The, A

Caleo

Dickens

Caleo

Dickens

Gwyllt

Dickens. Accents are accents and they have no rules.

Surely then as everyone has an accent of some kind there should be no rules !!

... but - accents are not the same as the rules of grammar!

Look, it doesn't really mater whether anyone uses a short or a long 'e' in 'the'... but this is Pedant's Corner - and I'm being pedantic!

It is a snobbish world we live in. Perhaps this should not be so but it is so.

If you are annoyed by comments that will inevitably appear, well... pedantic - finicky, why click on Pedants' Corner?

There's nothing snobbish about my comment, it's surely obvious I was attempting a little bit of light-heartedness. Or did you miss the part that said... "it doesn't really matter"?

Good Heavens! I was not trying to offend you or anyone. else. I was commenting on the social reality that some 'accents' are posher than others, even in these more enlightened days.

I was commenting on the social reality that some 'accents' are posher than others, even in these more enlightened days.

What do you mean by even in these more enlightened days?

People speak how they speak, some have regional accents, others don't.
Some of us had elocution lessons at school, in the hope, I think, that they would eradicate our accents and teach us how to speak proper like.

The/thee and a/an are nothing to do with accents. With some younger people it seems to be an affectation, more 'street-talk'.

BlueBelle

Afraid I say the evening and the afternoon so I m sloppy…..hands up I own it 🤣

It's not sloppy, in fact it's more difficult to say.

I think it's just copying the American way of speaking which is why so many younger people speak that way - just like lots of people used to swap around the way they hold their knife and fork. I agree very annoying.

This thread has made me realise I do say thee evening. Saying the evening is harder so I'm lazy I guess.

Dickens

Caleo

Dickens

Gwyllt

Dickens. Accents are accents and they have no rules.

Surely then as everyone has an accent of some kind there should be no rules !!

... but - accents are not the same as the rules of grammar!

Look, it doesn't really mater whether anyone uses a short or a long 'e' in 'the'... but this is Pedant's Corner - and I'm being pedantic!

It is a snobbish world we live in. Perhaps this should not be so but it is so.

If you are annoyed by comments that will inevitably appear, well... pedantic - finicky, why click on Pedants' Corner?

There's nothing snobbish about my comment, it's surely obvious I was attempting a little bit of light-heartedness. Or did you miss the part that said... "it doesn't really matter"?

Good Heavens! I was not trying to offend you or anyone. else. I was commenting on the social reality that some 'accents' are posher than others, even in these more enlightened days.

Caleo

Dickens

Gwyllt

Dickens. Accents are accents and they have no rules.

Surely then as everyone has an accent of some kind there should be no rules !!

... but - accents are not the same as the rules of grammar!

Look, it doesn't really mater whether anyone uses a short or a long 'e' in 'the'... but this is Pedant's Corner - and I'm being pedantic!

It is a snobbish world we live in. Perhaps this should not be so but it is so.

If you are annoyed by comments that will inevitably appear, well... pedantic - finicky, why click on Pedants' Corner?

There's nothing snobbish about my comment, it's surely obvious I was attempting a little bit of light-heartedness. Or did you miss the part that said... "it doesn't really matter"?

Caleo

Dickens

Gwyllt

Dickens. Accents are accents and they have no rules.

Surely then as everyone has an accent of some kind there should be no rules !!

... but - accents are not the same as the rules of grammar!

Look, it doesn't really mater whether anyone uses a short or a long 'e' in 'the'... but this is Pedant's Corner - and I'm being pedantic!

It is a snobbish world we live in. Perhaps this should not be so but it is so.

There is nothing snobbish about it.

In English, whatever our accent, it is correct to use a short 'e' before a consonant and a long 'e' (ee) before a vowel, just as we would use 'a' before a consonant and 'an' before a vowel.

The reason is that saying thee evening is much easier than saying the evening with a short 'e', which sounds forced.
Would anyone say a apple? (Ben Fogle might, but I'll forgive him 😀).

This is Language Police Corner, Aveline!

Any O and E of mine are due to autocorrect.

Dickens

Gwyllt

Dickens. Accents are accents and they have no rules.

Surely then as everyone has an accent of some kind there should be no rules !!

... but - accents are not the same as the rules of grammar!

Look, it doesn't really mater whether anyone uses a short or a long 'e' in 'the'... but this is Pedant's Corner - and I'm being pedantic!

It is a snobbish world we live in. Perhaps this should not be so but it is so.

Gwyllt

Dickens. Accents are accents and they have no rules.

Surely then as everyone has an accent of some kind there should be no rules !!

... but - accents are not the same as the rules of grammar!

Look, it doesn't really mater whether anyone uses a short or a long 'e' in 'the'... but this is Pedant's Corner - and I'm being pedantic!

Don't most native English speakers avoid a glottal stop after 'the' ?

BlueBelle

Afraid I say the evening and the afternoon so I m sloppy…..hands up I own it 🤣

I can't see anything wrong with that.

Dickens. Accents are accents and they have no rules.

Surely then as everyone has an accent of some kind there should be no rules !!

An hotel, correct but not heard often now.

Our weather forecaster says “ in the early hours”. She makes a glottal stop which is jarring.

English language is very confusing
youtu.be/sOUqHr9tcVY?si=qTeAKdNE3wWBemcF

If it is thee earth and not the earth then where did the second e go?

eazybee

^Aren't students taught about the Definite and Indefinite articles anymore?^

Of course not. It's all about communication, innit?

It isn't accent, it is sloppy pronunciation. Interesting to note younger members in a choir questioning pronunciation . Not, I am in a choir and am fortunate in being taught something I was not aware of, but rather, I have never heard of it, therefore it cannot be right.

Of course they are. It is part of the National Curriculum for English at Key Stage 1 and 2.
Two minutes research would have told you this.

Aveline

It is an accent. A personal way of pronouncing a word. It's a way that some of you don't like but, tough, nobody is the language police.

This is Pedants' Corner, we're allowed to be pedantic!

And it's not an accent - it's pronunciation. The rule is mostly that a short 'e' is used before the next word beginning with a consonant, and the long 'e' before words beginning with a vowel.

Accents are accents and they have no rules.

This came up in my choir. Obviously we all need to be “ singing from the same hymn sheet” and unifying our pronunciation, so our Director of Music pointed this out in the phrase “ the earth” , to be sung as Thee earth. He stated that this is normal in English. A couple of younger members queried this, saying they had never come across this before.

I think where choral music is concerned, you would have to pronounce 'the earth' as 'thee earth' in order to sustain the musical note - depending on the score of course. Or elongate the 'eearth' bit to prolong the words to fit the note tempo! IYSWIM.

Afraid I say the evening and the afternoon so I m sloppy…..hands up I own it 🤣

Aren't students taught about the Definite and Indefinite articles anymore?

Of course not. It's all about communication, innit?

It isn't accent, it is sloppy pronunciation. Interesting to note younger members in a choir questioning pronunciation . Not, I am in a choir and am fortunate in being taught something I was not aware of, but rather, I have never heard of it, therefore it cannot be right.

Aren't students taught about the Definite and Indefinite articles anymore?

I think you are wrong about the "A" (for example) being an accent.

My husband says it's known as "spelling pronunciation" he says it goes with pronouncing the "t" in "often". Reading words as they are written.

I only use the long "ay" sound for extreme emphasis - "I said a book, not the book".

It's a strange thing to me and I see it sitting alongside vocal fry to be honest!

Not something ( The) I have ever noticed or thought about, or worry about come to that.

Aveline

It is an accent. A personal way of pronouncing a word. It's a way that some of you don't like but, tough, nobody is the language police.

Ahem! The language police are alive and well on here.😁