Andy Burnham says wealthy areas must house more migrants after leafy village revolts over 1,250 asylum seekers

Tuliptree

But you well know Monica that on here as elsewhere the debate is fuelled by misinformation , lies, exaggeration, hatred, outside forces,. It’s impossible to have the rational discussion necessary to.

It’s certainly not possible to have a reasonable or rational discussion with those posters who blithely believe all is hunky dory with large numbers of young men from foreign countries who have different cultures and religions descending on villages here.With very little money and nothing much to do.

M0nica

Communities of all kinds have objected to having large groups of immigrants living in their midst. Does the OP not remember all the anti-immigrant riots in various inner city areas following several high profile murders last year?

It is also a question of proportion. House 1250 immigrants in London and it will barely be noticed. Take a small rural community with a population of 370 and move 1250 people in and it is a rather different story.

There are plenty of unleafy villages left. old mining communities in Durham and South Wales. How would the class warriors among those posting here feel if these immigrants were being sent to a small mining village with 370 residents, and just a church and community hall.

Large groups of young men are always a problem.all that testosterone and not yet mature brains Back in the day, 1960s/70s when we had a much larger army than now there were regular public order incidents in garrison towns when lots of young soldiers were released from barracks - and these were white British males in a service where discipline was all and where they had working lives and regular pay.

Try to see this problem dispassionately without all the tedious class posturing. If you lived in a small community anywhere, whether affluent or impoverished, would you want 1250 young me, whether pink blue or green, born and bred for 20 generations in this country, or newly arrived on our shores, young men without jobs, nothing to do all day and no money, suddenly housed (where?) in your village?

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

The visage hall in Piddington has excellent wi-fi which is provided free by some company.

What sort of budget is needed to house in Hampstead, Godalming, Poole Harbour, Chelsea? What sort of accommodation is available in these areas as opposed to the deserted streets of Bolton for example? At what cost?
Burnham’s class rhetoric is so last century?

21:16Cossy

Did the doctors and nurses you post about arrive on a dingy or the new mega dinghies I don't think so, do you? I think people must be naive if they still think the ones coming over on the dinghies are doctors nurses and engineers.

22:18Tuliptree

Well surely with the resources of the church and the village hall, a whole raft of activities could be planned.

Such as dances with the young girls of the village lol

Tuliptree

And Thetford is not a village but a market town. But feel free to carry on posting misinformation - a long and honourable tradition by some on GN.

And just up the road, Diss is a "town of sanctuary" and in spite of the Park Hotel fiasco had been welcoming to refugees.
They have apparently done this in conjunction with churches and local charities.

Diss has a population of just 8,000.
Thetford 25,000

Apologies grannygravy I see you have already given us Thetford's population.

Ok Tuliptree I agree about misinformation so let me correct. Thetford is indeed a small town, not a village and although it is in Norfolk part of its boundary is in Suffolk. Yes the recent protests were physically against HMOs housing migrants in the town. However in June it was proposed that the nearby Burnham Camp be used to house up to 3,750 migrants and this has precipitated several protests and no doubt imo played a part in the attack on the HMOs.

I’ve been wondering about the church in Piddington. Can’t find any statement from them online. I’d expect them to take some sort of role in this debate in the village.

25Avalon

Ok Tuliptree I agree about misinformation so let me correct. Thetford is indeed a small town, not a village and although it is in Norfolk part of its boundary is in Suffolk. Yes the recent protests were physically against HMOs housing migrants in the town. However in June it was proposed that the nearby Burnham Camp be used to house up to 3,750 migrants and this has precipitated several protests and no doubt imo played a part in the attack on the HMOs.

And nothing excuses the attacks on the HMOs and the police does it? But I guess many of those involved in that are being stirred up by lies on social media, the Tommy Robinson band and so on.

Genuine question here - with little money and not allowed to work, what is there for these people to do when housed in towns and cities? Does it really make much difference from that point of view whether they are there or in/near smaller towns and villages?

Yes, I admit that I would not be happy if they were going to be housed near my tiny rural village, too, but I suspect I might also feel the same wherever I lived, because like most people, I fear 'the unknown' and 'change'.

I'm fairly sure that none of us want this type of accommodation anywhere near us, but as it has to exist - if only while these people go through whatever process is required to decide their fate - they have to be housed sonewhere. And within reason, I don't think any areas, however 'wealthy' should be exempt from housing them unless it is for genuine practical reasons.

Share the responsibility (or the 'problem') around.
I reckon that might lead to a more rounded approach to the whole issue.

As I said upthread, a sudden influx of people into any community changes it, and people who chose to live there for its quietness or whatever will find it difficult, although I’m not sure who buys a house near a barracks and expects a traditional rural lifestyle.

But that’s not what the OP was about. First, it blamed Andy Burnham. Then it talked about wealthy areas as opposed to less wealthy ones, and mentioned that the village in question is ‘leafy’ despite the large barracks (which was not mentioned).

Then there was the ‘working hard’ trope, as though people who live in non/leafy areas must be idle, and nobody buying property in ‘nice’ places has inherited money or had well-paid but non-strenuous employment.

Then there was the rant about asylum seekers not paying for their asylum, as though we didn’t have a problem with the welfare bill that pays for Brits who don’t pay a penny into the system.

All of this cloaked in sarcasm about how ‘wonderful’ and Utopian it all is. Let’s not pretend that this started as a genuine debate about where to house people - the OP was far from that.

25Avalon

I think it’s Thetford in Norfolk where the protest has happened. Apparently they are a very harmonious village who see nothing but disharmony occurring if so many migrants with totally different cultures being placed in their midst and I must admit I agree.

Why don’t they stay in France? Why do they all want to come here? Ask yourself that. It couldn’t be to do with all the freebies could it?

Regarding black and Asian doctors and nurses these are legal migrants that we do need who put into their midst economy not take out of it.

I agree.

Regarding your final paragraph I couldn’t see what Cossy means either about black and foreign staff in hospitals either.

Surely they are all here legally so I don’t have a problem with that at all. Unfortunately our family has spent most of the past 18 months in various hospitals for life saving surgery, chemo etc so I do appreciate that many staff come from overseas.

It’s a choice between former military bases, other suitable multi occupancy premises and hotels. A year ago everybody was screaming for military bases to be used. Now they are being, and locals object. It’s a no win situation.

To be practical, there will be a mixture of "camps/barracks" and spread out local housing.

My impression is that "camps/barracks are for newcomers, who have to be rapidly assessed, hard to do when spread out, and for quick return of some.
We do not know yet whether people placed in these camps/barracks will actually be allowed to go out beyond bounds, which is what is being assumed in the discussion above.
Someone who has really suffered abroad will tolerate this, freedom from whatever they fled. God knows, I would. Lots of physical activities on site. We have high levels of unemployment for 20 somethings to pay who can get a good game of footie going, they need basketball courts and similar, and preferably something to do that is of use.

Not beyond one's imagination.

Tuliptree

25Avalon

Ok Tuliptree I agree about misinformation so let me correct. Thetford is indeed a small town, not a village and although it is in Norfolk part of its boundary is in Suffolk. Yes the recent protests were physically against HMOs housing migrants in the town. However in June it was proposed that the nearby Burnham Camp be used to house up to 3,750 migrants and this has precipitated several protests and no doubt imo played a part in the attack on the HMOs.

And nothing excuses the attacks on the HMOs and the police does it? But I guess many of those involved in that are being stirred up by lies on social media, the Tommy Robinson band and so on.

Attacks are not excused any more than I excuse the pulling down of Colston’s statue in Bristol but sometimes when people feel strongly about something they take action. Barnham Camp is one such catalyst. But you guess it’s down to lies on social media and Tommy Robinson. That’s trying to push a subjective viewpoint in an emotive way.

Doodledog

As I said upthread, a sudden influx of people into any community changes it, and people who chose to live there for its quietness or whatever will find it difficult, although I’m not sure who buys a house near a barracks and expects a traditional rural lifestyle.

But that’s not what the OP was about. First, it blamed Andy Burnham. Then it talked about wealthy areas as opposed to less wealthy ones, and mentioned that the village in question is ‘leafy’ despite the large barracks (which was not mentioned).

Then there was the ‘working hard’ trope, as though people who live in non/leafy areas must be idle, and nobody buying property in ‘nice’ places has inherited money or had well-paid but non-strenuous employment.

Then there was the rant about asylum seekers not paying for their asylum, as though we didn’t have a problem with the welfare bill that pays for Brits who don’t pay a penny into the system.

All of this cloaked in sarcasm about how ‘wonderful’ and Utopian it all is. Let’s not pretend that this started as a genuine debate about where to house people - the OP was far from that.

Well said. I won’t take further part now in any threads about migrants, where the sole purpose of posting is to make nasty, not so covert, goady digs.

Frankly there’s some posters here whose entire raison d’etre for posting is simply to be divisive.

These people, are all humans, most of them will have appalling backstories, however much you wish to pretend they don’t.

Some on here speak from a place of compassion, of knowledge, have worked or volunteered with Aslyum Seekers, others parrot what our right wing media posts and the likes of Farage, Lowe et al spout.

Like it or not, Brexit has affected this situation, like it or not International Asylum Law and Maritime Law gives these humans rights, you might not like, you don’t have to like it, but is factual.

Yes, I too want the boats to stop, I also want those here processed quickly, those very few committing heinous crimes deported and those not meeting the criteria deported.

Far far more of our British born citizens are affected by poverty, unemployment, mental health issues, etc etc than they ever will be by the Asylum Seekers.

Please put things in perspective.

Sunshinegirls

21:16Cossy

Did the doctors and nurses you post about arrive on a dingy or the new mega dinghies I don't think so, do you? I think people must be naive if they still think the ones coming over on the dinghies are doctors nurses and engineers.

That isn’t what I posted , please read properly.

Casdon

It’s a choice between former military bases, other suitable multi occupancy premises and hotels. A year ago everybody was screaming for military bases to be used. Now they are being, and locals object. It’s a no win situation.

Just don’t let any of them set foot on British soil.

Tuliptree

The problem is that for asylum seekers/refugees there is no approved manner now is there? That’s part of the debate isn’t it as to if there were, would it stop people coming on the boats ? I’d assume not

Don’t waste your breath, there’s a refusal to understand that many of these countries these people arrive from don’t allow exit visas and that even if they did, we in the UK don’t have an entry visa called “Seeking Asylum”

Btw AI tells us this;

Many asylum seekers and refugees arrive in the UK with professional skills, higher education degrees, and extensive work experience from their home countries.

Studies and data regarding displaced populations show that a significant portion possess valuable qualifications across critical sectors.

Professional Backgrounds and SkillsHigher Education:

Research indicates that roughly 23% of arriving refugees hold a degree-level qualification or higher (such as undergraduate, master's, or doctoral degrees).

Skilled Occupations: Arrivals frequently include individuals with backgrounds as engineers, IT professionals, software developers, architects, teachers, and scientists.Healthcare Expertise: A notable number have trained and worked as medical doctors, nurses, dentists, and pharmacists in their countries of origin.Management and Trades:

Others bring experience as senior managers, administrators, or in specialized construction and skilled technical trades.“

Yeah I agree with the PM. Send the AS anywhere apart from the NW and NE of England. We have had more than our fair share. By the way I'm also hard working and want to live in a nice area just like you do .

10:35Cossy

I think it's me wasting my breath if you think the ones on the dinghies are bringing skills with them, if that was the case hospitals and IT tech companies would be recruiting them from abroad they wouldn't have to pay people smugglers to get here. Good grief.

Allowing 1,250 migrants to move to Piddington with its population of 370 would be three times the population of that small village. This cannot be right. It would transform the population balance of a very small rural community almost overnight.

It is sheer madness.

10:46yanda

I live in the NW but that was not my point, Andy Burnham said we all have to take our share but Andy Burnham Unelected PM with no mandate we don't want them full stop.