Where have all the dads gone?

MissAdventure
How right you are.
What I really don’t understand though, is do these useless men not care at all about their children? Is their no bond? Aren’t they interested in how they’re doing at school, gymnastics, swimming?
The younger childrens father is completely useless, but not quite as bad. He has them over one day a week, but won’t help out anymore, even though he’s got nothing better to do.
I mean, shouldn’t he actually want to see them?
I just don’t get it.

A child isn't an opt in or out responsibility.
If you procreate and make a child, you have to provide for it.

Nothing should change that; not a new partner, arguments, inconvenience, or anything.

Urmstongran

^If the father didn't want a child in the first place and was told the girl was using contraception is it still his responsibility?^

? A condom would ensure he was in the driving seat so to speak. Affordable & in control springs to mind.

So no man should trust any woman? It's interesting but it isn't really what happens in relationships is it?
Doesn't the woman bear responsibility if she lied about the situation?

Pregnancy is always a risk where sexual activity is involved, along with chlamydia, HPV, and all kinds of other nasties.

Think I spelt the std wrong!

MissAdventure

A child isn't an opt in or out responsibility.
If you procreate and make a child, you have to provide for it.

Nothing should change that; not a new partner, arguments, inconvenience, or anything.

That's a wonderful theory unfortunately it doesn't always work in practice and it isn't always the dad's fault.
And the child suffers.

HPV is now recognised as a factor in cervical cancer and throat cancer.
A man owes it to his next partner not to put her at such a risk.

Of course, how is he even to know there will be a next partner?

Well, the women he has babies with is somehow supposed to know he isnt going to be sticking around.

I think I've made it clear that I understand that, trisher.

Again, there is no reason a child should suffer.

Both parents looking out for them, supporting them, loving them is enough, even if the parents are no longer together.

We once knew a man slightly, who always had this sob story about his wife taking his children out of the country, so that he hadn’t been able to see them for eight years.
One day it came up in conversation that they were actually in Cardiff!
I didn’t know whether to laugh or cry.

MissAdventure

HPV is now recognised as a factor in cervical cancer and throat cancer.
A man owes it to his next partner not to put her at such a risk.

Of course, how is he even to know there will be a next partner?

Well, the women he has babies with is somehow supposed to know he isnt going to be sticking around.

OK so if a man has sex with someone who has asked him to wear a condom and in the middle of the act he tears off the condom it is considered to be rape.
If a woman did the same thing what crime would she be committing?

Probably rape and all manner of other crimes.
All for the child benefit, guvnor!

trisher you really do not like women do you?

Some relationships just break down, too much too soon and it’s over.

There are some very good dads out there who co-parent.
As usual it’s only the bad-ens who get in the news…

MissAdventure

Probably rape and all manner of other crimes.
All for the child benefit, guvnor!

I don't think I ever claimed the woman needed benefits. There are some highly qualified professional women who decide they want a child but not a man. Some use a sperm donor, some just use a man. Is he then to be forced to pay for the child?

I couldn't possibly say.
Any man I've known to have sex have been more than willing.

I've never come across that scenario - presumably it's all worked out between the parties involved beforehand.

Actually, if he has willingly had unprotected sex and fathered a child, why shouldn't he pay?

The mothers living arrangements don't absolve his responsibility.

I had a married acquaintance ( former neighbour) who deliberately became pregnant, twice, after she had the 2 children her DH & she had " agreed" would be a good family. I was not surprised that relationship broke down & that he begrudged paying maintenance for two children he had not really agreed to..I think he might have been OK with no 3 but no. 4 was pushing her luck.. I know he could have insisted on condoms but she told him she was on a " better" pill after no. 3! She happily told me it was deliberate. Not sure where she is now but heard through the grapevine that she is in much reduced circumstances. Kids all adults..all also reliant on some support. She had a professional qualification but single parent with 4 children...hardcto hold down a job.

GrannyGravy13

trisher you really do not like women do you?

Some relationships just break down, too much too soon and it’s over.

There are some very good dads out there who co-parent.
As usual it’s only the bad-ens who get in the news…

GG13 I seldom post personal experiences but actually knowing what goes on in the real world has absolutely nothing to do with liking or disliking women. It's simply a question of knowing that not all relationship break downs and estrangements are the fault of the man. Some are orchestrated and run by women, which they have a perfect right to do. Knowing that and realising that one of the real problems with that is women's lack of real equality in pay is not "disliking women" anymore than those who post disparaging comments about dads is "disliking men."

Grannygravy
Yes of course, there are some really good dads out there, and some are treated pretty poorly by their childrens mothers, I know some who have gone to enormous lengths to maintain contact.
But there is no question that a lot of men can simply walk away, I don’t know if they will have regrets when it’s all too late.

Of course, "they", whoever "they" are, do say that everyone is only 2 paychecks away from being sucked into a life of poverty.
Even professionals.

With the csa, I think they went after the easy targets - men who were already paying towards their children.
Although all but £5, I think, was taken from benefits to account for it.
A lot of men who were already paying a fair bit were themselves put into poverty.

Others paid nothing, and it all was a horrible mess.

My daughter spoke to a lady from the CSA, she took loads of information, was very helpful and sympathetic to my daughters situation.
She never heard another word about it and certainly no money was forthcoming
About ten years ago when she tried, they basically told her you can’t get blood out of a stone.

Also, if the absent parent then goes on to have a new family, is there any point in taking money from them, and then having to then pay benefits because they've not enough to live on?
It's something that needs a proper procedure in place.
Perhaps people wouldn't then go on to have more children (or so many of them) if they know they would absolutely be paying for the original children.

If a young person has not experienced a supportive & 'unconditional' love from parent/s it will be hard to know what that feels & looks like in practice.
Many young women, unrealistically, seek that unconditional love from a baby.... they hope the father will stay because of the child & they often do..but only until the novelty wears off & the reality of 24/7 care for another human is too much responsibility. It is hard enough for parents who have gone into parenthood with eyes wide open!
There is often lack of aspirations in the mix too and almost guaranteed poverty in the young parents family home.

I changed jobs at one point, and a condition of "being better in work", or whatever the soundbite of that time, was that you had to allow the CSA to contact the absent parent.

Again, lots more upset and upheaval was caused for lots of people, and I wasnt exactly popular, and i wasnt better off in work, anyway.

The csa closed down my case, and said that unless my ex volunteered to pay, they couldn't make him.

Oh God, this thread is, with a few notable realistic exceptions, so depressing. Someone starts a thread asking why some Fathers don't contribute to raising their children, and despite true stories of how some people's daughters have been let down by the Father of their children, there are still a disappointing few who churn out the same ignorant crap nonsense about the Mothers. I can't be bothered to correct all the fairy stories, but I believe that now, you only get benefit for the first two children ( so why 'churn' out 8?), housing is not awarded as a prize for getting pregnant for a start. Even if there are feckless Mothers, and I am sure there are because there always have been, even in the 'good old days', surely nobody wishes the children to be singled out, made to suffer because of their irresponsible parents? or maybe some of you do, the same ones who would see the coastguard puncture inflatable dinghies at Dover. Shameful, truly shameful

I agree GillT57

I also think that we need young people in this country, we should be encouraging people to have more children, especially after brexit.