Friendship estrangement - am I right?

Don't feel guilty. Remember the safety drill on airplanes: Put on your own oxygen mask before assisting anyone else.

You can't look after someone else if you don't look after yourself.

Firstly so sorry to hear of your loss.
Secondly you mustn't let yourself become emotional involved with her problem (I promise I know that's easier said than done!), you simply don't have the emotional energy. Next time she calls, can you pretend to be out? If your car gives you away, put it somewhere else. Start taking daily walks? Is it often at the same time of day? Can you go shopping at that time?
But despite her rudeness (understandable, but still rude), keep saying she needs professional support, maybe as she's leaving so you don't see the eye-rolling.
Good luck, you're doing well

Would agree with the others - step back. The next time she comes to you ask her what it is that she expects you to do when she comes to you, especially when she rejects all your suggestions about where she could get help? What does she need from you? Remind her that you are only recently bereaved, and therefore not in a good place yourself. And if she gets angry, ask her quietly how helpful does she think that SHE was when you were bereaved as she seemed to disappear when you needed her most? Look after yourself first (as the saying goes, you can't pour from an empty cup).

I think you need to stop considering this woman to be a close friend - because she isn't.

She gave you no support during your bereavement. 'Giving you space' indeed! I'm sure she felt all righteous using that phrase to you. That's just plain selfish on her part.

And now, she comes round, dumping her woes on you but not prepared to take any action herself, leaving you worried for her while she sails righteously back home feeling smug and superior because she's so much more caring than you.

She's a git. A hypocritical holier-than-thou selfish git.

Next time she arrives on your doorstep in tears - don't put up with it. Keep her on the doorstep and say something along the lines of -

'I don't think you coming round to me and dumping your woes on me is helping this situation at all. So in YOUR interests, I'm going to do for you what you did for me, and give you space. Use this space to work out what your husband actually needs, and make it happen.'

And just don't let her in. Shut the door in her face if you need to. But remeber above all else - this woman is NOT your close friend. She's a taker and a user.

PS Steel yourself and don't answer the front door ! I know this sounds harsh but by doing every time she comes around you are, in a sense, enabling her to upset you, and allowing her to let off steam just enough to make the current situation tolerable. If you stop answering it, she will be forced to go elsewhere and that is what she needs to learn to do.

She just clearly needs to be heard rather than receive advice....rightly or wrongly. You can only do this so much and you have your own wellbeing to consider. This is one reason why people seek a therapist or counsellor, who are paid to listen, so to speak. Sometimes we just need to go over things again and again, it’s part of a healing process. I would set your judgements aside, listen when you can and clearly let her know, when you can’t. No blame attached either way...life can be hard sometimes can’t it.

To be honest I feel sorry for both of you. That said this has become an incredibly negative pattern that although giving her chance to vent is incredibly unfair on you. What made me err on the side of caution was you describing her as a close friend. What was the friendship like before? What do you value about the friendship? If shes always behaved like this shes probably not going to chande. I've have a friend who also on occasions uses me to think through problems but on the rare occasion she listens to advice she rarely acts on it. I also cared for my father who had dementia and it can be scary and sad,you often dont want to worry family members and the involvement of professionals may make you fear things will happen you have little control over or fear criticism on how your coping. Both of you are grieving. You do however need to protect your own wellbeing. When shes says you dont understand you could invite her to tell you etc. Or you could just let her know you are struggling and find it difficult to advise her. Only you know how worth it is to keep the door open and on what terms.

I think my response to her "you don't understand" would be along the lines of " You're right, I dont understand why you refuse tobget professional help"

My oh poor you. Alzheimers is so hard and all dementia sufferers are different. You are a good friend to try and be so supportive. My best friend had violent episodes with early onset Alz and ended up being dragged away by police and sectioned! She is now in a locked home In Newport Wales and no longer speaks or communicates with people. She has attacked me and other relatives in the past and her close family can no longer talk about her. So though it is extremely hard please continue to be sympathetic.

quizqueen has taken the words out of my mouth. I totally think you should get her a selection of leaflets or contact details from the agencies that can help and/or support and give them to her saying that as you lost your husband to life itself and she is losing hers to something else then yes, you don't understand but these people do and are far more qualified to help her. End by saying you are now going to give her some space just as she did when you lost your guy and leave it at that. Personally I think she is one of life's takers, and the friendship is a tad one sided, I mean how can a true close friend even think of 'giving space' to a recently bereaved friend unless she asked to be left alone? Some people do enjoy playing the martyr and she sound like one of these, just likes to moan on about how awful her life is but not prepared to do anything about it. I had a friend like this and after years of being the listening ear listening to the same moans year in year out and absolutely zilch advice taken or acted upon I had to say hang on I can't do this anymore, if after all this time you can't even start help yourself then sorry but I'm done here. I have problems too you know. She went quiet for a bit and then said yes you are right. It seemed to snap her out of the cycle. By continuing to always be the dumping ground for all her angst and outpourings I'd enabled her to keep doing so. You need to break the cycle with your neighbour. Don't answer the door if she pops round for a moan unless she can see you are in. Don't answer the phone or if that makes you feel guilty then call her back later. If you've called her then you are more in control of how long the call is because it's easier to bring a call to an end if you've phoned them than if they've phoned you. Also if you phone her back later it's likely the heat has gone out of the moment too so you might not get the full force of whatever sparked off her call. Please please don't feel guilty about stepping back, you have tried to help and support her but she's having none of it so it's her own look out. Start by being a good friend to yourself now!

Step back. Look after yourself. Give her the

Dementia Connect support line
0333 150 3456
Our dementia advisers are here for you.

www.alzheimers.org.uk/

Step back by all means. If he has just been diagnosed it is still very early days. If she does come again because he has been threatening just point out what could happen if he hit her. If he does hit her then tell her you will phone the police - he will most likely then be sectioned but at least something will be done. If he is not on medication he should see his GP. Also get her to ring the Alzheimer's Society for advice/ support. My late mother's friend was badly hit by her OH, who changed into a different person when he had Alzheimer's - he used to accuse her of having affairs/ seeing other men, and became argumentative. (they were both in their 80s. Eventually he had to go into a home.

You cannot support anyone without first seeing to your own welfare. Don’t feel guilty.

Notsooldat75, I would agree with people who have already posted that it is important for you to step back from this friendship and concentrate on looking after yourself and working your way through the feelings you have associated with your own recent bereavement. Grief presents in many stages or layers and you need the space and time to focus on your own well=being. It must be hard on you having someone you love and/or care about die and then have to deal with strong, negative and unpredictable reactions from someone with their own struggles. I think you have it right when you tell us she avoided you by 'giving you space' so therefore 'giving her space' is a logical option.

It sounds as though your friend runs to you after her husband gives her a hard time, then projects that hurt and anger on to you. Whilst friends may use each other as sounding boards at times, this is a two-way street. This woman is so wrapped up in everything going on in her life, her household, her relationship/marriage that maybe she cannot see how she is making you feel, how badly she is reacting to helpful, well-meaning suggestions and there is no reason you should just accept the snorting and eye rolling, as that wouldn't be a nice thing to do under any circumstances.

Maybe next time she turns up unannounced tell her it is not convenient - or drop a note through her door before this happens just explaining you need space for your own grief and understand she may need space for her issues! Say because you need time to adjust you are no longer able to entertain people at random and expect people to respect this by calling first to check it is convenient or that you don't already have plans in place if they don't have a prior agreement for a visit. Be firm though as it sounds like strong hints would fall on deaf ears.

When this woman is ready to tell family, ask for help, call in professionals or support organisations she may get that help and support but until then there's not a lot you can do without being her 'emotional punchbag'. She is responsible for her life and her decisions but they shouldn't make you miserable, anxious, depressed etc.

Please do take the time to care for yourself, to get any support you need, and spend time with people that care enough about you to provide support, shoulders for you to cry on, safe space to just sit, to have a cuppa, a socially-distanced walk etc. And if shielding or not seeing many people in the current Coronavirus climate, there is always Gransnet - for the most part I'd say this is a helpful and supportive forum and we can offer some moral support if nothing else. Best wishes, stay safe and take care of you

I agree with everyone who says Step back, look after yourself.
In the 60s (I think) there was a book called The Games People Play and it sounds as though she's playing "Aint It Awful". The only response is "Yep it's dreadful!" When you try to help she then switches to "Yes but", i.e. you expend a lot of energy and compassion making constructive suggestions and the pay off for her is that she knocks down all your ideas.
GOOD LUCK.

Yes you are doing the right thing. You have to protect yourself and your friend shouldn’t put onto you like this. Putting you down etc. Step right back and let her get on with it. If she asks why then tell her to her face that you have had enough and anyway she just doesn’t listen to your advice. Take care of yourself first. If all else fails then tell her to buggar off!!!

Notsooldat75 Yep, cut her loose. Or in her words 'giver her space'. You don't need that, you have your own sorrow to live through.

I have lots of sympathy for your friend as I looked after a close family member with Alzheimer’s it’s the hardest thing ever, but I also don’t think she should be putting what’s going on over to you, it’s very lonely looking after someone with dementia most ppl I found really don’t want to know, you are different so was being a good friend advising her to go to gp etc, and you are recently bereaved which is so hard to come to terms with too, you have def done the right thing in taking a step back, so I can see both sides, you don’t need this when you are trying to help her, I suggest she gets in touch with Alzheimer’s society who can help and advise,

Your friend needs professional help in addition to her husband. I am sure there must be support groups available or individual counseling. Might you kindly suggest as such to her since you have your own bereavement.

I think you're right Notsooldat75, if you're not available to run to, she might get help. Kwest suggested a really nice way of telling her this as she's a friend. You need to look after yourself though and not be a receptacle for her unhappiness. Also, how would you feel if he really hurt her? She needs to get professional help now, for both their sakes, before that happens so, yes, getting the information for her is a good idea but then tell her why you need to shut your door for a while.

Emily Harburn. Good idea to publish the contact details of the organisations that can help.
My sister's husband was diagnosed with Alzheimers almost 2 years ago and it has taken a long time for her to accept some of the realities of the condition for the carer.
Problem is, they live in France and although France has a good Dementia network, neither sister nor brother in law are fluent in French.
Because I volunteer with an Alzheimers singing group, I knew the very person that could help provided I could persuade my sister that a chat could be a plan. With her 'head in the sand' attitude I knew this would not be easy. However, she contacted my friend, who lost her husband to the disease about 8 months ago and a link has been established. Relief on my part.
Also the Alzheimers society have a free A5 paperback available about the condition plus other publications about caring for the carer which is crucial.
This latter is highly important, so I am aghast at the attitude of some of the posters who advise abandoning the poor woman. Bit more compassion, please, ladies!! She needs all the help she can get.
So, Notsooldat75, would it be possible to find someone who is experiencing the challenges that your neighbour is having? So that they might establish a helpful and productive link. She must be frightened and bewildered.
You might salvage your friendship too.

You have to take care of yourself, especially as it takes time to go through the aftermath of a bereavement.

Your friend needs to now take responsibility for her situation and access help available. Difficult for some people, but you are right to take a step back.

Is it only me that’s shocked by the “arriving at my doorstep” ??
What happened to social distancing?

You are perfectly in the right to put yourself first. Hopefully you will get in touch with a support group or even probably better she should have a private word with the Doctor. Take care.

If she’s online, you might point her to the Alzheimer’s Society Talking Point forum for carers of people with Alzheimer’s or any other form of dementia.

It’s been a lifeline for many, inc. me when I was sorely pressed,
you can let off steam there as much as you like to others who know exactly what it’s like. There aren’t often any easy answers, but whatever you’re going through, someone else will have been there.