Woman shot and killed by ICE officers in Minneapolis, Minnesota

Must look back to see what DAR said.

Yes DAR, good post.

Thanks Lemo Jam. Putting in tbe timeslot helps.

Please excuse the typo LemonJam

There is none so blind as those who will not see.

I have a busy weekend. Hopefully Minneapolis will not escalate this weekend and tensions calm.

Perfect post DAR.

Rosie51

And just for Trump's education, the UK has postal voting and there has been no evidence of widespread fraud surrounding it. Obviously there will have been some misuse of postal voting but it has never been significant and certainly not influential on the outcome.

Reform want to removed postal voting for many people. From the 2024 election contract:

Commence Reform of the Postal Voting System

Postal voting has allowed electoral fraud. We will stop postal voting except for the elderly, disabled or those who can’t leave their homes.

I just happened to run across this article from 2014 on ICE use of force practices.

www.thenation.com/article/archive/us-border-agents-intentionally-stepped-front-moving-vehicles-justify-shooting-them/

It may have a paywall. So I am going to c&p it so you can all see.

Another vote for DAR’s post.

Whitewavemark2

Another vote for DAR’s post.

Me too. Also her post re 1984…

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Rosie51

And just for Trump's education, the UK has postal voting and there has been no evidence of widespread fraud surrounding it. Obviously there will have been some misuse of postal voting but it has never been significant and certainly not influential on the outcome.

Reform want to removed postal voting for many people. From the 2024 election contract:

Commence Reform of the Postal Voting System

^Postal voting has allowed electoral fraud. We will stop postal voting except for the elderly, disabled or those who can’t leave their homes.^

Then we must hope that Reform is never in a position to try and implement this. Postal voting was first introduced, at least in part, to allow people who work away from home to cast their vote. Reform would remove that right? Perhaps they'd like to remove the right to have a proxy cast your vote too?
Total rubbish about electoral fraud, yes it exists but in such a minuscule way that does not have a smidgeon of effect on the outcome.

This article talks about CBP. ICE uses the same practices both CBP and ICE are under Noem.

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The Los Angeles Times obtained an internal review of US Border Patrol’s use-of-force policies, which US Customs and Border Protection has refused to release publicly (members of Congress have seen a summary). While the Times did not offer the report in full, the paper did publish previously unseen snippets that portray a law enforcement agency operating under loose use-of-force standards and little accountability.

The review was completed in February 2013 by the Police Executive Research Forum, a nonprofit that develops best practices for law enforcement use-of-force policies. It examined sixty-seven use-of-force incidents by federal border agents near the US-Mexico border that resulted in nineteen deaths.

Here are some key findings of the review, revealed by the Times Thursday:

Border Patrol agents have intentionally and unnecessarily stepped in front of moving cars to justify using deadly force against vehicle occupants.

Agents have shot in frustration across the US-Mexico border at rock throwers when simply moving away was an option.

Border Patrol demonstrates a “lack of diligence” in investigating incidents in which US agents fire their weapons.

It’s questionable whether Border Patrol “consistently and thoroughly reviews” incidents in which agents use deadly force.

US Border Agents Intentionally Stepped in Front of Moving Vehicles to Justify Shooting at Them
An internal review of the US Border Patrol raises serious questions about the agency’s use-of-force policy.

The Los Angeles Times obtained an internal review of US Border Patrol’s use-of-force policies, which US Customs and Border Protection has refused to release publicly (members of Congress have seen a summary). While the Times did not offer the report in full, the paper did publish previously unseen snippets that portray a law enforcement agency operating under loose use-of-force standards and little accountability.

The review was completed in February 2013 by the Police Executive Research Forum, a nonprofit that develops best practices for law enforcement use-of-force policies. It examined sixty-seven use-of-force incidents by federal border agents near the US-Mexico border that resulted in nineteen deaths.

Here are some key findings of the review, revealed by the Times Thursday:

Border Patrol agents have intentionally and unnecessarily stepped in front of moving cars to justify using deadly force against vehicle occupants.

Agents have shot in frustration across the US-Mexico border at rock throwers when simply moving away was an option.

Border Patrol demonstrates a “lack of diligence” in investigating incidents in which US agents fire their weapons.

It’s questionable whether Border Patrol “consistently and thoroughly reviews” incidents in which agents use deadly force.

The report is especially scathing in its critique of agents who’ve stood in front of moving vehicles, recommending that they “get out of the way…as opposed to intentionally assuming a position in front of such vehicles.” The authors add:

It should be recognized that a half-ounce (200-grain) bullet is unlikely to stop a 4,000-pound moving vehicle, and if the driver…is disabled by a bullet, the vehicle will become a totally unguided threat… Obviously, shooting at a moving vehicle can pose a risk to bystanders including other agents.

The report recommends that Border Patrol bar agents from shooting at vehicles unless their lives are threatened and also from firing at rock throwers. An internal response by Border Patrol, also obtained by the Los Angeles Times, rejected both these recommendations. The agency said a ban on shooting at rock throwers would endanger agents because they work “in rural or desolate areas, often alone, where concealment, cover and egress is not an option,” and that a ban on shooting vehicles would empower drug smugglers to run over agents. The response echoes statements made by Border Patrol chief Mike Fisher in November.

At least twenty-one people have been killed by Border Patrol agents working on the US-Mexico border since 2010. In 2012, agents shot at a 16-year-old boy multiple times in the back, killing him. The latest fatality happened this month, when a border agent near San Diego shot and killed an undocumented migrant for throwing rocks, one of which struck the agent in the head. In all these cases, it’s unknown as to whether any of the agents involved were disciplined, as CBP does not make that information public.

Oh you wish the thousands of small boats carrying illegal migrants or asylum seekers or whatever you want to call them to continue arriving here then? That’s strange because the vast majority in the country don’t want it to continue and neither does our government either. (Oreo 12:34:39)

I didn’t express support for small-boat crossings at any point. I explained the legal meaning of terms being used. Responding to an argument I didn’t make avoids engaging with the one I did.

My point was that legal terms have specific meanings. Dismissing those meanings as ‘whatever you want to call them’ is precisely the problem I was describing.

Legal status isn’t a matter of opinion or popularity. Whether the public likes it or not doesn’t change how the law classifies people.

Public opinion doesn’t determine whether a term is legally accurate. My point was about accuracy, not popularity.

When legal distinctions are waved away as semantics, language stops describing reality and starts shaping hostility instead.

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Rosie51

And just for Trump's education, the UK has postal voting and there has been no evidence of widespread fraud surrounding it. Obviously there will have been some misuse of postal voting but it has never been significant and certainly not influential on the outcome.

Reform want to removed postal voting for many people. From the 2024 election contract:

Commence Reform of the Postal Voting System

^Postal voting has allowed electoral fraud. We will stop postal voting except for the elderly, disabled or those who can’t leave their homes.^

Agree with that. Even a small amount of fraud can alter results, especially if a small win, so out with it apart from exceptions noted.

Deliberately stepping in front of vehicles.
Giving them the excuse to use lethal response.
Despicable.

Rosie51 15.18 👍

imaround 15.22 👍

Maremia

Deliberately stepping in front of vehicles.
Giving them the excuse to use lethal response.
Despicable.

But believable. I also imagine the person who did it has been lionised among the MAGA ranks, and probably will dine out on it for a very long time.
It makes me feel sick to my stomach.

CNN has done a very detailed analysis of all the videos currently in the public domain - before, during and after the shooting.

After the ICE officer shoots Renee 3 times in the head at point blank range, and her car careers out of control, smashing into the back of a parked car, we see him walk over to her car, look in the drivers window and then walk calmly away.

Chilling and disturbing behaviour!

Freya5

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Rosie51

And just for Trump's education, the UK has postal voting and there has been no evidence of widespread fraud surrounding it. Obviously there will have been some misuse of postal voting but it has never been significant and certainly not influential on the outcome.

Reform want to removed postal voting for many people. From the 2024 election contract:

Commence Reform of the Postal Voting System

^Postal voting has allowed electoral fraud. We will stop postal voting except for the elderly, disabled or those who can’t leave their homes.^

Agree with that. Even a small amount of fraud can alter results, especially if a small win, so out with it apart from exceptions noted.

You can agree, of course, but it's not true. Official data and multiple fact-checks show that convictions for postal voting fraud are extremely rare. In the last several years there have been only a couple of convictions — and those were in local elections, not national ones.

The UK Electoral Commission says there is no evidence of large-scale electoral fraud in recent years, including in postal voting.

So, there is no evidence of large-scale, systemic postal vote fraud in the UK, US, or most other democracies, nor is there evidence that postal voting alone reliably produces fraudulent outcomes.

Trump has a history with claims of 'voter fraud'. He filed numerous legal suits, urged local and state authorities to overturn 2020 election results in their jurisdictions, pressed the Justice Dept. to verify unsupported claims of election fraud and worked with congressional allies to overturn the results in Congress on January 6th with no success.

So he continued with legal challenges in key states- but all were dismissed by the courts- no evidence available to support his claims.

So Trump continued his efforts by making statements of conspiracy theories, rigged voting machines, polling place fraud etc- claiming the election had been "stolen "from him.

Graphie: "Reform want to removed postal voting for many people. From the 2024 election contract:

Commence Reform of the Postal Voting System

Postal voting has allowed electoral fraud. We will stop postal voting except for the elderly, disabled or those who can’t leave their homes."

Farage is well known to be a Trump admirer. Just because Reform says "postal voting has allowed electoral fraud" does not make it true. In fact available evidence shows that is not the case.

Worrying that people may think it is true....

Graphite- I apologise for my typo in your name.

Farage shares a similar history to Trump in alleging "corruption in the UK's Postal voting system, two examples: 2015 Oldham West and Royston by election, Peterborough June 2019. No evidence put forward by Farage and police found no evidence either. Farage's Brexit party at the time launched a petition under the People Act 1983- unsuccessful.

Farage and Trump share many similarities....

LizzieDrip

CNN has done a very detailed analysis of all the videos currently in the public domain - before, during and after the shooting.

After the ICE officer shoots Renee 3 times in the head at point blank range, and her car careers out of control, smashing into the back of a parked car, we see him walk over to her car, look in the drivers window and then walk calmly away.

Chilling and disturbing behaviour!

Yet there was a claim that he was acting in self-defence and had ended up in hospital.
😲

They would not let a nearby medic attend to her.
🤬

Reform Document August 2025- promises to create an "enforcement unit called UK Deportation Command, including an "Illegal Migrant Identification Centre".

That is ICE by another name....