Woman shot and killed by ICE officers in Minneapolis, Minnesota

MayBee70

I honestly can’t believe that some people on this thread are condoning the fact that this woman was shot in the head and that it was her own fault.

Do you know what condoning means? Just asking as there are no posts condoning this shooting at all.

Oreo

Starfire57

Maremia

When the SS began targeting 'illegals' in Germany in the 1930's, they were not at war. When Posters see and understand echoes from the past, they are entitled to discuss those trends.

Incorrect. That was not the same as people invading the US illegally. Jewish did not illegally migrate to Germany. They were encouraged to migrate early on.

But later on, they stripped of their rights as citizens, effectively becoming illegal. But ironically, the government imposed high emigration taxes, making leaving difficult.

But the horror of putting them into camps, enslaving them and then the gas chambers......to compare that to the US deporting illegal Mexicans is quite insulting to the memories of those people, I would think.

www.bing.com/search?q=were%20jewish%20actually%20migrate%20illegally%20to%201930s%20germany&qs=n&form=QBRE&sp=-1&lq=0&pq=were%20jewish%20actually%20migrate%20illegally%20to%201930s%20germany&sc=0-55&sk=&cvid=AF677861F25C427F9F639FA7E1CC09D4

It is insulting, as a Jew I can assure you of that.

I can only imagine. So sorry.

Pointing to examples in the past is entirely valid.

The situations do not have to exactly match the ones currently happening.

when we are discussing the steady, piece by piece growth of a tyranny affecting ordinary people lives, plus a divided society (ie MAGA support the tyrannical leader):

The parallels are all too obvious.

Actually Cossy as a (somewhat distant) relative of Edith Cavell, I want to object to you using her life as a comparison with the protest methods evidenced here.

Edith Cavell, as a nurse, treated both German and British patients without prejudice and with the same care. Her motive in helping prisoners escape was to save their lives. At no point was she a “protestor” in the way she behaved. Indeed she was noted by the Germans for her dignity and respect for them as human beings, even when facing death.

Personally I think the shooting was totally wrong.

But Edith Cavell would not have been associated with this type of protest in any way, and I do not think you should use her as an example.

( incidentally her name is pronounced to rhyme with gravel, in case anyone is saying it as Ca vell)

They don’t match at all, never mind not exactly!

I read reports that ICE have detained a number of native Americans.

Anyone got any idea where ICE will deport them?

Quite Lathyrus3 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

Whitewavemark2

Starfire57

Cossy

“THIS!!! If people in the media stopped the hysteria over law enforcement, if folks would just cooperate, so much of this would be avoided!

A person always has the right to see a judge and give those arguments. And worse case, if you did what you did, broke the law, then pay the penalty. And next time, don't do it.”

Oh dear, bit difficult to do this if you’re dead

My point being, you wouldn't be dead if you did it.

Not true I am afraid. If you read the description of the shootings, by no means were ICE officers in fear for their life in most cases.

Look at the deaths in custody.

But as the evidence is clearly being knobbled it is difficult to defend any of the deaths quite frankly

Wait....so you are saying if people cooperated, they'd still be shot/dead anyway?

Because my original point was that if you cooperate, like in this case of obstruction, chances are, either you are let go with a warning or jailed for obstruction, which btw is indeed, against the law. But, jail, better than dead.

Reliable reports this time Whitewavemark2 ?
If so, they will soon be released.

Anyone know why ICE use masks?

To protect their identities so that they and their families can live safe lives I expect.

MaizieD

Oreo

Maremia

When the SS began targeting 'illegals' in Germany in the 1930's, they were not at war. When Posters see and understand echoes from the past, they are entitled to discuss those trends.

Six million Jews were murdered in Germany, they were the real targets of the Nazi regime, not ‘illegals’.

Jews were not Hitler's only targets 1in the 1930s

aboutholocaust.org/en/facts/were-jews-the-only-victims-of-nazi-persecution

They were the main targets by a long way.

Excerpt from an article in Texas:

"Robert Cerna, acting director of the Dallas office, addressed the issue during an interview on CBS Evening News, saying masks are used to protect agents from being identified and targeted."

“They wear a mask for their protection, and it’s not really just their protection, but the protection of their family,” Cerna told CBS correspondent Tony Dokoupil. He added that officers must protect themselves “from being doxed” and from “people harassing them because of what they’re doing.”

The steady growth of a tyranny has occurred at many time in many places over history: we don't just have to point to Nazi Germany: (in the 20th century Soviet Russia is another example, as is China, as is Italy under Mussolini, arguably Syria, certainly Afghanistan now: going back further the British didn't exactly treat its subject nations with anything but tyranny:

there are many many examples of how a once benign situation changed to tyranny: of course I respect of course the particulars of any situation and how we might feel about them:

but my point remains that the USA is moving more and more towards a real tyranny, the pointers are all there: and that there can be no excuses for what is happening, unless you are entranced by the MAGA myths.

In Nazi Germany it was 'legal' to target the Jews.
It was against the law to protect or hide them.
There are times in history when laws can be 'wrong'.
There are times now when laws can be 'wrong'.

I think you’re wrong Wyllow3 a tyranny isn’t anything to do with a democratic country.You just mean that you don’t like the policies coming from this particular President, which is quite a different thing.
The next President of the US could easily be a Democrat.

Maremia

In Nazi Germany it was 'legal' to target the Jews.
It was against the law to protect or hide them.
There are times in history when laws can be 'wrong'.
There are times now when laws can be 'wrong'.

Of course, who says otherwise? But when there are guns in the equation you’d do best to obey any laws and protest about it later.

Re - masks

Strange that - the police FBI etc don’t see the need to wear masks.

If they are using excess violence and need to be called to account - as we have seen is happening - how easy is it going to be for the police to identify them?

She was told to go.
She co-operated, by starting to move away.
She was shot.
So, by co-operating, she was not safe.
The suggestion, that she would have been safe if she co-operated, has been disproven.

Oreo

I think you’re wrong Wyllow3 a tyranny isn’t anything to do with a democratic country.You just mean that you don’t like the policies coming from this particular President, which is quite a different thing.
The next President of the US could easily be a Democrat.

If elections go ahead, by 2026.

We have heard evidence from imaround and others how elections are already being manipulated: Trump is more than capable - that is is he can still carry the military with him - of deciding not to have them, and ignore votes in the Houses.

Maremia

She was told to go.
She co-operated, by starting to move away.
She was shot.
So, by co-operating, she was not safe.
The suggestion, that she would have been safe if she co-operated, has been disproven.

She was told to get out of the car, it’s easily heard on the video.

Good point WhiteWave, to where do you deport First Nation citizens?

Wyllow3

Oreo

I think you’re wrong Wyllow3 a tyranny isn’t anything to do with a democratic country.You just mean that you don’t like the policies coming from this particular President, which is quite a different thing.
The next President of the US could easily be a Democrat.

If elections go ahead, by 2026.

We have heard evidence from imaround and others how elections are already being manipulated: Trump is more than capable - that is is he can still carry the military with him - of deciding not to have them, and ignore votes in the Houses.

That won’t happen, it’s just doom mongering.

She was told to move on, easily heard on the video.

She was also told to go. Given the choice and knowing what the ICE militia are capable of my choice would have been to go.