West Midlands Police Scandal

Lathyrus, it’s interesting that the significant issue on why focus on one group is not being discussed

He may not be safely out of the woods yet, if there’s an internal police enquiry, tho I won’t hold my breath on that.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/inspection-of-police-forces-contributions-to-safety-advisory-groups-west-midlands-police/inspection-of-police-forces-contributions-to-safety-advisory-groups-west-midlands-police-accessible

It was an interpretation of the report by a journalist but nonetheless, it is fairly accurate to say that WMP were economical with the truth.

If not, then why has Guildford been forced to resign? Had they been vindicated, this would not have happened.

Allira

Lathyrus3

Clever diversion into the problems of the Met.

If you can’t shut a discussion down, diversion is a tried and tested tactic, when you don’t want people to focus on what actually happened and why.

🙄

I think it is a general and ongoing problem with many police forces.

The West Midlands Police have had and have serious problems with corruption over the years, still happening.

Most police officers, I am sure, are honest and determined to uphold the law. However, when those at the top are less than honest, it is worrying.

I don’t disagree with that.

But what everyone seems to be reluctant to point out is that this was a case that had a very specific focus- the anticipated violence - and the decision to ban Jewish fans rather than police those who might protest against them.

It was the need to justify this stance that made the adoption of false evidence necessary.

So for me, the important question is not about corruption in general, but about why the decision focused on one particular group.

I really wasn’t saying it shouldn’t be discussed but that more speculation would be divisive, that is what I was trying to say to Oreo but somehow it turned into trying to stop a discussion.

Trouble is that posters put their own interpretation on others' words and somehow manage to alter their meaning or make big leaps in inferring the implications of what has been said.

I'd be interested to know where the news report Allira copied yesterday, 18.05 was published. I have read Sir Andy Cooke's report and think that the news item exaggerates it somewhat.

It would be helpful if people could post a link to c & p items, or at least tell us the source of them.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6967aedfa2bb8d22cd7b0dbe/inspection-police-forces-contributions-safety-advisory-groups-west-midlands-police.pdf

I agree with AGAA4 at 10.45 today.

I'm more than happy to discuss the issue of evidence fabrication, deliberate or accidental. AI is a very dangerous tool and it worries me that so much reliance is being placed on it. I do think that people seem to think it is just a search engine, but it isn't.

Maybe start a thread on Met corruption and Met successes

This one is focussed on a CC who lied, I’m shocked by that though I’m old enough to know better

Lathyrus3

Clever diversion into the problems of the Met.

If you can’t shut a discussion down, diversion is a tried and tested tactic, when you don’t want people to focus on what actually happened and why.

🙄

I think it is a general and ongoing problem with many police forces.

The West Midlands Police have had and have serious problems with corruption over the years, still happening.

Most police officers, I am sure, are honest and determined to uphold the law. However, when those at the top are less than honest, it is worrying.

Lathyrus3

Clever diversion into the problems of the Met.

If you can’t shut a discussion down, diversion is a tried and tested tactic, when you don’t want people to focus on what actually happened and why.

🙄

I’m not diverting. I gave my reason for not being shocked or surprised and it went from there.

Here are 6 of the worst MET scandals.

news.sky.com/story/six-of-the-worst-scandals-the-metropolitan-police-has-faced-in-recent-years-as-pressure-grows-on-force-12839492

Clever diversion into the problems of the Met.

If you can’t shut a discussion down, diversion is a tried and tested tactic, when you don’t want people to focus on what actually happened and why.

🙄

Rosie51

Fallingstar

petra

Oreo
I’m not shocked.
It’s been a long time since I was shocked by a headline that stated the police lied.
This opinion doesn’t come from hearsay or the Daily Mail but from personal experiences.

Well we suffer the Met here in London, so enough said.

And by this you mean what? I have a son in the Met, what are you implying about him?

No-one is implying anything about your son but there are rogue elements in the Met Police which should be rooted out.

Petra we are in Lewisham. Not far from Greenwich.

Rosie51
When the commissioner of the MET says it’s going to take a decade to fix the corruption in the ( he’s wrong there) you know something is amiss.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2025/oct/02/met-corruption-crisis-commissioner-mark-rowley

Fallingstar

petra

Oreo
I’m not shocked.
It’s been a long time since I was shocked by a headline that stated the police lied.
This opinion doesn’t come from hearsay or the Daily Mail but from personal experiences.

Well we suffer the Met here in London, so enough said.

Fallingstar
I grew up in Woolwich and Greenwich. Enough said 😉

Rosie51
Am sorry if I inadvertently insulted your son. There are good police officers and bad in the Met, sadly it has had a really bad rep which am sure you are aware of but would never say that all police officers in the Met are not doing a really sterling job and don’t deserve to be tarred with the same brush.
Am sure your son is aware of the rep the Met has in London and is doing his utmost like others to remedy this.

I don't think it's divisive for us to expect our police to present evidence, in any case not just in this one, which is thoroughly investigated an truthful.

We have seen too many cases where miscarriages of justice have happened in serious criminal cases. New laws do help to prevent this but we would be naïve to think it does not occur now.

Fallingstar

petra

Oreo
I’m not shocked.
It’s been a long time since I was shocked by a headline that stated the police lied.
This opinion doesn’t come from hearsay or the Daily Mail but from personal experiences.

Well we suffer the Met here in London, so enough said.

And by this you mean what? I have a son in the Met, what are you implying about him?

Galaxy

In my experience when people say don't talk about a subject, it usually indicates a subject of high importance.

Ain’t that the truth!

People don’t like talking about things that make them uncomfortable

I’m going to post something really random now but the West Midlands police is a massive organisation and I think the bigger organisations are, the people at the top are so far removed from the people on the ground -so to speak- the they lose touch with what is actually going on. In a general sense and a wider sense.

I really wasn’t saying it shouldn’t be discussed but that more speculation would be divisive, that is what I was trying to say to Oreo but somehow it turned into trying to stop a discussion.
I very much doubt any of us have the wherewithal to stop a discussion, and as a newbie who is discovering just how a thread can grow legs and walk, I think I would be the lowest in the pecking order when it comes to trying to stop anything.

Support for the comments from GrannyGravy and Allira.

As Galaxy points out up thread, news and politics discussions are often divisive. Why is this one special, in that many are saying it shouldn’t be discussed. Why not?..

Yes GG13 the issue with the police is newsworthy but there is more to this thread than that. That's all I was pointing out.

GrannyGravy13

Fallingstar

AGAA4

I am not shocked as this seems to happen too often. Disappointed yes but I can see what this thread is really about.

Indeed.
It seems to just be a thread aimed at causing more division, as if we need that right now.

Why is a thread on one of the leading news stories of the last 24 hours aimed at causing more division

Surely it is of huge public interest that a police force fabricated a scenario with the use of AI to suit their purposes/agenda ?

X post and I agree 100% GrannyGravy

MaizieD

^I think we should stop this and let this matter rest now, there has been far too much racial and political sensitivity already.^

Wise words, Fallingstar

👏👏👏👏

The investigation is ongoing.
Are you saying we should not discuss it because it is etill ongoing?

If you are saying we should not discuss it for any other reason, sorry, this is an extremely serious matter in that false information has been used by a senior police officer to justify hi actions.

But you should be satisfied that a senior member of staff in the Midlands police force has been sacked as a result of it.

More false information. Guildford was not sacked, he resigned and will receive his full pension.

The public deserves the truth and to be able to trust the police.

Fallingstar

AGAA4

I am not shocked as this seems to happen too often. Disappointed yes but I can see what this thread is really about.

Indeed.
It seems to just be a thread aimed at causing more division, as if we need that right now.

Why is a thread on one of the leading news stories of the last 24 hours aimed at causing more division

Surely it is of huge public interest that a police force fabricated a scenario with the use of AI to suit their purposes/agenda ?

MayBee70

It is a lie to pretend that Maccabi fans have never gone out of their way to cause trouble. The end result ie the ban was the right one imo. If they had come here and caused trouble I'm sure that any protesters or muslims in the area would have been totally blamed for it.

Are you saying that the findings of HMICFRS are incorrect?
I am sure the investigation was carried out without prejudice.

The matter has been referred to the The Independent Office for Police Conduct (IOPC) which has said it will continue looking into the actions of West Midlands Police, and the decision to ban Maccabi Tel Aviv fans from Birmingham, following Craig Guildford’s retirement as Chief Constable

www.policeconduct.gov.uk/news/iopc-statement-following-craig-guildfords-wmp-retirement

It is not unusual to find this kind of false evidence-fitting amongst police forces.