Support for all who are living with estrangement

I would disregard Agnurses comments, not once did you for example say you would make contact behind the parents back. You need support and not judgement, the pain of being what is termed gas lighting, has to be experienced. Most of us are loving mothers and grandmother who, for the most trivial of reasons are cut out. I really think it's a control thing and an easy fix to not just discuss a problem. There will always be bad parents, that's a different matter, but just because d or s are irritated or a bit put out, it is cruel to sever contact. If you can sort it and I know you have tried and all avenues are blocked, you have no alternative but to make the best life you can for you and those around you test are there for you.

The stories on here are so sad, crazyh I'm pleased for you, there is light for you, it's a move in the right direction. Given you hope I imagine.
I'm fed up of crumbs, when others around me have loving caring thoughtful sons, daughters, DIL's.. I try to be positive but nothing in my situation gives me hope. If I text/Wats app they ignore, I'm not allowed landline number. I wouldn't dare phone mobile... It is control , and cruel / wicked. I feel for everyone in this situation ...

Hi Aquamarine ..... I know what you mean about being sick of crumbs. Me too. I know my son does the best he can to see me and bring the grandchildren to see me. He is divorced and living with new woman and her two children. He only has his own children every second weekend and on a Tuesday after school. I am divorced from his father. Therefore somehow he has to make time to see us both with the children during the brief time he has with his children. And at the same time not to upset the Fuhrer with whom he lives! We are never invited there and she never comes with him to see me. We get invited for an hour at Christmas ..... that’s it! Of course her parents have a key to the house and are in and out all the time. But what can I do? Either accept the crumbs or say don’t bother! Of course I take the crumbs. But nowadays I don’t worry about it, but rather fill my life with things I want to do. Let them get on with it. Things have a habit of turning around. It takes a while to make the mental adjustment but it’s so liberating once you manage to flick the switch. X

Pythagorus
That's great advice , it just hurts that I did have regular contact and have been slowly but purposely shunned. You're right my DIL' s parents are in and out all the time, not treated wickedly or nastily, given unlimited access and love.. we're treated appallingly , they ignore our calls, we've never been to GC's birthday tea parties or invited at Christmas. What granny wouldn't want to see their GC or what GC wouldn't want to see their granny.. slowly been pushed out, I know my GC loves us but over time will forget us , we're never talked about or referred to , it's just this terrible control and manipulation , my GC said the other week we weren't her family, who would of said that... ??? Influenced all around. But your advice about filling time with things you want to do is good, I do but still miss GC and what was ....

I’m curious, everyone here is upset because of estrangement and most are claiming they’ve never been told why, or what they have been told is lies. How do you know it’s lies? Because it doesn’t mesh with your remembrances of events?

Agnurse Pops in and leaves messages that aren’t necessarily as flowery as you might want, but she saying what a lot of you need to hear. So I don’t think there is a way that she could possibly say anything how you would want to hear because it’s not what you want to hear. Maybe, instead of dismissing her because it’s not how you might say it or what you want to hear, you might actually listen to her. She actually has a lot of sensible things to say.

However, I’m sure I will be ignored as well, because I’m not saying what the majority of you want to hear.

Message deleted by Gransnet for breaking our forum guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Summerlove .... I am unsure exactly what you are trying to say. Are you saying that the estranged grandparents have actually done some bad thing and are not accepting that their actions have caused the estrangement? Do you really think that all the thousands of grandparents who are in this position have done bad things? In fact it is a very common phenomenon .... especially where the DILs don’t want their husbands parents in their lives. I have personally known many such situations. I dare say some grandparents may have interfered to some extent .,... probably trying to help. But nothing can be that bad that grandparents are cut off and rejected in the way I have read on this forum.

Pythagorus
You're right. Am sure some parents may irritate or annoy their AC but in most cases this just isn't the case...
Grandparents are just treated appallingly , cruelly and with little or no compassion. Imagine loving a little one and being intentionally cut out if their life, we enrich our GC's lives, as they enrich ours.. AC just like being spiteful and mean spirited, look at the bigger picture, we all need to be loved and appreciated, no Grandparent would intentionally go through such heartache, and pain, really....

I am not saying that every grandparent deserves it. I am saying that every now and then people come in here trying to get people to see it from another perspective.

The lack of introspection is shocking.

Summerlove - I can assure you that when you are first cut off from a family member there is nothing but introspection. You spend every second trying to work out what you did wrong and how you can put things right. This can go on for years. But in the end you realise that actually it wasn`t your fault - and you really don`t "need to hear" what someone like Agnurse has to say.
As for you asking how we know if someone is lying, that is easy. If someone claims you have said or done something that you haven`t - they are lying

Pythagorus Love that saying, I have heard it before, but really listened to it this time, I will use it for my class 'life lesson'

Bopeep a letter from a solicitor doesn't mean anything, only the police can warn you off of seeing your GC & AC.

I can see these issues from both sides. There may have been times when I needed to look at my actions and see how I may have added to the estrangement situation. It takes a while to get a new mindset. I have learned a lot ...... especially by looking at others in similar situations. But both parties, parents and children, have to be introspective .... and try walking a mile in the other mans shoes. Perhaps we need our children more than they need us. They will be in the same situation one day and then they will understand. I muddle on as best as I can. I have pulled back and let them come forward. If they don’t, fine, I just do other things. I can only change what I do ....... hope you all have a wonderful day. We have to make the most of the time we have left in this amazing world x

I know that the claims our ES has made about us are lies Summerlove, not because they don't mesh with our memory of events, but because as events, they never existed; they are lies.

When you're estranged AC is lying to others about his/her reasons for cutting you out and simultaneously never tells you his/her reasons, true of false then no, you don't know why they're treating you this way.

If there is any lack of introspection on this thread, it generally comes from posters who have no experience of this type of estrangement.

agnurse has a point, AC who've cut GP's out of theirs and their children's lives may well find the delivery of a card on their child's birthday and at Christmas, harassment.

That said, it's no big deal is it, keeping an eye on the post at certain times of the year to whisk away a card and put in straight in the bin with your child never knowing of it's existence, let alone the existence of the GP's who sent it.

On the other hand, not knowing what your GC look like and what they sound like when they talk and laugh, really is a big deal. A very BIG deal.

Ohhh... So much pain here today! Once again, my heart aches for all who are going through this!

Crazyh, what a lovely, refreshing story! Glad to hear it!

Bopeep, what a shock that message must have been! I'm so very sorry! How painful!,

I'm glad you checked with ds. Even if he doesn't reply, at least now you know he knows what's going on. What if you stopped contacting them and he thought you were the one who cut them out? I think you almost "had to" check with him.

If he's part of the decision to co you,, I know that will cut you even more deeply. Again, I'm so very sorry. Hugs!

But that business about "talking to the children" about this does make it suspicious. Kids that young wouldn't even have a concept of what an "all or nothing family" means. I never even heard the term, myself, till you mentioned it.

If ds indicates that he really doesn't want you to contact them, I'm glad you've decided you won't. Like agnurse, I'd be worried about hearing from a solicitor if I continued contact even with the kids. It shows they're willing to take legal steps and who knows what would be next?

These stories are so sad. Reading them and observing in RL it would seem there is a generation of rather horrible daughters, DILs, sons and SiLs out there whose attitude towards their parents or in-laws is deplorable.

Sorry to slag off these types but ‘brats’ seems to fit. This is the ‘me, me!’ generation who think they know everything and resent older people.

Obviously this is a sweeping generalisation but there are more of these selfish brats these days than ever before.

Cut you out of their lives? I wish you all the courage to say ‘so be it’ and get on with living the rest of your lives without their toxic fallout.

In the name of god, is it really so difficult to leave ONE thread alone for estranged grandparents to talk to each other in??

Can they not "have their perspectives challenged" elsewhere, and just have this one clearly marked thread to support each other?

Are you talking to me muffin? Because I was expressing sympathy,

No, Anja.

Phew!

Night ?

What is ODFD ?

One thing I meant to ask before... How does anyone "know" that the other gps have daily access or have a key and come and go as they please, etc? I have a key to dd's place in case of emergencies and to check on things for her and her family and water their plants when they're away. But I don't think the other gps know that. Why would they? And so far, I've only used it as I said, to water their plants when they're away. Just because I have a key doesn't mean I come over there "all the time." Maybe some of you know for sure what the other gps are doing. But if not, please don't torture yourselves with speculation.

Anjawe did say "so be it", moved away from our ES and only GC have been rebuilding our lives for more than 2 years. It's not easy of course but as time goes on the intensity of the pain subsides and I think of our ES very rarely now.

You'd think so wouldn't you muffin that this thread, all its predecessors and all of the ones that I'm sure will follow, could just be left to do what they were set up for; to offer support.

Over the years I've been posting on these threads, we've read some tragic and heart breaking posts from AC who've had no choice but to estrange themselves from cruel and abusive parents. In order to protect their children, they've also excluded their parents from their children's lives.

We know that there are indeed cases where this decision has not been easy, but has been the only one that could be made and they have been supported here.

It's reasonable IMO for others to come one and offer their opinions but it is the way from some posters, that these opinions are expressed.

For example, pointing out to EGP's that sending gifts and/or cards to their GC for birthdays and Christmas may be regarded as harassment is one thing, but to tell us that it is is wrong. We've been sending cards for more than 6 years and have never heard from a solicitor or the police in relation to this.

As I said in my previous post, all the parents have to do is throw them in the bin; no big deal.

I agree with you Starlady. Even if you do now for certain that the other GP's have very frequent contact with your GC, don't go there. What's the point? It is what it is, there's nothing you can do about it and to torture yourself with imagining what they're doing anchors you to the cruelty and the pain that cruelty has given.

It's not easy letting go, but dear friends it really is the only way.

Whilst this is an open forum, the title of this thread gives the reader the opportunity to understand that support is what is important here.

If that isn't something they can do cant some people just shut up??

Reading Agnurse and her friends makes me feel so wretched.
I've almost given up posting here because of this 'mission' (if I can call it that) she has of....putting us straight!

I feel bullied by her answers even if they aren't meant for me!!

As I write I'm beginning to see why she has that affect. Her need to 'convert' us to understanding her perspective is as dogmatic and resilient to compromise as are the people in our lives we're having trouble with. They too seem to be impervious to seeing anyone else's pov other than their own.

If Agnurse and friends feel we are a group of ostriches, stuck in our self imposed delusions crying woe is me whilst pointing the finger at others, then leave us to our self delusions.

Agnurse is no expert, and she certainly has no compassion for the people towards whom she directs her hackneyed advice.
She never reads the post through properly before thrusting forward the same old uninformed clichés.

If agnurse wanted to be helpful she could start her own thread. Then people could choose to access her 'advice'.
That would be a compassionate and useful thing to do.
Not come on here with her size 9's stomping over other peoples lives.

This thread is TRYING to make a place for people who have a particular type of problem to come together and SUPPORT each other.

Please please have some respect for that which you may not fully understand.

Namsnanny