to risk theirs lives?

Lilli4

Our black economy. In France they have nothing like the scale of it we have here.
The only way to stop that is police visiting all the premises where this is happening. But we don’t have enough police, do we 🤷‍♀️

No, we don't and it was short-sighted to cut law enforcement budgets over the last government. Unlike cuts to benefits or some public services, the results aren't immediately visible, but we're paying the price now.

The public isn't aware how much work goes on behind the scenes to detect smuggling networks and illegal/forced labour in the UK. There's often a drug or illegal guns connection. The profits from all the illegal activity fund even more illegal activities on an international scale.

I'd love to know what Reform's detailed plans, including cost and impact assessments, actually entail. They're always a bit short on detail. They're more interesting in creating division and scare-mongering. Incidentally, today's protests were orchestrated mainly by a right-wing organisation called Homeland (a splinter group of neo-Nazi Patriotic Alternative), which doesn't have any solutions either.

Allira

Mt61

We were told not to call them illegal migrants, I thought ‘irregular people’ was the new term, mind you that could change next week!
Not sure what we have to call these people.

Irregular arrivals is the term used by the UK Government, Mt61

That may change next week, of course.
Keep up at the back.

Exactly! It's the act which is irregular, not the people themselves.

StripeyGran

People?

No reform isn’t the answer for sure GS

Sorry SG that was for GS.
Yes people, what else are they?

Exactly! It's the act which is irregular, not the people themselves.

Like being told to say, “That was a naughty thing to do,” instead of “you’re a naughty boy.”
The boy was still in the wrong for doing the naughty thing.

People who arrived in irregular ways?

Mollygo

^Exactly! It's the act which is irregular, not the people themselves.^

Like being told to say, “That was a naughty thing to do,” instead of “you’re a naughty boy.”
The boy was still in the wrong for doing the naughty thing.

I do hope you're not a parent or at least that your children have grown up and survived your parenting.

What would you expect to achieve by constantly telling a child they were naughty? My guess would be a naughty child. That level of disrespect and lack of compassion and understanding is very likely to backfire. You have put them in a box marked "naughty child".

A child labelled "naughty" has no reason to behave otherwise. It's like telling a child constantly they are "bad" at something. The most likely outcome is you will be proved right but that is no fault of the child.

What makes you assume that Mollygo was constantly telling her child they were naughty?
What a strange thing to assume!

That's quite right, Mollygo, telling a child that what they did was naughty, rather than making the child feel that they themselves were naughty.

I'm sure all the children who have passed through your supervision over the years realised that!

You obviously misunderstood what Mollygo said, PoliticsNerd, which was in fact the same as you.

I that case I'm happy to apologise. The last line of Mollygo's post made it somewhat moot.

No PN, you just look for opportunities to nitpick, and in this instance to demonstrate your usual nastiness, but We Do Not Care either for the nastiness or the apology.

I didn't read Politics Nerd as nit-picking. (just saying)

The trouble with words without inflection or body language to accompany them is that we do have less clues as to meaning and not many of us read and revise what we are saying when chatting online (like this).

I don't think anyone was a bad parent from a few words written here.

For what it's worth, I can honestly say I've never used the word "naughty" at all, let alone with children, as it's a word I hate for it's rather frothy lack of specificity!

I do hope you're not a parent or at least that your children have grown up and survived your parenting.
This to me, sounded very personal. If someone were to criticise my parenting skills, I would be very upset.

escaped

^I do hope you're not a parent or at least that your children have grown up and survived your parenting.^
This to me, sounded very personal. If someone were to criticise my parenting skills, I would be very upset.

It was meant to be personal and it is typical NP.

Mollygo

escaped

I do hope you're not a parent or at least that your children have grown up and survived your parenting.
This to me, sounded very personal. If someone were to criticise my parenting skills, I would be very upset.

It was meant to be personal and it is typical NP.

And there you have it, about NP threads, folks!

NotSpaghetti

I didn't read Politics Nerd as nit-picking. (just saying)

The trouble with words without inflection or body language to accompany them is that we do have less clues as to meaning and not many of us read and revise what we are saying when chatting online (like this).

I don't think anyone was a bad parent from a few words written here.

For what it's worth, I can honestly say I've never used the word "naughty" at all, let alone with children, as it's a word I hate for it's rather frothy lack of specificity!

No, it wasn't just nit-picking.

I presume PoliticsNerd completely misunderstood what Mollygo said and a qualified apology seemed insincere.

The point is that referring to a child as a naughty child is similar to referring to a person as an illegal. Both are wrong in that they refer to the person, not the action.