Continued support and fun aspects too of rebuilding lives after estrangement can't believe 4 years and we still here to offer help, friendship and support.

Smileless. Sorry you didn't get to read my posts. I got my knuckles wrapped by GN for troll hunting (would you believe? ) I had posted the name of the 'alter ego' of a rather aggressive poster, ( woof woof )plus made a few comments about 'rabid dogs' etc. Verboten! I was rather jet lagged on Saturday, but I must admit it felt rather cathartic posting those comments!

AnnSixty. It's a given that we don't think children should be eternally grateful to their parents, however, if they turn their backs and cut their family off it can cause immense heartbreak. Has this happened to you? If it has, and you can be so pragmatic about it - well done. But if it hasn't, I'm not sure what your point is.

Facts as you know them annsixty? How would it be a totally,selfish act to have children? As lucklegs put so very well we would be extinct without procreation.
Most of us do accept our adult children go their own way, live their own lives.
I wouldn't think any other way is healthy.
We never lived our lives through our children,

Every so often annsixty you appear to do as yogagirl put so well a bit of bashing.

Luckylegs and yogagirl i totally agree we did all we could for 28 years for love from our estranged daughter a little love back would surely not have been to much to ask?
At least basic concern when we are seriously ill?
We would show that to strangers let alone our parents.

I can't bear the thought of a memory box as i feel so depressing to think we will be dead when they get it,

I do hope xxxxxxx reads her blog while we are still alive.

Smilelss yogagirl , l lucklynlegs, dorothy16 fairydoll, starlady etc i won't be posting as much but can't resist the odd one!

Dorothy 16 sometime ago I asked how many years you sent cards for? If you don't find that intrusive.

Fairydoll welcome home was the holiday amazing?

My son partner comes from s Africa,

The children owe you nothing brigade annoy me.

We all realise that, however I was happy to care for my dying mum god love her, she was wonderful mum to me, and my beloved f i law also needed a lot of care for several years but it simply didn't occur to me not to, it's called simply love, as yogagirl put.

By way yogagirl if you want run that birthday message again go ahead, don't let vicious trolls stop you.

It is becoming quite a national worry about trolls anyone seen in news last couple days?

Parklife1 I hadnbreak from posting and sadly unpleasant trolls do hijack thread now and again.

It pays to be careful what you post remembering it is public forum.

However belated welcome, sorry you in the sad estranged boat.

You will find a hardcore or regular support on here, and smilelss, yogagirl and I have been firm friends for over 4 years now hard to believe.

I still have 2 photos on display of my dear little xxxxxxx one of me cuddling her on rare visit to us and last or of her with dh and me on my daughter s last birthday we shared,
I had taken cake as always and xxxxxx cried when we blew candles out.
Bittersweet memories but it's all I have,

I believe it's early days for you so please don't give up hope that things will sort themselves out I do hope so.

We stopped sending cards after 6 years, been estranged over 10.

About wills, no amendments have been made and our estranged daughter will still be included in a share of our estate regardless of whether or not our relationship is reconciled, if she doesn't want it then so be it, her choice.

I used to choose the cards on line, it spared the heartache of being in the card shop.

Starlady, I have read on other forums and in news articles, that if you receive unwanted contact, ask the person to stop but they continue, then it is harrassment, can be reported to the police and they will act upon it.

Smileless, I agree, there's no need for anyone here to be cruel and I don't get why some people are. Questions can surely be asked, etc. without hurting feelings.

Yogagirl, could you possibly order cards online? Might be easier to handle that way.

Oh, I see Dorothy already mentioned ordering cards online. Sorry I didn't catch that before, Dorothy.

I've never thought about how things most of us take for granted, like going to the card shop, might be painful for egps. So sad.

Interesting information about "harrassment," Dorothy! Very different than what celebgran is telling us though. Maybe it depends on the town or the individual police or something? Maybe I better not tell my friend anything.

annsixty, I concur that having children is for us as parents because the children never asked to be born. Parents are totally selfish and that's reason enough to leave children to fly away to their own lives.

Dorothy16, you've made a very wise choice leaving ed a share of your estate. IMO, much better than leaving bitterness as a final memory.

I order cards in boxes of 25, prepared to post to my entire recipient list. Perhaps that would work for you.

Celeb, don't leave us! You have done so well, I know the heartache is inside, but finally knowing you have exhausted every avenue to get your girl back, like me and others on here, reluctantly coming to the conclusion that enough is enough. I no longer want a relationship with my daughter, I could never treat anyone the way I have been treated. I had to face the fact that I would never in a million years hurt my mom or dad or anyone else for that matter,the way I have been hurt, it would haunt me. I am glad I treated my family as they deserved. That is why this forum is so important, we have all had to face up to abandonment by our grown up children, which for a time makes you feel vulnerable and worthless, but in time realising we are not alone, we didn't deserve it. Those dreadful people who troll sites spewing their venom are just pathetic, ignore and never acknowledge them is my mantra.
If sending a birthday or Christmas card to a grandchild could ever be classed as harassment, the worlds gone mad, I think the police have better things to do than chase someone sending a card to a grandchild. I will continue to do it as long as I know where they live and as long as I live.

Starlady you couldn't have read my post our s imlaw got us harassment warning we refused to sign, complained to police, and involved our mp.

A very understanding detective inspector told our daughter We were entitled to send cards to our Grandaughter on Xmas, birthday etc and that did not constitute harassment,

Before that my daughter got me arrested for leaving birthday presents on the step!
I cannot imagine how my own flesh and blood could have done this I had
To have solicitor ,who said she didn't think my ed was well. I suppose it was hard to understand the level of hatred otherwise.

So now do you understand how I had to fight for that right?
Another lady in Suffolk my also had similar and now harassment warnings are not issued it is a police informaion notice, for these sort situations,

Sadly we have a society where knife crimes and more serious issues the police have to deal with and the last police sgt we dealt with after dajghter reported us for going into shop where she works ? To use their facilities on way to weekend away told us it wasn't acdeptabel for ed to waste their time. Again she couldn't stop us using a major store chain, we didn't cause any disruption, we asked to speak to her she refused And we walked away, i was in tears and a member of staff was very kind to me.

In our case our mp was amazing he wrote to police commissioner and asked what we had done wrong? They had to reply we no longer had a warning as that implied wrongdoing and we had not done anything wrong,
We didn't get an apology but the police tried repeatedly to get our daughter to agree to mediation she said our s i law said No, they were on our side.

To receive harassment notice you have to actually harass someone i.e. Dozens texts, letter, visits do you get the picture?

The solicitor said we don't live in a police state and grandparents who wish to remember birthdays Xmas and even deliver presents are not breaking the law.

Every case is different. Starlady but hope this clears it up? The fact that my daughter got me arrested albeit I was of course released without charge will haunt me to my coffin, we could never go back from that but I would love to speak to her to ask her why? Why did I do wrong that could deserve such hatred?

Thanks Dorothy 16 10 years is long time my heart goes out to you.?

Sorry for long post this is abridged version!

Lucklegs??

It's lots like yours that help so much.

I am in tears now remembering the harassment stuff.

Smilelss also thanks for messages on my brief break??

Peace and happiness to us all.

Susharp We Grandparents enjoy our children flying the nest and are happy to see them married with children of their own, our grandchildren with their own home. We wouldn't want them staying at home into their 30s and beyond. Such a ridiculous thing to say about parents are selfish having children, where do these people come from?? Not from the same world as me that's for sure. The word Love is missing again, so these posters can't Love their C&GC or have none, so are talking out of their *
Not leaving anything in our wills to the children we loved & adored, and raised with Love, affection and kindness, is not showing spite, it's showing acknowledgement of their wish to have nothing to do with us, to throwing our Love in the bin, they can't have it both ways, that would be hypocritical in the extreme!

All these posters that post these absurd things on this support page for GP cut out of their beloved AC&GC lives, I'll bet my bottom dollar they have cut a mother or m.i.l out, that would make sense of their nonsense!

SueSchrip inheritance isn't a right it's a gift. Now you may wish to give a gift to someone who won't have anything to do with you, you may expect to receive a gift from someone you'll have nothing to do with. Either are your choices and we all have the right to make choices without being accused of bitterness.

"Parents are totally selfish" really!!! If you're going to join in, why not do so honestly. It comes across to me that you think your parents are totally selfish, if so why not say so? I regard our ES as, among other things, totally selfish but I don't say 'adult children are totally selfish'.

Yogagirl I agree, don't let people put you off putting the birthday announcements for your GC in the local paper. You've always done so, if it makes their birthdays easier for you to cope with, then do it.

According to one poster, our EAC wouldn't want anything when we're gone anyway Yogagirl, so why we are than accused of leaving bitterness is beyond me. It's not our bitterness that's the issue is it, it's theirs. TBH some of the rubbish that gets posted just makes me laugh; "children never asked to be born"did any of us?

Hi Fairydoll, hope you had a great holiday. It was nice to finally be able to read one of your posts.

So pleased to see your break was brief Celebyou had me worried there for a while.

Decided not to go to the gym today as my back isn't feeling 100% and it's best not to push it because if it goes, it can drag on for days so I'll probably be back on again later.

I am lucky enough to not be estranged from any of my children although I am acutely conscious of working very hard and treading on egg shells with my DIL. So far, so good! My heart goes out to people in this position and I think it is so dreadfully wrong for people to post unconstructive, damning and judgemental comments without any basis other than an apparent need to be nasty. When (on another thread) I asked someone what their motivation was I got no reply!! Constructive comments about possible things to consider, ways forward, a listening ear for those struggling is fine and helpful but that is not what some posters seem to aim for. Even if there is a reason for estrangement just slamming someone hardly helps them with the pain they are feeling for the consequences of that reason. At the very least people deserve sympathy for their continuous wondering what happened! I cant decide if it is better to ignore the nastiness or challenge it! ....?

Granmary18 that's difficult one! If thenpter who is insulting is just doing it to wind everyone up I think ignoring works well.
there are so. Any posters who really try to help and understand even if they not Estranged they do make up for the trolls.

Please to see that the troll on twitter received a police caution. It is so spineless to post vitriol hiding behind anonymity

Sorry your back playing up smilelss please don't join my club ?

I have to try and keep moving after painkillers or I would t do a thing
Off acquacsie as local pool reopened but don't feel like it.

My weight has ballooned omg think all stress and worry of appt with spinal co sultant and Long wait for treatment, not to mention letter saying stuff he hadn't. Mentioned

Better go always late!

No, I read your post, celebgran, I just misunderstood. I knew about the harassment warning, etc, I just thought the police, in general, were more sympathetic to you and dh. I didn't realize it was only that one detective inspector who spoke up for you. Was he citing the law though or just his own opinion? Since you had to "fight for the right" to send card to your gc, it seems it's more complicated than he let on.

But - arrested for leaving presents - wow! I heard of this once when a man kept leaving gifts for a woman who made it clear she wasn't interested. But parents/gps leaving birthday gifts? You must have been thoroughly shocked!

Again, yes, I do see the fight you had. How awful for you!

Are you allowed to leave or send gifts now, too, or just the cards?

celebgran - re your back, has your GP or consultant given you a list of 'red flags' to look out for? Numbness, difficulty urinating etc?

Oh, sorry, celebgran, wrote that before I read your whole post. I see there were other officers on your side. How fortunate that your mp was of such help!

Still, though they said ed and sil were "wasting their time," they did respond, at first, it seems, to some of these accusations. Sorry you had to go through that. Not sure my friend could take it. So since she's afraid to make any kind of contact, I'll just leave it alone. She does keep birthday cards to her gc in a bag in her home now to show them in later years if they're interested.

One more thing - I can see where an arrest like that would surely "haunt" someone. You must be a very strong person to have been able to face that. My friend not so much. I think she would break down completely.

Anyhow, thanks for elaborating.

Granmary, I think the problem with "challenging" the "nastiness" is that you're likely to get more nastiness in return. Then there is the danger of getting into a back & forth thing and getting so angry that you break one of the GN rules. One or two calm, sensible replies might be good if you don't get drawn into an argument.

Nasty or not, some of the more critical comments might help a newly co gp get ideas about what they should or shouldn't do. But for those who have been estranged several years, there is probably no point in such advice. Encouraging them to move on is the best anyone can do there Iv come to believe.

Stinks that you have to walk on those eggshells with dil! TG, it's working out though. Finger crossed that it continues to be okay.

Fairydoll, hope you had a good vacation!

Sorry for serial posting, ladies!

Oops! That should be "Fingers (plural)crossed," lol!

I always challenge the nastiness Granmary partly because more often than not, it isn't just nasty and ill informed I actually find some it rather amusing. I think it's funny that some people appear to have no idea how ridiculous their comments are.

Don't worry CelebI haven't actually hurt my back, just have that awareness that if I'm not careful for a day or two I will do. I know it sounds silly but sometimes it just doesn't feel right, sort of vulnerable.

I like that Starlady; serial posting.

It must be horrible weather all over the UK - lots of us posting on here when we should be doing something`useful`!