need a rant

Good post,*Alea*!.

I can see where everyone is coming from. Mikes has a very valid point and he's speaking from 21 years of caring for a stroke victim and yet his love for his wife shines through. We are becoming a society where 'me' comes first, sadly. But those on here who are getting on with the day to day strain of either caring for a loved one or watching them slowly deteriorate are not part of the 'me, me, me' brigade. They are just looking for somewhere to offload, get some support and then get on with the caring as best they can.

I have no experience of being a carer, but I know I'd find it very hard. People are different and some are just better than others at some things.

If I found myself in that caring situation, I know I'd really REALLY appreciate a place to let off steam, moan, cry etc - just as a release, without being judged or being thought an awful person. You shouldn't be made to feel bad for those perfectly natural feelings.

It must be so hard for many of you - I take my hat off to you all.

There is no value in pretence in this situation. Caring can be very hard indeed and to pretend otherwise is just plain crazy. It is unhealthy not to acknowledge this. Mikey I admire your devotion, but I refuse to believe that you never feel tired or have a fleeting moment when you think what might have been. You clearly love your wife, as the grans on here do their partners, but it is unrealistic to expect that you and others will never find caring a challenge. As someone has already pointed out, we love our children and GC with a passion, but I am sure that we did not love clearing up after a teenage party or scraping poo of the best sofa! Pretending that we did enjoy it would have been dishonest.

This does not imply an absence of love or willingness; just a recognition of the heavy load that some carry. It is even enshrined in law in the Carers' Act which states that when SSD are making an assessment of need they must also take the carer's needs into account.

The grans on here are not grumbling; they are simply gratefully accepting the support of those in a similar situation. Their love of their partners is not compromised, nor are they being disloyal.

The sense of guilt that some carers feel in not being superhuman and in sometimes feeling fed up or exasperated is not helpful; and this thread has the potential to defuse that guilt and offer carers a chance to chat in a non-judgmental way to others in a similar situation so that they can return to the fray with renewed vigour.

I'm getting boring here but - good post Lucky! This thread is full of wisdom and compassion.

when our children got sick,,,did we tier of caring for them,,did we complain.or is it,this wasnt the deal i signed up for.or the life i wanted,when we say its ok to let off steam about caring,it doesnt end there,instead it begins,the care home,assisted dying,make no mistake,this is about the self,and what it wants,oh i get fed up..angry,,tearfull,,,but not because my wife is a burden,to comlpain about,,but because she endures so much,,,,and who am i to say, i am the one suffering,the one complaining,the one carrying the burden,i need to let of steam,,,,the self ,in its most selfish mode.the very opposite of love,,you get sick,,and this is what it has done to me,,,,me...love is caring.it has no qualifications to be met,,it is unconditional,,we never get weary of caring for a sick child,,why is it so different when its an adult.that adult used to be a child to...unconditional

he has a stroke,,,shes got to clean up after dinner,,and shes the one to suffer,,oh dear,,,she resents the change in lifes circumstances,but he is the one,who does the real suffering,and we support her,,this is misplaced empathy,,and helps no one,,the self only knows that it wants,,,

Mikey now you are being unfair, to OP and those of us who have voiced our own feelings. You are clearly a great guy, maybe one in a million, although I remember my own Dad's devotion to Mum in her later years when he was in his 80's and she was chair bound with Parkinsons and dare I say, a frequently short fuse. She had regular falls in the house and would be hospitalised which at least meant he got a night's sleep but then would toil over to the hospital 10 miles away, (on the bus ) to visit her every day even though she could be really grumpy when he got there. His GP advised me that if they went on in this way, it would probably kill him, but they still refused to contemplate a care home for her. Anyway she actually died suddenly in hospital and he lived on for 5 lonely sad years.
However, to get back to this thread, a person cannot function effectively as a career unles they also pay attention to their own welfare. This is not the "Me, me" mentality you describe, but think of this, we are told, in the event of an emergency in a plane, that adults should put their own oxygen mask on before their children. There is a very good reason for this and it is NOT, I repeat NOT selfishness.
You can apply this to our role as a carer, what good are you to your wife if you run yourself into the ground or crack up under the strain?

I do not agree with you mikey - I think you are fundamentally wrong. I would not challenge you on this (as you clearly care devotedly for your wife) were it not for the fact that your views are what cause devoted carers to feel guilty for having human frustrations and feelings. And it is very important indeed that carers do not feel guilty about their humanity.

I worked as a SW with the sick and disabled for decades and spoke to hundreds of carers. Many were very distressed by their own occasional negative feelings and frustrations. I spent vast amounts of time helping them to allow themselves to be human, organising relief care, holding their hands through the bad times; and also setting up a voluntary project that allowed trained volunteers to give carers a few hours off to meet a friend, go to a hospital appointment etc.

Denying these feelings does not help most carers and I think they appreciated the help that was given and the "permission" to be imperfect in such an emotional and distressing situation.

The OP was brave enough to say how she felt, and most of the fellow carers on here could understand how she felt and have been able to share our feelings and needs to the benefit of all.

I would add to the previous 2 posts that the OP wanted to let off steam which implies, to me, that she copes really well most of the time and was just looking for a little support. And, I say, good for her that she came here to do it!

And, good for GN that she felt able to do so and good for GN for supporting those of us who need it, when we need it!

And, thank you to Ariadne for allowing me to start lots of sentences with 'and'.

I'm having a quite 'tense' day myself and people not cutting others a bit of slack are making me even more tense!

And I am happy to hold your hand kitty!

I would also be the first to admit that yes, at times I have most definitely resented my children being ill. DS has slight aspergers, fortunately he is extremely intelligent but he has had lots of problems along the way. I love him dearly but also really used to value the holidays, when he wasn't at school and the emails from the teachers stopped coming because they couldn't understand how he thinks.

Some people are born to care, others prefer to be up and out and doing so of course they need to let off steam. When DBH was first diagnosed he was so bad that I was scared to go out without him, as others did on here I had to let my social life slide. I am very lucky, I have friends who just turned up anyway for an hour or two, but if it hadn't been for this board I would have felt very isolated. After all, I can hardly tell MiL (who is my chief phone-caller) that I find her son a pain in the butt at times, and am sure that he is putting it on a bit, can I?

if you were sick,,and you overheard your hubby,saying,,am so exhausted,,so depressed,,,what would you think,,,he doesnt love me,,hes selfish,,or its ok,,,when we say,its ok to vent your feelings,,i think it is not,,its a complaint,,no matter how we disguise it,we are unhappy because of the hubby or wifes illness is having on our lifes,,one has a stroke,,and the other is unhappy,,i have freinds in the same boat,who need to talk to someone ,at times,,and i listen,,their lifes have changed,,and they dont like it,,,and resent it,,of course if it were them,,thats a whole different ball game,its the disturbance in their life people resent,and it is resentment,,,expressed as exhaustion,,depression,,had friend tell me how hard it is for him,,how exhausting it is for him,,,as his wife lay unable to feed her self,,imagine what she feels,,its not her he talked about,,but himself,,he is the focus of his attention,,a world seen from only from his perpspective,and his life will be hard,,because he makes it so,

I think anyone who is the main long-term carer and has no time off, no respite, nothing of their own, and says that they never, ever feel unhappy, tired, lonely, or fed-up is either an unusually strong and unselfish person, or is putting on the best face they can and would be ashamed to admit to what seem like negative feelings. They may not be aware of the stress that they are under, but it is there, and can have an effect on their body as well as their happiness.

How often you hear of a carer having a sudden fatal heart attack or other serious illness, and the one they were caring for living on for years. Often it is the most dedicated uncomplaining carers who fall victim to stress-related illness. Letting off steam occasionally away from the caring situation can save lives.

You wouldn't let your wife, or hubby, or whoever you are caring for, overhear such a thing. That is why people are posting on here, away from any chance of them hearing and being hurt.

These posters are not moaning to them, or in front of them, they are talking to friends well away from home. and by doing so they get support and encouragement, so that they can continue to be loving and cheerful at home, and not let it build up so that they burst out with how depressed THEY are when they they are at the end of their tether.

You're being very sanctimonious Saint Mikey

Are you really so perfect?

Mikey has been censorious elsewhere, too. Are you sincere, mikey, or do you just like to criticise?

are you a carer mikey or a cared for person.
It is a well known fact that tiredness and exhaustion cause depression,along with the isolation.
where better to offload than an anonymous forum where you get the support of other people in your position.
That offloading and support may just be the lifeline a lonely carer needs.

why would caring for one you would give your life for be such a burden,so distress causing,and yes..i am a carer,,do i get down...no i dont,,its my wife who suffers not me,,i feel sad for what she endures,,what she has lost,,and since when did loving care cause depression,,i know many carers,some selfless and the perfect example of true love,,others self obsessed,greaving the loss of their former life,wishing the hubby never got sick,resenting it,,and if you feel that,,your going to be depressed,with a burden allmost to heavy to carry,remember this,,,i would die for my kids,,in a heart beat,,,,but there are some who would not,,and therein is the answer,,,i critisise no one..or judge,,but only reflect what i see,,empathising,knowing when,is the tricky part

But you do criticise, mikey. All the time.

Here is a quite different story -

Imagine you have a strong back and can carry a hundred-weight sack of coal a mile without trouble, without ever putting it down for a breather , without saying to yourself or to a good friend you meet on the way, "Ooooh my back"

You meet someone also carrying a sack, who has to have a rest more often than you do, and says "That is heavy!" when he puts it down for a few minutes.

Is it fair to criticise him or her for taking a break and gathering his or her strength again before carrying on? Is it fair to criticise them for not damaging their back for life? For not saying to a good friend that they don't think they can go any further without a drink of water?

Caring is the same - you may be blessed with the strong back and the strong mind, but you need the rest of the world a bit of slack.

And I cared for someone I would have given my life for, so I know what it is like, and what it is like when they are no longer there to care for. I also know that it takes everything you have and more.

Good post Elegran. For someone who is so caring Mikey doesn't show a lot of compassion.

And for you too.

Thanks for holding my hand Lucky. I was only with Mum for an hour

if carrying that hundred weight sack,, to a place, to collect your 10 million loto win,,it would not seem so heavy after all,,,would you stop to complain to another,,,no......any burden can be lightened,by how we think about it,demanding empathy,compassion,does not work,,that only reinforces our veiw of the load we carry,the poor me,,,is confirmed,by the empathetic,and the relief felt is short lived..to change our hearts and mind..brings lasting relief,,people are outraged ,because i dare to sugest another way,that i lack compassion,,,well,,it is not me who complains,of exhaustion or depression,,it is you,my wife is no more a burden or depression inducing than she was ,when she was well,,, say your hubby got ill,,now your depressed,, how self centred is that,,the emphasise is on ,self centred,,,there is another way,,,thats all i am saying,,if you prefer .empathy,then seek it out,you will find plenty.but it will not cure the sadness

No-one on here is demanding anything! The posts are the equivalent of breaking into tears! If you have never wept, great for you.

mikey I would not criticise your care for your wife for one moment, but your reaction to and criticism of those who have described their own situation suggests a degree of pent up anger.
I hope you never feel the need to unburden or if you do, that you will receive a more sympathetic hearing than you have given others.
OP started out feeling bad for "having a moan", if you had been the only person to reply, she would have (and maybe did) feel a whole lot worse.
Do not judge others, please.
Can't really say any more without opening the whole thing up again. You have your opinion, many people do not see things your way.