Continued support and fun aspects too of rebuilding lives after estrangement can't believe 4 years and we still here to offer help, friendship and support.

It seems rather ironic to me that the posters who accuse us of behaving unreasonably are women who enjoy stirring things up and behaving unreasonably themselves. If this is how they carry on in their everyday lives perhaps that is why they won`t believe that most decent people don`t go around upsetting others and deserving to be cut off from family members.

'It's changed its name. Wondering if alcohol plays a part.

Parklife I made a new will, estD&S not in it, all grandchildren are. Not sure about your new grandbaby, think I would add her/him. You can always revise it, at any time in the future, make sure it is 'air tight' giving reasons why your estD is not to inherit from you. I have put a clause in to say even if we are reunited in the future, my will stands as is. The damage my estD has done can never be undone, my heart can never be unbroken, too much damage over too may years! The special bond I had with my precious GD gone forever, even if we reunited tomorrow, that special bond is gone, she won't know who I am I would be a stranger to her & my GS

Grannyrainbow the nasty posters from mumsnet or BC [what ever that is] have cut out their m.i.l's, so that is why they are so hostile to us estGrandmothers on here.

Tina Thank you

Welcome back Celebgran

As for pictures of my estGC, they have been given to me by others, I have never looked or downloaded any myself.

I think we grandmothers/fathers have every right to see our beloved GC, they are bone of our bone, flesh of our flesh, they carry 1/4 of our genes, they carry memories of their ancestors in their brains. My precious GD was in my tummy too, as we are born with our eggs, so therefore when I was carrying my D I was also carrying my GD as her egg was in her mummy's tummy, when she was in mine! Yes we have every right and the law should recognise that, and it will very soon. Sadly too late for us on here now.

Daisydog same old doggie-do-dah from you again I see! Good choice of name though, suits you sir

Fairydoll I'd love to know what your posts said, no doubt quite calm compared to mumsnetters posts, but then GNHQ deletes our!

Doggie-do-dah Of course we talk to our other nice, loving & friendly children, they are all cut out too anyways!

I can't send cards through post as they have moved, so I don't have add to send to, still put them in their gifts sacks though, with a nice little letter from nannie.

Off to work....

Having children is one of the most selfish things we do in life. We have them for our own sake not theirs. They do not ask to be born and have all the misery, illness etc that life brings. Therefore when children decide to go their own way, make what we perceive as mistakes, they have every right to do so. We have no right to hold on to them or expect them to conform to our view. We did what we wanted in conceiving them they have the right to choose their own path.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Regarding wills - anyone who gets on well with their own child but has concerns about the spouse should investigate including a discretionary trust in their will. If the marriage breaks down this is a way of ensuring that the spouse cannot claim half of the inheritence.

Good info Eddiecat. Our solicitor failed to tell us that. Must see her again.

In our case - putting it simply - our children get a nominal amount when we die - the balance goes into the trust and withdrawals from the trust can only be made if all of the trustees agree (for us this is both of our children plus a friend with legal background). The amount in the trust cannot be included when assets are split up during a divorce.

Thank you to everyone who has responded to my query. Food for thought most certainly. we will have further discussions and thoughts about the best way to proceed.

I was warned about unpleasantness, but I didn't think it would manifest itself so speedily. My instinct might be to bite back, but I have no need to justify myself or respond to vitriol.

Celebgran, once again, no, I was never Wendysue or any other name on here.

Smieless, I get what you are saying about doing that one "gp thing." Also love the idea of keeping copies of the cards.

About wills - Can't help but agree that if someone totally cos their parents, goes nc, etc, it makes perfect sense for the parents to cut them our of their wills. In fact, the ac shouldn't expect to be in their parents wills or even want to be. If they do expect that, then, imo, they are being hypocritical.

Isn't this new page format awful! It shows big full length adverts each side of the page, so this page is a small, centred ,looks like stuck on thing. Please take note GNHQ, it's not good!

As for DDog saying she thinks our C that are with us and probably cut out too, will think us spiteful for cutting out our estranged children from our wills. She says this as she herself has cut out all her husbands family, but clearly still wants some money when her husbands mum & dad pass away!!!

Sorry starlady ?Just your kind and unbiased posts are very like her, and she not been on here for ages since someone said she runs a forum in America, not that that mattered.

ALSO your not estranged are you? She wasn't either,
Sorry again

Yes I totally agree why would we want leave our hard earnt money to someone who doesn't care if we are ill or need them?
We will leave to our little Grandaughters if they wish legacy if not it reverts to other family.

EEEK my dear little great niece has chicken pox, do hope baby doesn't get it,

Smilelss when I get v low I do think of stopping cards they clearly not wanted,

However as said numerous times despite xxxxxxxx being 9 this year i canstilo remember the pure joy and overwhelming pride and Incredible wonder at holdingner first time and the following nine months of delight. It is bittersweet now of course but I don't think could ever not mark that day,

Other two we weren't told of and never met and don't even know birthdays well we know 2nd one as a friend of daughters told us. However it doesn't seem appropriate

We do send to all three at Xmas, like smilelss says is only gp thing we can do and i had to fight for permission to do this via our mp. Police were extremely sympathetic and told us our daughter had totallynwasted their time and resources.

I cling to the photo on my phone of my little grandson. Of course, he'll have changed a lot since then, but I need to hold on to that as a memory.

My memory box has been started and I truly hope he will have it one day.

Well I'm glad you find me "kind and unbiased," celebgran. Thank you. The lack of bias may be because I'm not estranged though. If I had gotten co or if I had cut someone out myself, I might have a pov that was more one way or the other. I co have a few friends who are estranged from their ac, and I feel for them, but I guess that's not quite the same thing.

In fact, one of my friends has an ed who threatened to call police if she sent anymore cards. So now she's afraid to send any. So the police pov is interesting to me. I'll tell her.

Good plan, imo, about leaving legacy to gds. No reason they should lose out because of adult issues.

Well it didn't take me long to read all the posts since I was last on especially as most of yours were deleted by GNHQ Fairydoll; what a shame I didn't get the chance to read them first.

Celeb and Dorothy, I wonder if it's harder to make the decision to stop sending EC cards and/or presents when you've done so for so long. I'm glad you feel more at peace since stopping Dorothy; it must have been a difficult decision. We just never did. That first Christmas came just weeks after the CO and I think we were still in shock then when ES's first birthday following the estrangement came along, it had been a year and it didn't really occur to us to send him a bday card.

Our DS asked us in the early days if we thought we should send cards to our GC. On one occasion when I'd popped a card through their letter box our ES appeared on door step yelling at me 'we don't want this' so I told him the card wasn't for him. We've never had any other complaints, no need really they'll throw them in the bin anyway.

I wouldn't mind betting Starlady going by your posts that if you had experienced the CO situation from either side, your posts would still be "kind and unbiased". There's no need to be cruel to those who are already in such obvious distress. We've shown kindness and understanding to posters who've explained their decision to CO family members; it's a pity that it isn't always reciprocated.

Your friend isn't breaking any laws by sending cards. They can be disposed of unopened which I'm sure they are anyway.

Yogagirl interesting background info on a certain poster. If these abandoning AC aren't going to care one way or the other if they find they've been disinherited, why criticise EP's for making that decision unless of course as you mentioned the moaning's coming from an AC who wants nothing to do with their parents but wants their money when they've gone.

Smileless, we sent Birthday and Christmas gifts for the first year or so, cards only for a few years and somehow, can't explain it, but, it just felt the right time to stop. The first year was hard not to send, felt strange somehow, but after that, we've been absolutely fine not sending them. As I said previously we acknowledge our daughter's birthday with a gift to her favourite charity, acknowledge the childrens' birthdays and Christmases with depositing money to their bank accounts. Just didn't add up to continue the ritual of cards that the children were probably never getting anyway. That's us, each to their own and if it helps others to still send cards, that's ok.

Annsixty, in response to your post stating that it is a selfish act to have children and therefore expect nothing, well words fail. People and animals and all manner of life procreate, otherwise we would have been extinct before we began. Is it selfish to expect good manners and respect that should be part of everyday living? No one is suggesting that children owe us, but hopefully that they show some of the love that we gave them. Treat others how you would like to be treated isn't such a bad attitude to have.

I never sent cards to my estD, right from the start, but I always did for the GC, and the same card put in their gift sacks, same words/little letter too. This Xmas I thought I had giant cards, that I had bought a few years back, with smaller ones, they just caught my eye in the card shop, the one for my GS was a big pirate ship pop-out, he loved pirates at the time & the one for my GD was the same sort of pop-out card, very sweet! Anyway when I got them out of the cupboard, after Xmas week, they turned out to be Birthday cards It was too late to go and buy more, so I just put on the cards "silly ole nannie..." and explained.

You see I find it hard to go into the card shop at Xmas to buy the GC cards, all the other GM, with a glim in their eye cooing over what lovely cards to buy for their GC, chatting to me next to them, me with a tear in mine, trying to bit my lip and get out quick before I start crying. I have to really brace myself to go in and buy and must say, I'm wondering if I can do it again! With no add now they've moved, I can't even put a stamp on and post them, just write them out, walk into the spare room and put them in their gift sacks, soul destroying

As you may remember, I always put an advert in our local paper with a 'happy birthday' message for them, this is the only small connection I feel I have left. But this year I am not sure if I will, so many years now, they live in a different area, but still only 20mins away. I just hope that the trolls who laid into me last year for doing this, haven't influence me. My message in the local was along with other happy birthday messages to other GC from their GP, but difference being, they weren't 'cut out' so they are allowed without comment, but I, being 'cut out', are not

Well said Luckylegs Why do these people 'bashing' us here, never speak of love and just always bang on about we expect repayment of some kind, I find it baffling! I love my children & grandchildren and would have thought it normal humane emotion to love your mum & dad back! A mum [&dad] that have been nothing but kindness to their children and given their all, and that does not just mean monetary, all done for Love

I was doind no bashing at all. I was stating facts as I know them. And as for bringing animals into it,once the offspring are grown they are cast out into the world to live their own lives. I am of course not advocating this.

Yogagirl celebgran Smileless2012 hello this cold afternoon.

I feel much better after stopping sending cards and prezzies, I was even still sending estDS a birthday card with money in it up to his last birthday, without ever hearing back.

And about Wills, I changed mine to leave my assets to 3 charities, 3 friends as executors so other rellies don't get persuaded if esDS and estDiL suddenly get interested on my demise.

And I wouldn't change my Will back immediately if a reconciliation was effected. When DGC are old enough, I most probably will amend to include them.