Mothers

Fennel...so did I (terrible relationship with their Dad).
Emelle....Thanks for making me feel better....I did all that, told them I loved them, cuddled them, never favoured one over the other, although my middle son does have a slight 'middle child syndrome'....?

An interesting time with your friend, OP.
I have been surprised, through later adult years, just how many of those who have become good friends have turned out to also have had difficult upbringings.
Do 'birds of a feather flock together'? Do we emit invisible vibes?

In those days, emotional abuse wasn't even on the radar. Schools did not react to what would now be considered blatant signs.
My mother was not stable. She married a man who was abusive.
I married at 18, to a highly controlling man. ....because he seemed to actually like me.
I finally ended contact with my mother in my late thirties. It was the best thing I ever did, and probably saved my sanity.

Of childhood friends, three would have their own pains to tell. All escaped early, and all of us have battled self esteem issues through our entire lives.

What interests me is why some people are able to break the pattern, and transform their own parenting, whilst others seem destined to repeat the cycle.
What makes some people determined not to inflict damage, and others incapable of change?

What an interesting post. Mothers are not perfect,most of us do the best we can and our children come first but sometimes we get things wrong, I think that's just normal, for those that are physically or mentally abused, that is a different matter. I know people whose bad childhoods made them determined to have a very happy life and then family, whilst I suppose others never let the past lie and it affects them as long as they live. You can have two people abandoned and bought up in orphanages, who have a completely different attitude to life and how they live it.

This thread is really sad. I really had no idea before joining gransnet that so many people had unhapy childhoods and/or unhapoy marriages. I must live in a small world as I and most of my friends as far as I know have had very happy childhoods and marriages. Im sorry if I slund smug - I don't mean to. I'm conscious that I am very lucky. This thread has been an eye opener and has made me feel really sad.

Don't feel bad polly, in many cases (my own), it's our miserable childhoods that have made us the strong, resilient people that we are today. We have learnt from our parents mistakes and vowed never to repeat them with our own DC.
Like chaosinc, I also turned by back on my mother many years ago and that was the true beginning of my life. Do I regret that? No. The only thing I regret is that I waited so long to do it.

Like pollyperkins I am saddened to see so much unhappiness. I know, through my work, that many women are poor mothers and struggle to parent well so not sure why I feel surprised at the sad tales on this thread.

I had a blessed childhood and feel very fortunate to have had two parents able to give unconditional love.
flowers] for all who have had unhappy mother: daughter relationships.

My mother is a narcissist and my father was violent.
My late brother was the “ golden child” and I was the scapegoat.
My mother always told me “I rue the day you were born” she would deliberately incite my father so he would hit me and made sure my brother never got close to me.
My mother is now in a home with dementia, she refused to give anyone power of attorney over her affairs so as usual I am mopping up her mess.
I have always done the right thing by her but sadly she has told so many lies about me to family and friends I am considered some kind of money grabbing monster.
On a plus not I have a happy marriage, 3 happy successful and well adjusted AC and my late in laws were fabulous.
The joy I have had as an adult and our wonderful family made my mother despise me more, now as a sad confused woman I pity her.
I am sure that when she does pass away I will feel mighty relief, not something I’m proud of but after 55 years of her manipulative, divisive and cruel behaviour I need a break.
So comforting knowing other people understand the lack of love as a child and the effect it has.
Thank God for close family and friends.

I was the eldest of seven, and my mother leant on me heavily, I resented her for it. I married young, releaved to get away from the responsibility. It wasn’t until she died I realised what a tough life she had and how hard she worked to give us the best. The only thing I regret is not giving her the best as she deserved it.

I had a pretty good, if unconventional childhood - my parents had been child refugees in WW2 and this influenced their whole lives. My younger brother agrees that my mother was a pretty good parent but if you ask my sister, she'll tell you a very different story of the atmosphere of our family life and says she was psychologically damaged by our mum because of her WW2 childhood traumas. I didn't see that at the time and think my sister and mum just had a difficult chemistry between them. Families are so subjective.

Very interesting post this one. I agree with Emelle. The damage is done when your mum never tells you she loves you, never gives you a cuddle, doesn't enjoy your success, blatantly favouring one over the other right up to the end. I loved my mum but there was a real barrier there. I tried and tried to get close to her but the favoured younger sisters were always in the way. They never included me in any outings arrangements for her birthdays, cakes etc. Sad. She passed away four years ago, I miss her still.

My Mum has always been a bossy, control freak and still is to this day, age 88. She nagged my Dad everyday of his life, none of us 5 children were ever allowed an opinion as she was always right and even told her own Mum what she should do. Mum knows everything, it dosnt matter what the subject, she knows it all and is never wrong. It used to drain me, affected my confidence, mentally dragged me down till I had a career where I had to be very assertive, that’s when it all changed and she struggled to cope with it. We lost Dad and 2 brothers, my sister lives abroad and my other brother is very ill, so Mum just has me now. I went to NZ with her for 3 weeks, plus 2 weeks in the Caribbean and was determined to bond.... I failed and now just accept that she is adamant, dogmatic and just will never accept anyone else’s opinion because she is always right. Even when you prove her wrong, which I childishly feel the need to now and again ! There is never any acceptance of that, no apology, nothing, just a sulky face. I will never take her away again, I just can’t do it. I still take her out for a country drive and pub lunch once a week, if it’s just us 2, I practically sit in silence and listen to the “ lecture/sermon”. If her friend comes with us, it’s great as she gets bossed around too and we deal with it together. I can actually see Mums frustration, trying to cope with the fact that she has no one she can control anymore, it’s sad. I have wonderful relationships with all my 3 AC and partners, plus all 5 GC. It’s built on love, respect and open discussion where everyone’s thoughts and feelings are valued. Of course as a Mum I made my own mistakes, however, I must have got most of it right to have the relationships that I do now with my 3 .... and Mum even tries to undermine that by criticism of me to them !! They always tell me of course, as they have seen 1st hand over the years what she is like. Very sad that I’m the only one out of my many friends who still has their Mum, but I see her out of duty, not out of love.

Seems like my childhood was not as unusual as I have always believed.
Both my parents were very much a product of their time, and had not had a "normal" upbringing themselves, so they had no idea of good parenting.
Being the middle child of very academic siblings, caused me added complications.
I shall get hold of "Daughters Detox", and perhaps it will help smooth out some of my early programming.
Best foot forward I guess.....

My main complaint with my mother was that she pushed me into taking the 11+ way before I was ready. My birthday is in Sept (I was 70 Yesterday!) and Sept birthdays are always the oldest in the class but somehow I took the test early and was always the youngest in the class. If I’d taken the test at the proper time I wouldn’t have felt out of my depth at the grammar school. That last year at primary school would have made such a difference to my confidence. I did ok but always felt an also ran. The same thing happened with my brother. He didn’t pass his 11+ but at age 13 she pushed for him to go to the Technical School. He was really upset but dad said ‘don’t upset your mother’. Status seemed to matter to mum rather than what was more appropriate for us.

This post has been a revelation to me. I really thought I was the only daughter who felt like this.

It is only now as I am older, a mother, Grandma and (eek) Great Grandma I fully realise how dominating and controlling my mother was. This behaviour certainly affected me. I can see it now.

I was very often told that I wasn’t wanted. Not directly maybe but ..”I didn’t want all these children -4- and certainly not a daughter” . I was number two to an idolised son. “Why would I want a daughter when I already had my son?”. “If abortion had been available in my day ......” and this from a church worshipping Roman Catholic too who later went on anti abortion rallies with her church.

She derided me the day I failed the 11 plus as I had “let her down”. So guilty did she make me feel I used to refuse daily 2x2d bus fares and would walk the two miles to school as I did not want to be a burden to her.

I was simply never left in any doubt I was a huge disappointment to her. Ironically of the four of us I was the most successful in life. The idolised first born son ended up a derelict wreck entirely unable to have a relationship with any woman other than his mother.

To this day I am left with the overriding thought that I am not good enough.

When I went on to have my own sons I became obsessed that I would raise them to be responsible men who know how to respect women. I was not going to pass a feckless man onto an unsuspecting woman. Happily all three are happily married to lovely girls.

The legacy of never being good enough has left me with a lifelong desire to do better. Cleaner house (all the time) an excellent home maker, best mother in law and Grandma etc etc etc to the point of exhaustion at times.

We as mothers have our children’s future happiness in our hands and to read these stories of how we were damaged is sad reading indeed.

Soon after my mother died I made an appointment to see a medium.

Before I had spoken a word she told me “Your mother realises now how badly you have been treated. She understands now you should never have been treated this way” - so reflecting another poster’s thoughts on karma I truly hope my mother is having to face her abominable treatment of me now.

Persistentdonor - I was the youngest of three and and continually told I was the 'thick' one of the family. It really didn't go down when I proved my mother wrong . I think the book will help you understand and really hope it helps you move forward as it has for me. I will always be grateful to the friend who recommended it to me.

It was my father with me...he was a sociopath. He always told me I was stupid, was an alcoholic and was violent to me and my mum. My poor, poor mum. To everyone else he was a funny, wonderful man. I escaped when I was 20, which wasn’t soon enough, to marry someone who wasn’t right for me. Had a son by him, but left the husband when he was 2. I always reflect on my bitter home life and I know it’s affected me deeply and it always will.

Oh my - don't daddies get off lightly. Strange how when pleasant/admirable aspects of parenthood are considered, Daddy is just as good as Mummy. When things go wrong - ooohhh, it's all Mum's fault. Many of us on here where born when the woman effectively had no choice but to have children. How many of us would be here now, do you think, if our female ancestors had been given any choice in whether to a mother or not?

Who I had not seen.

I have several friends who have or have had difficult narcissistic mothers. I feel so sad for them. My mum is 95 and wonderful. But my dad was remote. I loved him but not the way I love Mum.

Kitty and all of you who have suffered from neglect and feeling unloved by, as Emelle says, the very one who should have cared and adored you a big hug and But this has made you stronger - the very fact you post messages here and can share your stories proves it. My best friend was not only emotionally (daily told she was stupid, ugly not as good as her brothers) but physically abused by hers. I never suspected all the time we were growing up, putting down to hormones her often black moods and refusal to do gym and uncover, just a fad. Now I know it was from bruises as she was beaten regularly. She escaped like many of you at the age of 16 to stay with her first boyfriend who she married and went on to adopt a large number of abused and challenging kids, and have three children of her own. I was astonished when she reconciled with her mother (and father who meekly went along with her mother's wishes, beating my friend to order with a belt on any small misdemeanour). She brought them back into her life and let them access her own kids and 'Grandma' was deeply loved. Life is strange, with parents that loved me unreservedly I could not understand how Mrs X could do that to her own vulnerable child but my friend looked after her mother to the end. She survived although said she felt nothing but duty to her parents. I hope all of you do. I feel that evil comes with a missing gene and empathy and maybe these cruel parents were sociopaths with little feeling for other than themselves or remorse as no understanding the hurt they cause? Her brother on the other hand became an alcoholic and self harmed as he really was beautiful but felt totally ugly on the inside. he's survived thanks to the love of an understanding and good woman. So love is the answer isn't it? Evieners good Karma to you.

Please be aware that the message above mine was not there when I posted!

It wasnt until my mother died I felt able to acknowledge she had never loved me. I spent my whole life trying to be a good daughter in the hope of a positive response, but I never got one. She was 91 when she passed away and I was 62 so it was a long haul. She was the master of quiet little comments that totally undermined me, telling me she had never wanted a baby, how she had to give up the job she loved when I appeared, that I was the baby from hell, the little girl who was always naughty, the daughter who wasnt doing enough etc etc. I have searched my memory in vain for one incident where she gave me a hug or a cuddle. I wasnt allowed to make any demands, particularly not emotional ones. When my brother appeared five years later he was the golden child. I suppose now I am horrified when I look back at the misery of my childhood and the many years it took me to be half way normal, including extensive counselling. I do think my mother was one of the most miserable and unhappy people I have ever met, in a loveless marriage and trapped by her own personality. My daughter thinks she may have been autistic and incapable of real emotional connection. By believing that I have been able to reconcile myself and not feel bitterness towards her. Its been a long hard battle but in the three years since she died I do feel I have emerged as the person I was supposed to be.

My maternal grandmother died when my mother was two days old. I wonder if this caused her to be a very loving mother to her five children, four girls, one boy. My paternal grandmother died when my father was 21, he was a very loving father. The family unit was so import to my parents and they were devoted to each other.

It saddens me to read these posts, the love of a mother is so special.

This could have been written by me - mother totally inadequate and self-absorbed, with nothing to give to anyone else. My fathers answer was to throw himself into his career which meant travelling and spending as much time away from home as possible. Whenever I tried to leave home she would threaten a breakdown. I realise now that becoming pregnant and being married off at nineteen wasn't entirely accidental. My father always did what he could for me and she resented this all her life - she had a very high opinion of herself and saw me as being unworthy. When she died I felt nothing but relief, which upset me, but I see now that it was all she deserved. Dad survived her by two years, which was a joy

I married to get away from my mother. I never felt any affection from her the whole time I was growing up. I was not allowed to be myself. I had to follow same path my sister did. My younger brother hated her. All in the past of course as she died many years ago. Saying that...I suppose it has had a lasting affect on me. I loved my dad...