Support for those estranged from family members. Moving on together,

Thinking of u rhinestone when will u know results? Reaisemunfew hours behind us
Lesser of 2 evils i reckon

I'm freaking out now. It's almost ten here and that man may become our Leader.
He is a loose cannon and will start the next war . Maybe I can move to England as my passport is updated. Why can't we have a woman leader? So archaic

Feel for you Rhinestone.

Looks like I am able to list, been following you all and love to everyone.

Well his in! I didn't like Hilary, saw a clip of her defending a brutal rapist [when she was a lawyer many years ago], she really slated the little girl he raped, how could a women do that!!

So a female lawyer who defends her client is wrong. A man who is accused by 25 different women of sexual assault/harrassment is ok? Lawyers are paid to defend their client, they don't get to choose them. Men can choose whether or not to indecently assault women and also choose whether to laugh about this e.g. you can do anything to them, grab their pussy, kiss them etc etc... they'll let you do anything.

I don't know the case to which you refer Yogagirl, but from what you say, if Hilary was slating the little girl, lawyer or not, she is a human being and should not have treated the girl in that way, so shame on her. Iam64, yes lawyers do not get to choose their clients and many do, knowing cluents are guilty but finding a technicality to get them off. I still think there are people who are lawyers that remain human beings and have integrity. It shows the measure of the person that they can be so detached not to consider a little girl who was raped. How does a child ever get over that anyway? It shows Hilary as wanting to win her case anyway she can, regardless of that little child. I do not condone anything Trump has said, I found his campaign as brutal, could not bear to hear him speak he was at best a total embarrassment. At least Hilary moderated her language. It is a pity that the best America could come up with was those two, toe curling.

Well said luckylegs

I know we chat about all sorts on here but don't really need any of trumps vulgar terminology do we?

He must have something going to get so many votes I guess

Maybe lesser of 2 evils?

I am afraid I didn't follow the campaign very closely.

We have made appt to update our wills oh dear it is hard but we have no choice.

ANyone watch the adoption programme ? So moving those poor girls forced to give up babies in such an uncaring way.

Pendulum swung too far now almost badge of honour to have baby and no dad, be enfits will provide.

That programme made me cry, children cannot possibly understand in these liberated times how shameful it would have been to have a baby out of wedlock. I just wish those children that were forcefully adopted would put themselves in their birth mothers shoes, their heart must be broken. In the sixties, I never even knew there was anything like unemployment allowance, the stigma of being unemployed was a disgrace. We have come such a long way since the then, another world. You always respected your parents word for a start off, what they would make of the way some of our very indulged children treat parents who wanted them, I don't know.

I wondered if myndaighter watched it, doubting, it was so emotional when mother a d son Were reunited and he said imagined hearing your mothers voice for first time.

Yes luckylegs we gave all we had emotionally and financially to our daughter to be treated in the most horrendous way and cast aside like unneeded rubbish,

When I was at school 1970 a friend was turned out by her parents for getting pregnant, luckily her partner and his parents stood by her,

When I was 15 a friend if mine got pregnant, I had never been out with a boy and didn't know she had. Her mother kicked her in the stomach, saying she had bought disgrace on the family. My mother was disgusted and I remember her saying it's no good her going to church when she does that to her own daughter, the baby was born and given to an aunt. I said what would she have done if it had been me , her reply was, better not happen, but if it did it would not be given away and the neighbours could please themselves. We all duly married and had white weddings, but I often wondered what happened to my friend and that baby. A lot of those parents were to blame, we were never told the facts of life and some were plain cruel to their daughters, the boys got away with it.

I'm on holiday in Florida. Heard on the news there is a petition to 'stop' Trump becoming president (as if!) and it already has 3 million signatures. Unfortunately it isn't going to make any difference.
Oh dear Rhinestone, better get that passport dusted off. Mind you, as one local lady said to me in Publix yesterday, 'You Brits are in a bit of a fix with your Brexit.' I couldn't do much else but agree.
We have been here since Monday night. Yesterday, I received an email from my sons partner who estranged herself from us almost 18 months ago and from whom i have heard nothing during that time. Before the estrangement she insulted DH and me accusing us of doing, saying and even thinking things we have never done, said or thought. This was followed up by a vile email. That was Summer 2015.
This email on Wednesday came out of the blue and asked if we would like to go to Christmas Dinner!! I just don't know how we could sit down for a meal with this woman after what she has put us through. I don't know if DS is aware she has sent the email. I dont want to contact him about it while we are away. We are having a much needed holiday. Apparently, we have to make up our minds by the end of the month. Her parents will be there but since the estrangement we have had very little contact with them. DH and I assumed that their daughter had turned them against us. DH is adamant he won't go. He said he would choke on his food. This woman has, in turn, hurt, shocked and angered us but we have been at peace since she severed ties with us. I wish I didn't have to think about this on my holiday. Your thoughts would be welcome lovely ladies.

I do sympathise - most of the time our DIL wants nothing to do with us & has accused us of lots of horrible things that aren`t true - but occasionally I will get a cheery text from her and on the very rare occasions we do see her she acts as if nothing is wrong. It`s harder to deal with someone like that than with someone who is consistent.
Could you possibly make up a reason for not actually going for lunch but call in later on in the day? If you turn her down completely she will use that as a reason for not seeing you in the future. Perhaps she has actually realised she has behaved badly and wants to make amends (and pigs might fly)

Fairydoll Could you email her thanking her for the kind (unexpected) invitation but say politely that unfortunately it's too late to change the plans for Christmas Day because arrangements have already been made. Suggest an alternative "you'd be most welcome to join us for pre/ post Christmas celebrations" that puts the ball firmly in her court.
I know I'm being very passive aggressive here ladies but somtime I just can't help myself. I'm not as nice as I think I am. Enjoy the rest of your holiday Fairy

I know I am a visitor on this thread so don't know the background fairydoll. However if your DIL is offering an olive branch I think you should go. Try and put aside the past horribleness and start again. Presumably your son will be there? Any grandchildren? Perhaps this will be the start of better things. If her parents are there too that should help . Travel hopefully is my advice! xx

Is difficult one fairydoll and try not let it spoil your holiday?Tend to adhere with last post what I would give for olive branch !

My therapist who assessed. Me yesterday (and I was in tears all time felt so drained afterwards guess as my friends said she knew which buttons to press and am more upset than realised about mediation knockback) shendid make me alight by saying I had offered a whole treee let alone a branch to estranged daughter over last 8 years,

she has offered me few more sessions to try focus on not letting this massive sadness destroy,what life we have left.

It was when she said you umcant expect to move on totally your are her mum that tears started.

Still had nice cuppa with friends afterwards and great night outmladt night just couldn't dance back still very painful ?

Hi Fairy....you couldn't make it up could you? You take yourselves thousands of miles away, hoping to leave your troubles behind, and with the power of technology you get hit in the gob with this!!

I know - as I'm sure do you - what you should do - or at least what those who have never been in this position would say you should do. Be unfailingly grateful for this wonderful opportunity. Those of us, however, who have suffered the endless, inexplicable cruelty meted out by these women, who have tried endlessly to come between us and our sons, will have deep fears and reservations. I personally could not spend a day as special, and fraught with emotion, as Christmas Day, with someone who had hurt me so much. I would have to say that Christmas has already been organised, but that you would happily visit - briefly! - at some other time during the holiday period. When these situations have never been properly addressed, and explanations or apologies given, there is always the elephant in the room, and thus the potential for things to kick off again. When someone had shown you who they are, believe them.....or at least be very wary of them.

Despite all of this, have a great holiday....before The Donald does his worst!!...Rosy.x.

Iam your post is rude, offensive, vulgar & crude! It should not be allowed on this thread!

*Luckylegs^ exactly the same thing happened to my best friend. She suddenly disappeared for months, I then heard she had had a baby that was given to her sister. Years later I visited my old friend at her sister's house, and there was this little girl calling her auntie mummy. Think this happened a lot way back.

Celebgran didn't see that programme, what was it called? I could watch it on catch-up. I did watch a programme like this about a year or so back, and made me cry too!

OH dear Fairydoll what a dilemma! From estrangement to having Xmas dinner together is a bit odd. Eddiecat's suggestion is a good one I think.

I gave a whole tree too Celebgran sorry you are so upset, but afterwards you will feel a little better, having spoken of your heart-ach. I have now excepted, after all I've seen and heard this week, [which I told you a little of C], that I will never see my estD&GC or my estS again. I sent him an email yesterday evening, no reply of course

Yes quite right Rosy

Hope you are OK Smileless, take it the move and emotions have taken there toll this week! God Bless

Nice weekend all Oh, go on than but wait till after 6pm

FairydollI would say GO and kill that woman with such sweetness and kindness. She is extending the olive branch. When I was teaching I had a mean nasty secretary who I had to go through every time I wanted to see the head of the school. After many years of her nastiness to everyone I decide to be disgustingly sweet. It worked and we actually had a nice relationship afterwards.
I checked out the Hillary defending a rapist. She was assigned to him by a judge. The girl was given psychological tests and was evaluated and the conclusion was that the girl was a liar.
On another note we have had horrible hate crimes in schools one in my old neighborhood. These twelves year olds were telling " build a wall, build a wall" to some children of Latino descent.
Then another school had teens yelling "white power". Thank you Mr. Trump.
It will only get worse. He has yet to condemn this.
Have a good weekend all

Oh hell rhinestone it does sound awful in states at moment,

Totally agree yogagirl that post by iam64 is crude and not welcome on this thread.

However I could not respect a president who disrespects women this way, or anyone for that matter,

Just spoken to my son outlined will change it is hard be good be good get it over,

Sos smilelss where are you ?! Hope all well expect busy busy moving xx???

Fairy doll, if you miss this chance in your sons eyes you won't be bothered. Know you will probably have to have a stiff drink first, bcause you know what she is capable of, but it is just one day. You and your husband have a lovely Christmas Day another day, congratulate yourselves you did the best for your son, he is the one that matters. I am the worst person out for my face conveying how I feel, but I would do my best for a few hours and be charm personified.
Rhinestone, what can I say, when he was with Obama, he looked out of his depth, he is no statesman that's for sure. But he has the vote so you have to see how it pans out. Pray for a miracle, people just wanted change I guess, regardless.

Fairy doll, morethans suggestion is a really good alternative and is really worth considering.

Fairydoll what a shame to have this worry imposed on you while you are on an obviously much needed holiday. I think if I was offered an olive branch I would have to accept if only for my own peace of mind so that I would then know I had tried and done my best to fix things. Sometimes we have to swallow our pride and try to forgive - hard as that may be. But then I am far too soft and forgiving for my own good. I am becoming a bit harder as time goes on because I think I have to be - it's called self preservation!
Every now and then - usually when I'm feeling down and looking for answers I trawl the internet for advice. Last week after a programme on R4 called The Untold - about a lady's ES being found dead after drug overdose, I found a helpful website called EMPOWERING PARENTS. Mostly about young kids but there was this page about estrangement. I tried to attach link but 'paste' isn't coming up. I'll try again.